new Vapor Fire 100 with very poor heat

[brenndatomu]

I was thinking of buying this for it...

(broken link removed to https://www.woodlanddirect.com/6-Easy-Flex-Pre-Insulated-Chimney-Liner#252Lengths:20)'

If you look at that question answer part they say it's 7 3/8 outside diameter. Do you think that would go down my 8in chimney?

Yes, excellent choice! You will need a tee/snout kit for it on the bottom, and a mounting plate/cap for the top.
I used pre-insulated liner for my little Drolet insert stove in the fireplace...love it!
I would think you can work that down your 8" flue...as long as they didn't glob the mortar on in between the tile joint too heavily. If they did you may be able to drop a heavy chunk of steel down the flue on a rope and break it off.
You can test for clearance by running a length (2'?) of 7.5" OD pipe down the flue to test the clearances...use a pipe, or something a little longer like that so that it checks for offsets caused by mortar sticking out on one side, then the other side on the next joint...if that makes sense...

 

[brenndatomu]

it never moves unless it's really windy outside

Well there you go then...that seals the deal...no draft. Mine is open/flapping even on a warmer day

I guess before jumping to conclusions...where is the weight on your baro set? The outside edge of it should be lined up somewhere between the 4 and the 6...look close, the numbers are stamped lightly into where the weight mounts...that is just a preliminary setting, but will get you into the ballpark. If the weight is slide clear back, the setting may be higher than your draft ever gets, so it never opens...

And it should be mentioned that a outside chimney is no good unless it's insulated!

Or at least mentioned that there is a strong possibilty that it won't work...because they do...sometimes.
But an insulated 6" round flue will always draft better, and stay cleaner than an oversize square (rectangle) masonry one will...

 

[brenndatomu]

Another liner option...they make it easy to build your whole kit...didn't see that option on the other one...I'm sure they have the parts though, probably have to call them.

Pre Insulated Chimney Liner Kit | Insulated Flexible Chimney Liner Kit - Rockford Chimney

Free shipping on Pre Insulated flexible chimney liner kits. The Pre Insulated chimney liner is UL Listed & features 1/2" insulation to keep flue gases hot.

www.rockfordchimneysupply.com

 

[gary38532]

I guess before jumping to conclusions...where is the weight on your baro set? The outside edge of it should be lined up somewhere between the 4 and the 6...look close, the numbers are stamped lightly into where the weight mounts...that is just a preliminary setting, but will get you into the ballpark. If the weight is slide clear back, the setting may be higher than your draft ever gets, so it never opens...
Or at least mentioned that there is a strong possibilty that it won't work...because they do...sometimes.
But an insulated 6" round flue will always draft better, and stay cleaner than an oversize square (rectangle) masonry one will...

It remains shut and rock still reguardless of where the weight is placed I've in all possible positions at one time or another it's on 6 currently

 

[maple1]

I didnt see it mentioned (unless I overlooked), so I will be 'that guy'. Since it is the number 1 thing to rule out in all wood heating issues.

Are you sure your wood is dry?

It does sound and look like there are likely chimney draft issues though.

 

[gary38532]

I didnt see it mentioned (unless I overlooked), so I will be 'that guy'. Since it is the number 1 thing to rule out in all wood heating issues.

Are you sure your wood is dry?

It does sound and look like there are likely chimney draft issues though.

Yes 20% on fresh split with a meter

 

[woodey]

Are you checking the MC . of your wood on the ends or the middle of a newly split piece?

 

[gary38532]

Another liner option...they make it easy to build your whole kit...didn't see that option on the other one...I'm sure they have the parts though, probably have to call them.

Pre Insulated Chimney Liner Kit | Insulated Flexible Chimney Liner Kit - Rockford Chimney

Free shipping on Pre Insulated flexible chimney liner kits. The Pre Insulated chimney liner is UL Listed & features 1/2" insulation to keep flue gases hot.

www.rockfordchimneysupply.com

I got a chimney company coming to look at today. I'll keep this in mind if it doesn't work out.

 

[gary38532]

Are you checking the MC . of your wood on the ends or the middle of a newly split piece?

Fresh split

 

[brenndatomu]

I got a chimney company coming to look at today. I'll keep this in mind if it doesn't work out.

And they claim their's is 7.25" OD too...that extra 1/8" may make the difference!

 

[gary38532]

And they claim there's is 7.25" OD too...that extra 1/8" may make the difference!

Yes haha

 

[JRHAWK9]

And it should be mentioned that a outside chimney is no good unless it's insulated!

That's not always the case though. Some people do fine with an uninsulated outside chimney, I know Stihly Dan has one but it's also taller and I believe the proper size (6"). You have the worst combination possible. 100% outside, short, larger than 6" and completely uninsulated.

 

[gary38532]

That's not always the case though. Some people do fine with an uninsulated outside chimney, I know Stihly Dan has one but it's also taller and I believe the proper size (6"). You have the worst combination possible. 100% outside, short, larger than 6" and completely uninsulated.

I know it, I hope it's better when I get the liner installed. It could have been ran through the house. The previous owners did it not me. I have a fire place in my kitchen with the flue going through the middle of the house and it doesn't need any heat to draft.

 

[KC Matt]

Another liner option...they make it easy to build your whole kit...didn't see that option on the other one...I'm sure they have the parts though, probably have to call them.

Pre Insulated Chimney Liner Kit | Insulated Flexible Chimney Liner Kit - Rockford Chimney

Free shipping on Pre Insulated flexible chimney liner kits. The Pre Insulated chimney liner is UL Listed & features 1/2" insulation to keep flue gases hot.

www.rockfordchimneysupply.com

That's where I got the liner for my insert. It's a 6" non insulated in a tight flue and I had decided that if it didn't work well I'd add vermiculite but there's no need. They have a pull head that makes dragging an insulated liner through a tight lane pretty easy and they sell a cable like cover that saves the insulation.


I have an old Tundra 1 and it does a great job heating my old dump. A Kuuma is 1000x better than what I have. One thing is for sure, in this case the install is the problem. That chimney is consuming the exhaust heat and killing the draft. Put in a stainless 6" liner in that flue and the Kuuma will work flawlessly. Add vermiculite for insulation if you want. There may be other tweaks you could make but that stone chimney is what's killing your furnace.

 

[brenndatomu]

Add vermiculite for insulation if you want.

Chimney pros will poo poo on that idea...there is no way to make sure the liner is centered so that it has X inches of insulation all the way around it...or if it does, that it wont move later on...so it wont pass code inspection then, in places that have that.
Plus I guess the stuff has a tendancy to find any little hole...and flow into it.
Also, a major mess if you ever have to do chimney work.

 

[KC Matt]

I know it, I hope it's better when I get the liner installed. It could have been ran through the house. The previous owners did it not me. I have a fire place in my kitchen with the flue going through the middle of the house and it doesn't need any heat to draft.

Your Kuuma will work much better with the liner. That's the best wood furnace on the market and people like me are heating with far inferior appliances.

Check out this pull head. (broken link removed to https://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/chimney-tool-rental-information/chimney-liner-pulling-cone-rental.php)

Get that and pull an insulated liner with the mesh over it. Call those guys, they will take care of you. Add 5' more than you measure your chimney. Mine took 4' more than I measured so I cut off 1 foot of the "extra" 5 feet.

 

[brenndatomu]

Add 5' more than you measure your chimney. Mine took 4' more than I measured so I cut off 1 foot of the "extra" 5 feet.

Sounds like you forgot to calibrate the tape before you measured...

 

[KC Matt]

Sounds like you forgot to calibrate the tape before you measured...

I measured the outside of the house... from the ground pushing a fatmax up. Good thing I added 5'.....

 

[gary38532]

Unfortunately none of these options will work. The inside diameter of the chimney pipe is 6 7/8. I'm not convinced about the furnace either it's 61 in the house right now. The vapor fire was on all night long. Fixing the draft would have to give me +14 degrees and I just don't see that happening.

 

[brenndatomu]

Isn't this about where you were when you started out with your VF100 @JRHAWK9 ?
I know I was extremely frustrated with my Tundra furnace when I put it in some years back...it came this close to leaving, unceremoniously! Kept after it though, and got it working well...until lil miss Kuuma came along and tempted me

 

[brenndatomu]

How tall is your chimney again?
I think you still have the option of pulling in a bare SS liner...that would still run warmer than the masonry does...masonry is just a big heat sink.
The other thing I was thinking is just put up a standard class A SS chimney right next to your existing. Menards sells Supervent very reasonable...I've used it for several people with great results. The whole chimney was only about $600 when my in-laws built their new house. Yours would be a bit more maybe, but I bet well under a grand still...that's with using Supervent and DIY. A stove shop or chimney sweep would charge much more I'm sure...and have to install "their premium brand" no doubt...

 

[brenndatomu]

Also, have you ever tried cracking a basement window open a bit? Wondering if your house is too tight to allow makeup air in? I doubt this is it, but easy enough to try.
Do you ever get smoke smell in the house?
That would be the classic "too tight" house symptom...

 

[Mrpelletburner]

Amazon has that Dwyer I listed above... Get it.

I apologize if you already posted, what did you get for a measurement? Can you post a photo of where you are taking the measurement?

Are you measuring the internal flue temperature?

 

[gary38532]

I apologize if you already posted, what did you get for a measurement? Can you post a photo of where you are taking the measurement?

Are you measuring the internal flue temperature?

Its going to be here today I'll let you know when I do

 

[Mrpelletburner]

Its going to be here today I'll let you know when I do

Awesome....

I have an un-insulated 6” SS liner... zero draft issues. Before installing the liner, I could not get the stack to draft properly.