Initial Draft Readings for Pacific Energy Summit LE Insert - Cause for Concern?

[brenndatomu]

Any suggestions on how to remedy the tube melting are appreciated.

Instead of a barbed fitting, get a compression fitting, then use a piece of automotive brake line, or copper tubing to attach to the compression fitting...a piece long enough to get out past the stove will solve the heat issues for you.

 

[bholler]

After finally locating what is referred to as boost air (thank you @begreen ) I was able to plug the port via method I found on another thread. I misunderstood boost air to simply be the controllable primary inlet.

It appears that blocking the boost air makes a significant change in performance. While yesterday flu temps reached around 850 while cruising, temps with the boost air port blocked were around 550 when cruising. That's really huge. It ran fully choked primary lever, as well as the damper closed, to achieve these lower numbers.

You will see from the picture the fire behaves very differently, and had very little secondary burn compared to yesterday's fire. I'm not sure if this is an issue or not. The fire seemed to creep along slowly, even some white smoke covering at the bottom of the firebox. One might extrapolate much longer burns with this approach. Since it's all new I'm not sure if this is dialed too far back.

I could not take many draft readings (see issue below) , but the two I could get were oddly similar to yesterday, 0.14in-col. perhaps the draft remains the same but it is coming through the secondary air port, I believe Pacific Energy calls it EBT. So while the draft numbers were the same performance seem very different.

Face temperatures with boost air plugged were 100 cooler, 450ish. Another improvement.

Another change I made was mounting the flush mounted static pressure fitting on the flu pipe. This created a problem either because it is directly mounted and there is heat transfer, or the type of metal. It was such great heat transfer to the fitting that the heat resistant tubing melted. Limiting my ability to take readings on draft. Any suggestions on how to remedy the tube melting are appreciated.

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Great results. Just don't forget that closing the boost air didn't actually fix the draft issue. You still have excessive draft just not nearly as bad as previously. So you are going to need to keep your door adjusted well and your gaskets in very good shape. That isn't a big deal but it will be a bit more important for you.

 

[davidmsem]

Instead of a barbed fitting, get a compression fitting, then use a piece of automotive brake line, or copper tubing to attach to the compression fitting...a piece long enough to get out past the stove will solve the heat issues for you.

Thank you. I was looking at brake line this evening at AutoZone. I know what you mean by a compression fitting in that it accepts the flared end of the tube and compresses it. Will look at auto supply to see if I can set something up.

Good idea and I thank you

 

[davidmsem]

Great results. Just don't forget that closing the boost air didn't actually fix the draft issue. You still have excessive draft just not nearly as bad as previously. So you are going to need to keep your door adjusted well and your gaskets in very good shape. That isn't a big deal but it will be a bit more important for you.

Understand. Thank you so much for getting me this far. Man this has been a long haul to get it correct!

One reason I liked the Pacific energy summit was the piercing gasket.

I'll report back when the season gets going.

Very very grateful for your support and the folks here.

 

[brenndatomu]

Thank you. I was looking at brake line this evening at AutoZone. I know what you mean by a compression fitting in that it accepts the flared end of the tube and compresses it. Will look at auto supply to see if I can set something up.

Good idea and I thank you

That's a flared fitting...not the same as a compression, which is much simpler to make up...slide the nut and ferrule on the tubing and tighten the nut...done. Can easily remove the tubing and put it back on too.

Here is a flared fitting...

 

[davidmsem]

That's a flared fitting...not the same as a compression, which is much simpler to make up...slide the nut and ferrule on the tubing and tighten the nut...done. Can easily remove the tubing and put it back on too.
View attachment 299948
Here is a flared fitting...
View attachment 299949

Beyond grateful. This is awesome. I removed the barbed fitting this morning.

Will report back. Thank you so much for the images and taking time to do that.

 

[davidmsem]

That's a flared fitting...not the same as a compression, which is much simpler to make up...slide the nut and ferrule on the tubing and tighten the nut...done. ....

Done. Thank you for the education. Hearth.com has been an amazing resource for me

 

[BurningBrutus]

I have a PE super insert, I was having the same issue brand new, could not choke it down for the life of me, running over 850 at times all the way closed down. I read about the mod to be able to close the damper even more, after I did that, was very simple, it was a whole new stove. I can close it down so far that the fire will go out. I have total control over the stove now. Not sure if your insert has same design, if so do the mod, your problems will be solved.

 

[davidmsem]

I have a PE super insert, I was having the same issue brand new, could not choke it down for the life of me, running over 850 at times all the way closed down. I read about the mod to be able to close the damper even more, after I did that, was very simple, it was a whole new stove. I can close it down so far that the fire will go out. I have total control over the stove now. Not sure if your insert has same design, if so do the mod, your problems will be solved.

Boost air is plugged Amherst Ma is a sweet area this time of year!

 

[begreen]

I have a PE super insert, I was having the same issue brand new, could not choke it down for the life of me, running over 850 at times all the way closed down. I read about the mod to be able to close the damper even more, after I did that, was very simple, it was a whole new stove. I can close it down so far that the fire will go out. I have total control over the stove now. Not sure if your insert has same design, if so do the mod, your problems will be solved.

If problems persist we will discuss that option. It was pointed out last spring that this might be necessary, but maybe not based on the last tests?

 

[Hogwildz]

Can you share the damper set up & parts you used?

 

[davidmsem]

Can you share the damper set up & parts you used?

Hogz! Long time man. Hope you are well and appreciate all your help when I was getting going 7 years ago.

I purchased 6-in damper off of Amazon. As you know the actual diameter is 5.5 in. I purchased some sheet metal at home Depot and cut it in circles and put on sheet on each side of the damper and bolted the two sheets together over the damper.

I cut the handle off the damper, and welded it to a threaded rod connector. The threaded rod connector is just gotten at home Depot. Then I screwed threaded rod into that connector. At the other end closer to the face I put another threaded rod connector, but this one had different thread sizes on each side. That was to accommodate the door knob that I also got at home Depot. I think I did 3/8 rod. There was a difference between the door knob thread in the threaded rod, one was coarse one was fine or something like that.

McMaster has some really awesome stuff and I was able to find threaded rod connectors with different size threads on each end.
https://www.mcmaster.com/

Hope this was enough of a description for you please ask any other questions you were always so helpful to me when I was starting.

 

[davidmsem]

Can you share the damper set up & parts you used?

This is a good picture that should go with the description. But two nuts in the middle of the rod I did not need but put there for back tightening.

 

[davidmsem]

Well like all the other aspects of this job it took longer than expected but I finally got around to installing the custom surround. Folks told me I was crazy when I was going to have three quarter inch steel used. Found a local laser cutting shop that cut it. Of all the things on this job I was worried about this was the worry bead. When I went to install it it fit absolutely perfectly and dropped into place. I did this for my wife who wanted a really clean look and not block any brick so it is inside the opening. It should not rattle with the weight.

8 months after my unit failed I think my install is complete. I still wish @bholler took me up on my offer to come do this install. I cannot tell you how many hours I have spent on this. I would be fired on the first day if this was my job.

I think the door knob actually looks really good and custom and it functions quite well. Gets a little hot but it doesn't change positions often.

 

[stoveliker]

That looks great. That door knob too!

 

[Todd]

Nice work!

 

[begreen]

That finished out nicely. Will the steel get painted? If not, it may rust over time.

 

[moresnow]

And another rather custom install comes to fruition. Keep updating this thread. We are watching

 

[davidmsem]

That finished out nicely. Will the steel get painted? If not, it may rust over time.

I did tell the misses that and she really liked the rugged look and the rust kind of matches the bricks she said. 35 years I've learned to do as instructed. I'm just the labor and do as told. Takes a smart man to be the stupid.

 

[Hogwildz]

Looks great! Thanks for the info. Might do something like that here.

 

[bholler]

I did tell the misses that and she really liked the rugged look and the rust kind of matches the bricks she said. 35 years I've learned to do as instructed. I'm just the labor and do as told. Takes a smart man to be the stupid.

I would hit it with high temp clear satin at some point to prevent further rusting

 

[davidmsem]

I would hit it with high temp clear satin at some point to prevent further rusting

That is a great idea. I'll look to see if I can find any.

 

[bholler]

That is a great idea. I'll look to see if I can find any.

Auto parts stores usually have it. I use it quite a bit when restoring old stoves to maintain the patina but protect it as well

 

[davidmsem]

I have a PE super insert, I was having the same issue brand new, could not choke it down for the life of me, running over 850 at times all the way closed down. I read about the mod to be able to close the damper even more, after I did that, was very simple, it was a whole new stove. I can close it down so far that the fire will go out. I have total control over the stove now. Not sure if your insert has same design, if so do the mod, your problems will be solved.

On the design of my unit, the controllable primary air lever does indeed control and close fully primary air. What I was misunderstanding was there is an additional source of air called boost air in these forums. Locating and plugging the boost air hole was the key for me.

 

[begreen]

The primary air on modern stoves does not close down 100%. It will always admit a little air, this is to prevent smoldering the fire.