Log Splitter Engine Damaged???

[maple1]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

That might not be the best vid, just one I grabbed real quick.

Should be an easy fix - just grab a new valve & pull it apart. I think it's your intake valve but could do both at the same time.

 

[Ashful]

Ya - I think that's a valve we're seeing in the plug hole, and not the piston.

What I notice is that for every two revolutions of the flywheel the piston moves forward then starts to retract immediately at beginning of third revolution and so on.

That doesn't sound like piston action.

I'm calling bent valve - it's stuck open in the pic..

I think you nailed it. The plug is biased toward the valves on that head. Never noticed if it's actually over them, but looking again at that photo, I agree that looks like a valve.

 

[VirginiaIron]

What you are seeing move is probably the valve. The piston is a 1 to 1 ratio an you have 4 cycles per ignition.The electrode appears intact but pushed into the plug. The porcelain insulated is missing a piece and I bet that piece is holding a valve open.

Where is it popping from, exhaust or carborator? If carb, likely intake valve. From muffler would be exhaust valve. Should be a simple fix unless valve is bent- $4? for a gasket. If you pull the head the porcelain (presumed) should be visible with a valve that doesn't close.

 

[Ashful]

If valve is held open by ceramic, total cost of repair is $6.50 for a head gasket. That gasket is so popular that even Home Depot keeps them in stock (garden dept.), and you can order them on Amazon Prime.

If valve is bent, then you might get away with just swapping the bad valve ($12) out and lapping the new one in to the old seat. If you have to replace the seat ($5) or guide ($7), then you’re into a little tooling. Installing valve guides is not that difficult, but you need a tap and bolt to extract the old one, a tool to hammer in the new one, and a reamer to finish it off before inserting the new valve. Guides are always recommended, when replacing valves, but not always necessary.

 

[KenLockett]

Ok guys so sounds like first step is to remove head. Do I need to drain the oil first? Once Head is off I can inspect and determine issue. Will have gasket available for reinstalling head. Do I need gasket seal when putting back on and does anyone know torque requirement on head bolts? Should be a learning experience. I actually rebuilt the transmission on my lawn tractor so I assume I should be able to figure this out. Haven’t looked at the video yet but will.

 

[KenLockett]

This is the Briggs 675e series 4 stroke engine by the way.

 

[brenndatomu]

Do I need gasket seal when putting back on and does anyone know torque requirement on head bolts?

No, dry gasket.
Ashful posted the torque in the first few replys.
Oh, no need to drain oil just to remove the head.

 

[KenLockett]

Thank you. Will keep everyone posted on what I find.

 

[rox3406]

Seen this many times before. Def a bent valve. And you can’t just buy a new valve and stick it in. The valve lash has to be set by grinding the lifter after the new valve is lapped in. Case has to be split and all that.

 

[Ashful]

Seen this many times before. Def a bent valve. And you can’t just buy a new valve and stick it in. The valve lash has to be set by grinding the lifter after the new valve is lapped in. Case has to be split and all that.

My god, that’s a horrible design, if that’s the case. Every single-cylinder flathead I’ve ever done a top end on had adjustable lifters. Are you certain the 675e doesn’t have any lifter adjustment? What did that save them, a six pennies per engine?

Ken, I have a 2 year old 675e that’s a direct fit onto your Huskee 22-ton, I removed it from my own Huskee 22-ton machine when I upgraded the pump and engine. You could have it for half the new price, if we can find a way to get it from here to there.

Me? If rox is right about those lifters, I’d use this as an excuse to hotrod that machine.

 

[KenLockett]

How would you hot rod the machine Ash? You mean different engine than the BS 675e? Only complaint I have is slow cycle speed and hard to start I cold with no choke.

 

[Ashful]

How would you hot rod the machine Ash? You mean different engine than the BS 675e? Only complaint I have is slow cycle speed and hard to start I cold with no choke.

I think I wrote a whole thread on it, when I did mine, but basically:

1. Upgrade pump from 11 GPM to 16 GPM (the largest the port size on that cylinder will support).
2. Upgrade engine to at least 300cc to support larger pump.
3. Upgrade suction line and fitting size to support larger pump.
4. Upgrade steel line that runs from valve to top of cylinder to 1/2" ID hose.
5. Add key switch and starter solenoid, so you can jump start that big motor/pump off your tractor when it's cold out.

This will take your cycle time from 11-12 seconds down to 8 seconds. I did this with my own machine a year ago.

 

[KenLockett]

Ash, not sure hot rodding the splitter really my cup of tea. Lol. Anyhow, going to take the head off and see what I find. If valve bent and Rox is correct with regard to repair, I can't do it and probably not cost effective to take it in to anyone. In that case I may be interested in your engine and may be in the Eddystone, PA area in the near future on business. Were you thinking $100 to $150 for the engine? I told myself if I ever had to replace the engine I would get a Honda for easier starts and better fuel economy. Any idea cost wise what a fit compatible Honda might run. Don't want to get into any mechanical mods to make it fit though. Heard Honda engine with metal gas reservoir way to go and that ones with plastic reservoirs are junk.

 

[Ashful]

Whatever average price you find for a new one, I’d be happy to take half that for this one. Just PM me when you know which direction you’re headed with this.

 

[KenLockett]

Well I certainly damaged the engine as the photos below show after taking the head cover off. You can see where the valve is bent left. Question is whether this configuration requires splitting the case as Rox mentioned or whether the valve can simply be replaced. From my perspective and I am not a small engine expert here, I don't see how the valve is simply replaced without tearing into the entire engine. What would you guys do? Try to fix or replace with new engine depending upon cost? I found a Honda GSV190 for roughly $300 that matches in just about every category although a bit more horsepower that I do not suspect will hurt anything. Problem is vertical shaft is over three inches and existing engine is only 1 15/16. Same for Harbor Freight Honda clone although smaller displacement and lower torque. About same as Honda GCV160. Both GCV160 and HF Clone less expensive considerably. Do you guys think those would drive my pump efficiently? I can publish specs on all three if it helps. Not sure how difficult it is to grind the shaft down and/or if it would have to be tapped/threaded/keyed again. Again I do not have a lot of tooling to do these things. Cannot see the specific coupling to the pump underneath the splitter.

 

[blades]

rather than trying to or having it done (shortening the shaft) just add a spacer of the appropriate height to make up the difference ( us rednecks go at things a bit differently at times ) a hard wood board(s), poly plastic or similar ( I am not fond of a whole stack of washers though that is also a possiblity)Longer bolts + appropriate lock washers and nuts. Nylock nuts tend to give up if too much heat is incurred. ( thermal transmission from eng. case) should be solid between two bolts otherwise all the stress is just on the block mounting tabs. Hope that gives some ideas. Small engines with in a specific cc range use the same mounting pattern or at least they used to. Easy enough to waller out the mounting plate holes for some leeway if needed pump is coupled to motor with a lovejoy unit - flexible a bit to accommodate a bit of alignment disparity. Course this all goes out the window if the pump is a direct mount, even there spacers could be utilized.

 

[VirginiaIron]

Most of those old school valve set ups have an access side cover typically with a breather tube. You could access the valves and valve locks from behind that cover plate. You engine could be different. If it is the same, slam a valve in there, lap if desired, and go.

 

[rox3406]

You can replace the valve without splitting the case. The problem is the valve lash. Can’t set that without spitting it. You could just slam a valve in and see what happens they are cheap. If the lash is to much it will just make a little noise. If to little It may not start due to the valve hanging open a bit. You could file the end of the valve if to little lash. It’s just not the correct way to do it. But will accomplish the same task. You could also just wack the bent valve till it looks straight and try it.

 

[maple1]

You can swap valves without splitting. Did u check out that vid I posted above?

 

[brenndatomu]

You could also just wack the bent valve till it looks straight and try it.

This is what I was thinking...just not brave enough to post it before...BTDT, and it worked. Just need to use a little finesse and a brass punch or something "soft" like that. Suppose a piece of Oak would work too. Turn the engine to the point where that valve is fully open and then give 'er a tap in the right direction. Check progress after each tap and just be patient...these valves are pretty small and you may be surprised how easy a stem can be bent...if it doesn't work, then you are out only a bit of time...sure can't hurt it any at this point.

 

[KenLockett]

Will try to ‘realign’ using your suggestions then if that doesn’t work will watch video. Thanks guys and will keep you posted.

 

[Ashful]

Pull the breather cover, and let’s get a photo in there. Flatheads like these always have the lifters, springs, and retainers behind the breather cover, and it’s usually just two or four screws to get that removed.

If what rox is saying is accurate, that the lifters must be ground to match the valve, couldn’t one just drop a new lifter in there and then grind the end of the valve stem instead? Easy valve replacement, without splitting the case.

Me? Even if Briggs made this engine to require initial factory set-up the way rox describes, I’m having trouble believing they wouldn’t have a repair contingency or after-market lifter that can be adjusted, to facilitate valve replacement in the field. I’ve just never seen anything like that... but the last Briggs I rebuilt was admittedly much older.

I’d never try straightening a bent valve, it’s sure to fail shortly down the road. I’d put a new one in there, even if the lash is short. If the lash is long, then you can simply grind the end of the new valve stem to bring it into spec. Running a bent valve is going to ruin your valve seat, and probably the guide, putting you into a much bigger repair. When I say “bent”, it could be imperceptible, beyond your ability to measure on an assembled engine.

 

[VirginiaIron]

The seating of the valve is most important. I'd opt for a new valve, a grinder and/or a fine stone.

 

[KenLockett]

Ok. I bent the valve back into line as best as I could and very close. Tried but couldn’t get it to start. Definitely made a difference as a bit more compression and no more pop after a number of tries. Just will not start though. Deciding whether to access valve assembly and may do so but my interest peaked by the Honda GSV190 replacement engine with longer shaft. I was looking at the shaft and how it mates into the lovejoy coupling. From base of shaft to end of coupling where pump is on bottom of plate is 4 inches. If the length of the shaft is indeed a little under two inches then the coupling is two inches from that point to where it mounts to pump. Are the couplings meant to handle excess shaft length internally for adjustability. Not sure if I am clearly explaining myself but wondering if shaft length adjustablility is built into the lovejoy coupling internally????

 

[VirginiaIron]

Typically, you want close to a full shaft inside the coupling. You can always use longer bolts with washers/spacers at the engine/pump flange to move the engine or pump away from each other. I did this on my engine side to compensate for a longer shaft.