dutchwest 2479 WORST STOVE EVER
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Hanko you are not mistaken, Eco is the original poster with all the problems, and Its not my intention to hyjack his thread but he has generated such a responce to his problems with his stove (which are the exact the same stove and problems as mine) that I thought it best to get the input here. Anyway, yes the chimney is kept superclean, I have my own brush and I get up there 3-4 times a year to sweep it. I'm rather keen on the chimney being clean, I have to get up there often to wipe snow, dirt and pollen off the solar panels, and I routinely check the chimney as well. Asfar as ash buildup in the back of the stove, that may or many not be a problem. I removed the pipe and cleaned that area last winter on advice of my dealer, but I don't recall specifically getting the vac into the holes right and left as was previously posted in this thread. I remember that when I looked at it, I was impressed that it looked clean and was thinking it could not have attributed to the problem, perhaps I was mistaken. As far as placement of the splits, the descriptions in this thead have been very helpful, and although I have not in the past placed each and every log in the exact fashion mentioned, I have been relentless in my pursuit of a "thick" coal bed prior to closing the bypass. But no matter how long I have done the initial burn with the bypass open, no matter hot or deep the bed looks, once the damper is closed, the everburn sounds effective at first only to fizzle out after 10-20 mins or so. Thus begins a steady and predictable decline in stove temps. I have never, never, seen a sitution where my stove has not smoked, and I have given up on the accout that perhaps my wood quality will not allow it, (Aspen and Spruce). Diabel, you said you get the same results burning soft or hardwood, I find that surprising if not hopefull. When I go back up there I clean the ports and will play with the placement of splits. Anyone else able to achieve "everburn" using softwood? Diabel what kind of softwood are you using and what kind of pipe temps are you consistenly getting with a "stable" burn.
Once you remove the flue pipe from the stove, you will need to run a 1" vacuum hose on each side of the reburner. If this has not been done...it could be your solution! Also, some folks here suggested to remove & clean the ash behind the shoe, I have not done it & this is my 4th season. I am kind of reluctant to do this since I am afraid that my refactory is crumbling & I will not be able to put the stuff back together. As for wood type & will burn spruce, box elder, pine & cedar. Cedar was the only wood that last spring that gave me problems but at the same time, at that point in the season I ran out of limb wood. I used some 2x4s & it worked but not as well. Now I decided to use the cedar only for kindling. As for results....using hard vs soft wood I am only saying that the everburn will engage using either wood type.
hey guys, to clean the reburn or everburn or what ever evryone wants to refer to them as, the top needs to come off, (two studs with nuts) No Im not refering to brother bart or be green as two studs with nuts, but as i was saying you need to remove the top and you will see two chambers towards the outside. A small 1 inch vaccum hose will suck all the crap out of them. Try that. I have to do mine in the fall and midway through the burn season
Ok, are we refering to two different area to clean here? The "tubes" which are just visible below right and left of the flue collar, which I'm assuming I can get at by removeing the stove pipe and using a 1" vac. I plan to replace that flue collar gasket, so I assuming that removal of the flue collar would even make access to the two tubs easier. (lets call this area #1). Now is there seperate area behind the "shoe"? (area #2) Am I mistaken that the way to clean this area is by removing the entire top, as in the whole cast top griddle area of the stove? Then once thats off I would use a vac to get to hidden areas on the right and left side? and Diabel is suggesting I could possibly clean area #2 by reaching through the open damper and feeding the 1" hose craftly to right and left and down? Am I getting this right?
rkymtnoffgrid said:
The "tubes" as you call it are the little holes in the shoe, ash apparently gets in behind them & the only way to remove this ash is by removing the shoe all together. This is one area that as said earlier I am reluctant to take apart. What I am talking about are the two chambers on each side of the reburner accessible with a small hose through the bypass area (easiest) or by removing the flue pipe. You will see these chambers if you remove the flue pipe at least in the encore...DW might be different. That is why I said you should be able to access it from the damper area.
No worrys on the hijacking. haha. NAh this cool hearing many different ideas. its been a couple days on the good wood and i seem to be having some good stress free burns. what Diabel said with the stacking it in there like that i think is key. that shoe needs some room to breath and then stacking the crap out of the rest of the stove as well i htink helps by keeping it tight letting it burn from the bottom up. the shoe is really easy to take out. just remove the grate in the stove and it slides right out. just be careful... Very Fragile.
Well I'm getting ansey to see if all this works, I'll be going back up there for a couple weeks for during christmas and I'll put the things discussed in this thread to the test. Eco, it sounds like you removed the entire shoe through the front, by removing the ash grate? Could you elaborate?
Hanko said:
No reason to get bitter. These are my observations and opinions. I didn't say I had a problem starting a fire. The PE design is easier to start from cold and to start secondary burn than the DW. I have said in previous posts that my DW has been a great stove with long 8-10 hour burns. It has heated my home well for 4 years. I have not had any of the issues that are written about in the post. However, the DW is not a durable stove. Have you checked your fountain?? I bought my PE because I was not going to spend $400 every 2-3 years in replacement parts. I wil continue to use my DW on the weekends but it still is not as easy to use as my PE. Your results may differ but as a general rule with baffle stove and everburn stove running side by side I'm willing to bet the majority of people will find the baffle stove more user friendly.
Today is a good example. The PE ran 10.5 hours w/o reloading I came home from work loaded 5 splits and in 10 minutes I had secondary burn after closing air down completely. This can not be done that quickly in the DW.
rkymtnoffgrid said:
Secondary burn (everburn) should be easier to achieve with softwoods (it is for me). I hope everyone is not expecting the initial loud everburn roar to continue for hours. It won't, but your temps should stay up and possibly climb.
Diabel said:
You won't be able to reach down far enough using this method. You'll only reach the damper shelf.
Bsa once your reburn stablized, lets say 2 hours after closeing the bypass, what pipe temps were you getting? Were you smoking at all?, were you burning that clean? Perhaps I've never noticed a problem with my "fountain" or other refractory becase I have never got my secondary burn system to work in three years. I'm going to take the whole thing apart, clean the afterburner/reburner/everburner...(good grief this post sounds like were trying to lauch the space shuttle...) then I'll focus on the placement of the splits...Maybe, just maybe, if theres a pressure system over the rockies, and the outside temperatures are less than freezing, and I put holy water in the humidifer.. I'll get the everburn to stabilize. Thanks Eco for the original post, and thanks for all the responces, I'm much better equipped now, but I have to say, it has be so much easier in the past when I could just blame the stove...what the heck am I going to do now?
rkymtnoffgrid said:
My stack temps run around 500 - 600 degrees on the single wall pipe about 18" above the stove. I don't have any smoke when these temps are reached. I do get smoke at cold start up and whenever I add new splits to a hot fire but this stops once the "fresh" wood has been heated/ignited. My fountain (which sits behind the shoe) disintegrated after 3 years of 24/7 burning ( I have pics if needed). My dealer claimed that the early stoves had poorly made fountains and were improved. However, at the end of last year I was once again seeing flakes of fountain lying on the shoe (the start of fountain self destruction). The refractory material has not given me any problems.....yet. I am very careful placing my splits to prevent damaging the refractory. Still, my shoe and door refractory are showing signs of crumbling from heat cycling. Probably 2 years of 24/7 and everything would need replacement. This stove is now only used for supplemental heating when the temps are really cold so I hope I can get 5 years out of her. With the fountain costing $400 alone, If I had to replace the refractory as well I might as well buy a new stove (Englander maybe??).
Wall im now on about the 12th flawless free everburn. i think the orientation of how i load the stove and the wood im using are playing a major role. I'll keep ya guys posted. im starting to feel confident about the stove so i knocked each piece of wood before throwing it in the stove. haha. don't want to jinx myself...
Now the second time in a row after reloading the stove goes thermo nuclear!! pipe temps climbing to 1400!!i dont know what is going on but thats not good. i have restricted the air on secondary with some foil.. NOw this thing has me nervous to leave the thing. i think im goin to put a damper on there some how. usually this just hapens once in a while. but now twice in a row.
I do have a flu damper wood that work as well? Also i dont know if when reloaded it had a pretty hugge coal bed left and maybe causing it to over-fire. Or im thinkig the way i have been stacking it in there could be cause it as well. i put a 2 to 3 inch small chunk of wood on both sides of the shoe. then i lay a piece of wood over it. leavin like a 3 inch air space. an dnow with the temps being real cold its really pulling the air through that space like a tornado.. also once the log fell off the chunks of wood it stopped.. also i used a few piece of maple on the bottom that have been dryin for two years... i know maple dries much faster than oak. could it be like kiln dried wood?
ecocavalier02 said:
This has happened to me a few times in the 4 years I've used the stove, most in the last 2 years. At first I thought I was putting too many pieces of hard wood (oak/locust) in at one time but at the end of last year I noticed that the gasket on top of the flue damper lost it's hold in the groove possibily not alowing the damper to close completely. I need to investigate this further but when it happens the foil trick works.
will a key damper in the stove pipe help regulate this. i have about a 25 foot chimney. any help would be appreciated i have a key damper. wondering weather not to install it or not.. seems like i couldnt get the frekin thing to work for so long now its working great. and im getting wicked high temps in the flu.
ecocavalier02 said:
A probe thermometer will read considerably higher than a magnetic thermometer. I'm not sure where your temps should be as all my reading are with the magnetic.
yeah i have a magnetic one on there to and it was at about 650. i also stopped it and dont know if it would have gone higher. i mean is that ok burning that hot. anythin above 1200 makes me nervous. but maybe not.
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