2015/2016 VC Owners thread

[Charles1981]

Ive always been in the habit of raking the coals forward at each reload to help the new wood light off quickly. That always dumps all the ash into the pan. Maybe I should stop doing that?

I rake the coals a bit forward but with the main goal of rake the ash buildup away from the air intake holes that lead to the catalyst chamber (2N1 setup). I usually push a good amount of just pure coals back into this spot after I clear the ash from there.

 

[Woody Stover]

Next is to control the variables.

The last time I tried adjusting the cat air valve on my Dutchwest 2460, a couple years back, it didn't seem to do much. Thinking back, that cat had several years on it. I just left it 1/2 turn open after that. Now, with the new Woodstock 6 x 2" steel cat I have in there, the cat air seems to have a bit more effect. I played with it a bit last night. Early in the burn when there's a lot for the cat to feed on, it seemed to brighten a bit when I set the air 3/4 turn open. Later in the burn I cut it back to 1/2 turn open and it didn't change the glow much. If I opened it 1.5 turns early in the burn, "secondary" flames ignited right where the fountain was feeding in the air, below the cat. I don't think that constitutes "flame impingement" on the cat, but I think I will avoid it anyway. I also thought that maybe adjusting the cat air might help me get a quicker light-off, but the jury is still out on that.
Something I noticed on my Woodstock stoves was that if I opened up the air early in the load and had flame in the box, the smoke sometimes seemed to move through the cat too fast, and the cat couldn't catch it all....I could see a slight amount of smoke out the stack. The adjustable cat air on the Dutchwest might be a way to compensate for this so that it can be run with more air, and still burn clean. The manual says open the cat air more at higher burn rates. The goal of a cleaner burn at higher burn rates is no doubt why Woodstock has thermostatically-controlled cat air on their steel stoves. I don't ever run very much air; At most, there might be a small amount of lazy flame in the box.

 

[jharkin]

Ive been home a few days during the (for us a non-event) storm and have had the stove going since Thursday. I tried adjusting my operating habits again based on your suggestions.

This time I tried to not rake th coals any more than necessary so keep a good bed of ash in the firebox. I see a definite change. Its holding coals better on extended burns and the cat temps do seem a bit less likely to spike on big loads.

Another change I made... typically in mild weather I stretch the loads out as much as possible to let the room temps drop a couple degrees (maybe down to 72 or 73 in stove room) before reloading so that the burst of heat doesn't get things too hot in here (would shoot up to 75-76 once the new load is cranking). By then the cat might drop to 600 and there are little coals. This weekend Ive been reloading earlier and Im finding with a big coal bed I can put a full load in and get it shut down and on the cat much faster and often before hte entire load is charred.. sometimes in 10min or less. the result is that the cat temps are less likely to spike and we get a lot more even heat which keeps the rest of the house consistently around 69-70. It was counter intuitive but it seems to work.


I think my season might come to an early end though, temps in the 40s and near 50s forecasted in the next couple weeks and then we are into the feb/mar warmup pattern. I'm a weekend burner so probably only a couple more weekends of light burning left. If that hold out Im going to come out of this season with less than a cord used, unbelievable.

 

[Diabel]

I think my season might come to an early end though, temps in the 40s and near 50s forecasted in the next couple weeks and then we are into the feb/mar warmup pattern. I'm a weekend burner so probably only a couple more weekends of light burning left. If that hold out Im going to come out of this season with less than a cord used, unbelievable.

Funny that you say this. I was just thinking...I am about past half way of the burning season.

 

[Reckless]

Funny that you say this. I was just thinking...I am about past half way of the burning season.

For sure the least amount of wood I've ever used.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Ive been home a few days during the (for us a non-event) storm and have had the stove going since Thursday. I tried adjusting my operating habits again based on your suggestions.

This time I tried to not rake th coals any more than necessary so keep a good bed of ash in the firebox. I see a definite change. Its holding coals better on extended burns and the cat temps do seem a bit less likely to spike on big loads.

Another change I made... typically in mild weather I stretch the loads out as much as possible to let the room temps drop a couple degrees (maybe down to 72 or 73 in stove room) before reloading so that the burst of heat doesn't get things too hot in here (would shoot up to 75-76 once the new load is cranking). By then the cat might drop to 600 and there are little coals. This weekend Ive been reloading earlier and Im finding with a big coal bed I can put a full load in and get it shut down and on the cat much faster and often before hte entire load is charred.. sometimes in 10min or less. the result is that the cat temps are less likely to spike and we get a lot more even heat which keeps the rest of the house consistently around 69-70. It was counter intuitive but it seems to work.


I think my season might come to an early end though, temps in the 40s and near 50s forecasted in the next couple weeks and then we are into the feb/mar warmup pattern. I'm a weekend burner so probably only a couple more weekends of light burning left. If that hold out Im going to come out of this season with less than a cord used, unbelievable.

Interesting finds. I was starting to wonder if starting to shut down to fast on reloads would cause the cat to run off in hyper mode due to the initial gasing of the wood.

 

[Woody Stover]

Interesting finds. I was starting to wonder if starting to shut down to fast on reloads would cause the cat to run off in hyper mode due to the initial gasing of the wood.

Not sure about your downdraft model, but I would guess not. The longer you wait to cut the air, the more wood will be gassing. If that's the case, then yes, you may have to run some flame for a while until you can slow the gassing down, or the cat may go high. I found the same thing as jharkin; Reloading on too small a coal bed, it takes longer to get enough wood gassing, and to get the stove temp up.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Hey guys. I need to re gasket the doors on my encore. I have a question about the right door. does anyone run rope up the latch side? I know there is gasket on the left door but there seems to be a weak spot at the bottom of the doors where they meet. Any thoughts?

 

[tupelo]

Question on Vermont Casting Encore 2550 primary air control.

My stove's right side lever controlling the primary air no longer adjusts the primary air.
The regulator has been fine for the last 10 years.
Something is now disconnected or broken.
Maybe it's a wire, maybe more.
It looks like I need to remove the right-side interior plate, called "Right Air Plate (Inner side)" , to examine the lever backside, called "Thermostat Assembly".

--> If I need to look at the "primary air regulatory system" underneath the floor of the stove, will I have to take apart the rest of the interior plates of the stove apart to get at it?

Thanks in advance for comments and experiences.

I'm referencing the 2550 manual, page 34 onward, copy at
http://www.appliancefactoryparts.com/content/pdfs/171411-1.pdf

Potential parts: (diagram #)
(#39) Thermostat Assy 5005470
(#43) Primary Air Regulatory System 5000337

Not likely parts: (#42)
Primary Air Frame 1307411
Primary Air Valve Only 1307412
Primary Air Rod Only 1601493

 

[tupelo]

I have a question about the right door. does anyone run rope up the latch side?

No, just the left door. There is a metal flange on the left side of the right door that presses into the gasket on the left door.

 

[Reckless]

Hey guys. I need to re gasket the doors on my encore. I have a question about the right door. does anyone run rope up the latch side? I know there is gasket on the left door but there seems to be a weak spot at the bottom of the doors where they meet. Any thoughts?

I tried that a couple years ago and it leaked, now I just stick to the book and seems to work out with no leaks.

 

[Reckless]

Question on Vermont Casting Encore 2550 primary air control.

My stove's right side lever controlling the primary air no longer adjusts the primary air.
The regulator has been fine for the last 10 years.
Something is now disconnected or broken.
Maybe it's a wire, maybe more.
It looks like I need to remove the right-side interior plate, called "Right Air Plate (Inner side)" , to examine the lever backside, called "Thermostat Assembly".

--> If I need to look at the "primary air regulatory system" underneath the floor of the stove, will I have to take apart the rest of the interior plates of the stove apart to get at it?

Thanks in advance for comments and experiences.

I'm referencing the 2550 manual, page 34 onward, copy at
http://www.appliancefactoryparts.com/content/pdfs/171411-1.pdf

Potential parts: (diagram #)
(#39) Thermostat Assy 5005470
(#43) Primary Air Regulatory System 5000337

Not likely parts: (#42)
Primary Air Frame 1307411
Primary Air Valve Only 1307412
Primary Air Rod Only 1601493

Can you see the wire attached to the primary air flap in the rear of the stove (maybe came loose)? Removing the right inside wall will give you a good indication of where it broke. There is no way to actually see the wire that travels under/through the stove (would require a complete tear down) but the wire can be change pretty easily without a tear down. If the break is out of site you can probably snake the new one with a thinner coat hanger or a flexible snake.

*found some pics of my full tear down last year

 

[RandyBoBandy]

I tried that a couple years ago and it leaked, now I just stick to the book and seems to work out with no leaks.

Thanks reckless. i can currently see fire through a small hole were the gasket channels meet on the bottom of the doors.

 

[Reckless]

Thanks reckless. i can currently see fire through a small hole were the gasket channels meet on the bottom of the doors.

Are the doors properly aligned? Is the seam even top to bottom? Also make sure when you gasket the door to leave it loose and not pull it tight as I have made that mistake and had a door leak. If all above is correct then I would need a picture to try and help further.

 

[trispad]

Hey All,

I have a Defiant 2n1 with an 8" flue collar and a DuraVent double wall 8" oval to 6" adapter. If I put my hand behind the connection of the flue collar and the adapter I can feel air getting sucked in when the stove is running. Do any of you have suggestions for sealing it up? Given that it is double wall I cannot get at the connection to put some gasket in there. Maybe disassemble the flue collar to access the under side? I might be able to reach through the damper and put some furnace cement on the connection but will not be able to see what I am doing. Thoughts?

 

[RandyBoBandy]

I have to say the right door has a very slight sag if anything. I am assuming it is much easier to gasket the doors off of the stove or am I wrong about this?

Are the doors properly aligned? Is the seam even top to bottom? Also make sure when you gasket the door to leave it loose and not pull it tight as I have made that mistake and had a door leak. If all above is correct then I would need a picture to try and help further.

 

[Reckless]

Yes MUCH easier to do the gasketing with the doors off.

A slight sag would explain the gap, no? Loosen the door a little but not enough to move on its own and muscle it into place and tighten it back down.

 

[Woody Stover]

If I put my hand behind the connection of the flue collar and the adapter I can feel air getting sucked in when the stove is running. Do any of you have suggestions for sealing it up? Given that it is double wall I cannot get at the connection to put some gasket in there.

Is your draft still OK, no smoke roll-out when opening the door or anything? Stove responds to air input? Still, sounds like a substantial leak if you can feel it.

 

[trispad]

Is your draft still OK, no smoke roll-out when opening the door or anything? Stove responds to air input? Still, sounds like a substantial leak if you can feel it.

Draft seems OK. Smoke does not roll out, but it is really easy to crash the cat when shutting the air down. At full open the cat can be at 1200+ and I shut the air by 1/4 and the cat will drop to 1050.

 

[Woody Stover]

Draft seems OK. Smoke does not roll out, but it is really easy to crash the cat when shutting the air down. At full open the cat can be at 1200+ and I shut the air by 1/4 and the cat will drop to 1050.

The cat will continue to burn smoke, even if it isn't glowing, down to around 500 degrees. On the Dutchwest I run the air barely cracked once I've burned in a new load, and the cat will be up around 1200 but that's a different stove; I've never run a 2n1...

 

[Woody Stover]

Zkx14 Nice job on the re-build! https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/dutchwest-xl-2462-rebuild.151340/

Been working on improving starts to reduce smoke till the cat kicks in. Top down lighting has proven to be most of the answer. Now, I am trying different stacking. Tonight was my 3rd go at it. Most important to me is when my fan turns on, because that's when I'm really warming the house. The fan comes on automatically when the thermal switch closes as the stove warms.
All hardwood (mostly oak) except for a few pieces of broken up 2x6. Pics are just after light off and at about 40 minutes. By second pic, the fan was on and the cat was burning.

Yep, I love the top-down start but if it's cold out I'm usually lighting off the coals to keep the heat coming...no back-up heat here. If there's not a lot of coals, I'll sometimes just shove the coals to the back, put a couple big splits back there, and still do a top-down start in the front of the box. If there are more coals I might pull them forward and just put a couple small splits on and flame them up to raise the stove temp a bit before I pack the box and get that rolling. The kindling is burning pretty clean, and hopefully I can get closer to the temps I need with a clean burn. Once I load I'll try to keep the flame in the front of the stove, hoping it will heat up the top/cat faster that the whole load smoldering underneath, which is blowing a lot of smoke but not getting the stove hot very fast. Not sure how much difference that is making?
Looks like you have the air open a bit in the second pic; Is that your final air setting or were you just keeping a bit of flame in the box until the cat got going good? Your air settings are probably going to be more open since you are venting into the 7 x 11 clay liner, but the interior chimney is probably helping your draft a bit. I've got a 6" liner all the way up so I cut the air to almost zero once the cat is cranking good, with maybe small intermittent flame in the box.
I know you have the cat probe, and monitor firebox temp on the door. What temps do you look for before closing the bypass? When you close it, how long until the cat takes off? When my cat catches good, the probe will rise about 100 degrees a minute. I usually close the bypass when the cat probe is at about minus 200 (I have the Woodstock round steel cat in there) and the stove top meter, which I have behind the probe, is 275-300.

 

[Zkx14]

Still getting used to this new mesh type cat. Does not seam to react like the honeycombs. More gradual increase. I havent seen the light off and quick rise. Somewhere around 800 or above, I can see a glow if I look up through the baffle. Highest I saw so far was around 1150. Also, my probe works, but I am not confident that it reads right. The cat info said it will fire above 380. I try to get the probe to 500, or 400 on the side before closing bypass. What did you mean by 'minus 200' on your probe? I do close the air down to about 1/4" opening once its rolling good. I get great draft most of the time. Only time it seams a little weak is if its too warm /damp outside. If anything its the opposite. When really cold outside I need to be careful not to overfire as it is like a vacuum up the chimney. 6" would be too small for this. Manual calls for 8 round into 8x8 square. Since the clay liner corners are rounded, thats probably about 60sq in. And my 7x 11 is more like 73 sq. so not that much oversized.

 

[Woody Stover]

Still getting used to this new mesh type cat. Does not seam to react like the honeycombs. More gradual increase. I havent seen the light off and quick rise. Somewhere around 800 or above, I can see a glow if I look up through the baffle. Highest I saw so far was around 1150. Also, my probe works, but I am not confident that it reads right.

I've got that 'brillo-pad' cat in my SIL's 2460 but haven't run her stove much; I'm interested to hear your reports on it.

What did you mean by 'minus 200' on your probe?

When the stove top meter I have behind the cat probe is up near 300, the probe is still below the "0" line on the dial, about as far below zero as 200 is above zero, and this Woodstock steel cat will glow in about a minute after I close the bypass. The probe is reading OK I think; I just put it in last year. It generally goes to 1100-1200 or so about a half-hour into the burn, and will stay over 1000 for a few hours.
Yep, the 2462 is 8", the 2460 is 6" and I think the 2461 is 6 as well.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Hey guys. Should there be refractory cement between the refactor you box and the cover with the three drywall screws. Plus can I use the cement to repair the cat cover. It is falling apart. I need to do a replacement but I'm just going to limp to the finish line this season. It hasn't been very cold and march is around the corner.

 

[Diabel]

If the cover is in two pieces, what I did was pin it together along with blobs of cement. Use stainless steel nails and cut the tips so you can easily slide the nails into the refractory material.