new Vapor Fire 100 with very poor heat

[JRHAWK9]

Idk what that is

HDD's...

Use:
KBGM: BINGHAMTON REGIONAL AIRPORT, NY, US (75.98W,42.21N)

Heating & Cooling Degree Days – Free Worldwide Data Calculation

Heating degree days and cooling degree days for thousands of locations worldwide. Download free data in a simple spreadsheet format.

www.degreedays.net

 

[gary38532]

HDD's...

Use:
KBGM: BINGHAMTON REGIONAL AIRPORT, NY, US (75.98W,42.21N)

Heating & Cooling Degree Days – Free Worldwide Data Calculation

Heating degree days and cooling degree days for thousands of locations worldwide. Download free data in a simple spreadsheet format.

www.degreedays.net

Ok

 

[SpaceBus]

Im stilling waiting for them to come look at the house. They are suppose to come tomorrow but I doubt it due to a ice storm that's is starting tonight. It may take me a long time to get the house up to par for the VF100. Im looking to band aid it untill that happens so we dont have to spend the whole winter cold. I always wanted a fire in the living room anyway thats why I bought the stove to start with. It just never got installed cause it was always warm anyway with the clayton and I was spending money on other things for the house.

No doubt having a fire in the living space is awesome. I like it so much I can see two from one seat. The avalon looks like it has a decent fire view, so you should be pleased. I bet if you charge the house with heat when you go to bed the house will still be warm when you get up. Perhaps you will only need to fire the free standing stove once a day. We light the cooker two or three times a day and the Morso once or twice depending on temp.

 

[gary38532]

The insulation guys just left and said there is not much they can really do to make it any much better. They said the best they could do was to inject all the walls in the home for about 10k but he said after you spend that and fix the drywall he said it wont have any "wow" differences. He said in his opinion the furnace is just under powered for the home.

 

[JRHAWK9]

Personally, I would be more concerned with air sealing and sealing/insulating the roof areas....as heat rises and may be the best "bang for the buck". Having said that, you may be in the same situation I am in when it comes to insulating the roof areas. Seeing ours is a log cabin type home w/ loft, we don't have an attic. So we only have maybe 15" - 18" separating the outside metal roof to the heating envelope inside. It's a 12/12 pitch roof as well. We are losing lots of our heat at the peak along the ridge vent. Snow/ice/frost does not last or even form is this area. Nothing we can really do now which won't cost big $$$. We would have to remove all the tongue and groove wood on the ceiling and then inject expandable foam in between all the joists and then reinstall all the wood....or remove the metal roofing and do something that way.

 

[gary38532]

Im geting the 3500 put in the living room

 

[JRHAWK9]

Im geting the 3500 put in the living room

Then that will still leave you the option of installing a third stove (the older Avalon you have) if those two together don't end up cutting it.

 

[gary38532]

yeah! lol

 

[brenndatomu]

So we only have maybe 15" - 18" separating the outside metal roof to the heating envelope inside.

You think its that much? If its like the cabins I'm familiar with, I'd bet its under 12"...closer to 8" total...

 

[sloeffle]

When you bought the furnace from Lampa, did they say it would be able to heat 2800 sq ft in your heating zone ? @JRHAWK9 or @brenndatomu please correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't that be at the high end of what a Kuuma could handle ?

I think the Caddy and Kuuma are "similar" in size. I'm heating a smaller house that has pretty good insulation and I have less HDD's than you do and there is no way it would be able to heat 2800 sq ft with temps below 20 - 25F. When temps are below 10F or so my Caddy can keep the house at 70 - 73F but I need to check it more often and usually have to fill it on a pretty healthy coal bed.

 

[brenndatomu]

hen you bought the furnace from Lampa, did they say it would be able to heat 2800 sq ft in your heating zone ?

They state "up to" 3500 sq ft...under the right circumstances (location, insulation level, etc)

 

[gary38532]

When I bought it I sent them photos of my older one and they said they thought it would work well in the house.

 

[gary38532]

They state "up to" 3500 sq ft...under the right circumstances (location, insulation level, etc)

Maybe its my ranch being so spreed out. Its long 70 foot house.

 

[gary38532]

When you bought the furnace from Lampa, did they say it would be able to heat 2800 sq ft in your heating zone ? @JRHAWK9 or @brenndatomu please correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't that be at the high end of what a Kuuma could handle ?

I think the Caddy and Kuuma are "similar" in size. I'm heating a smaller house that has pretty good insulation and I have less HDD's than you do and there is no way it would be able to heat 2800 sq ft with temps below 20 - 25F. When temps are below 10F or so my Caddy can keep the house at 70 - 73F but I need to check it more often and usually have to fill it on a pretty healthy coal bed.

my Kuuma can barely hit 70 when its 30 outside

 

[brenndatomu]

I think the Caddy and Kuuma are "similar" in size.

Caddy 3.5 ft, VF100 4.1 ft,...IIRC...

 

[sloeffle]

Caddy 3.5 ft, VF100 4.1 ft,...IIRC...

Ahhh, so it is bigger than the Caddy but not as big as the Max. The Max looks to be 4.9 cu ft.

 

[Woodman1]

I have to jump in here and give my opinion. First I will admit I have not read every post of this thread, but enough I think. That said my first thought is STOP, take a step back and breath. Don't make a hasty decision at this point of the heating season. Second, I don't know what your schedule is but do you really want/can tend to 2 wood burning appliances. Not only now, but 5 years from now also? Third, you may be surprised how little it would take to supplement the kuma on those rare design days with electric/fossil fuels(I don't know what your primary furnace/boiler is)

Unless your house is beyond 5k square feet there is no reason it could not be insulated/sealed to average 30k btu per hour. Money would be way better spend on sealing up the envelope.

It's your house and your money so do whatever you want, but I would cation you to fix the problem and not just bandaid the issue. I think the Kuma is an excellent modern wood furnace that should/can work on its own within practical limits. Could it heat an unisulated pole barn? Probably not.

 

[brenndatomu]

The other think is that when dealing with cathedral ceilings, you have to consider cubic ft too, not just sq ft.
JRHawk and I have similar sized houses, but he has cathedral ceilings, I don't...between that, and less HDD here, I don't have to run mine as hard as he does.

 

[brenndatomu]

Third, you may be surprised how little it would take to supplement the kuma on those rare design days with electric/fossil fuels(I don't know what your primary furnace/boiler is)

That's true...we do tend to get hung up on "100% wood heat"...and the truth is that even if you have to supplement with fossil fuel, the wood is still shouldering 90% (for example) of the load...

 

[brenndatomu]

Maybe its my ranch being so spreed out. Its long 70 foot house.

That doesnt help at all...and where is the Kuuma placed in that 70'? Middle?
Heat loss to the ducts can be significant, especially if they run through cooler (or even worse, unheated) spaces...that can make a bunch of heat just "magically disappear" in a hurry!

 

[gary38532]

I have to jump in here and give my opinion. First I will admit I have not read every post of this thread, but enough I think. That said my first thought is STOP, take a step back and breath. Don't make a hasty decision at this point of the heating season. Second, I don't know what your schedule is but do you really want/can tend to 2 wood burning appliances. Not only now, but 5 years from now also? Third, you may be surprised how little it would take to supplement the kuma on those rare design days with electric/fossil fuels(I don't know what your primary furnace/boiler is)

Unless your house is beyond 5k square feet there is no reason it could not be insulated/sealed to average 30k btu per hour. Money would be way better spend on sealing up the envelope.

It's your house and your money so do whatever you want, but I would cation you to fix the problem and not just bandaid the issue. I think the Kuma is an excellent modern wood furnace that should/can work on its own within practical limits. Could it heat an unisulated pole barn? Probably not.

This is just all wrong... The insulation company just said it was insulated good. They left maybe a hour ago. RARE days? its barely heating in 30. Im not sure where I can seal the house up any better at this point? I did all the outlets, light switch, attic doorways, added insulation to the attic, all the doors in the house have new seals. Take a step back and breath? Ive been working on this for months and made very little gain.

 

[JRHAWK9]

You think its that much? If its like the cabins I'm familiar with, I'd bet its under 12"...closer to 8" total...

I guess I don't really know for sure, I was just guessing.

 

[gary38532]

That doesnt help at all...and where is the Kuuma placed in that 70'? Middle?
Heat loss to the ducts can be significant, especially if they run through cooler (or even worse, unheated) spaces...that can make a bunch of heat just "magically disappear" in a hurry!

There all in the basement and yes its in the middle

 

[laynes69]

An insulation audit doesn't mean anything. Yes, insulation is important, but just as if not more is the ACH (air changes per hour). A blower door test should be done and can be calibrated to give you an exact air exchange rate, and while that is being done, thermal imaging. I know that r19 fiberglass is poo pood, but we had a 2 story addition put on the house and I've done major remodeling (gut, electrical, airsealing, vaporbarrier and drywall). Our kitchen had r19 in the walls (remodeled in the 90's by dad). The other rooms that I've remodeled have r19 in the walls. The kitchen is the coldest room in the house while the rooms I've done and addition are the warmest. The difference, I've meticulously airsealed the walls before insulating. The walls I've done even below zero are warm to the touch. It's all on how its installed. If the walls are insulated then look at ways to seal up gaps and cracks.

 

[brenndatomu]

And that reminds me...if having a blower door test done, I've heard it is best to have it done with both putting a negative, and a positive pressure on the house...they can reveal totally different leaks sometimes...