2018-19 Blaze King Performance Thread Part 2 (Everything BK)

[Highbeam]

To me comparing burn times between a bk turned down low vs a tube stove turned down low is pointless. Because the btu output is drastically different. And I only need that low output maybe a week out of the year. The rest of the time I have been getting similar burn times.

To me the trap is comparing max burn times between the two when the heat output of the bk when set for max burn time is as low as it is.

I think we might be saying the same thing. It’s not so much the hours of burn time that is so impressive but being able to run at such a low output while being such a large stove. Some people need more output so they aren’t able to utilize that impressive low setting.

Why can’t we scale it up? Maybe have a 10 cubic foot cat stove that has a low setting 4 times as high as a princess ( to heat the bholler house) but holds enough fuel to still get you that magical 24 hour burn time.

Ever heard of the bk apex?

 

[Highbeam]

Why in the world would one remove that feature? Should have read up more on the Ashford 25. I would have went with a different model, or something that had this feature. It would be nice to have a preset fan speed when cat is active for high, medium or low when cat is active. A simple thermostat switch tied to the fan.


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When I said new models lost that feature I meant new princesses too. I have never wished the feature wasn’t there. Seems nice that it shuts itself off if the stove gets cold.

 

[lsucet]

When I said new models lost that feature I meant new princesses too. I have never wished the feature wasn’t there. Seems nice that it shuts itself off if the stove gets cold.

When I get my first princess I did notice that it was not working like that I I called BK and I was ask for my model year. It is a 2015. I was told no only the old ones have that. I was some how disappointed.

 

[Tegbert]

Why in the world would one remove that feature? Should have read up more on the Ashford 25. I would have went with a different model, or something that had this feature. It would be nice to have a preset fan speed when cat is active for high, medium or low when cat is active. A simple thermostat switch tied to the fan.


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You could probably wire in a snap disc for it. My lopi has it. It comes on at around 300-325 stove temp and then shuts off somewhere in the 200’s.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

 

[darktower007]

You could probably wire in a snap disc for it. My lopi has it. It comes on at around 300-325 stove temp and then shuts off somewhere in the 200’s.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

Would love to do it... but with my luck I’d fry the system or electrocute myself next time I touched the fan[emoji38]


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[Highbeam]

Would love to do it... but with my luck I’d fry the system or electrocute myself next time I touched the fan[emoji38]


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It’s a little redneck but I added an adjustable snap disc to control the blower on/off on my nc30. I really like it.

Kenny, this is the nc30 right now ripping at 700. Looks nice, feels nice, will only last 3 hours before it cools way down but it’s really capable of chooching.

 

[bholler]

I think we might be saying the same thing. It’s not so much the hours of burn time that is so impressive but being able to run at such a low output while being such a large stove. Some people need more output so they aren’t able to utilize that impressive low setting.

Why can’t we scale it up? Maybe have a 10 cubic foot cat stove that has a low setting 4 times as high as a princess ( to heat the bholler house) but holds enough fuel to still get you that magical 24 hour burn time.

Ever heard of the bk apex?

I really dont think my btu load is abnormally high i mean the 3100 heated the house fine. So does the princess but i really was expecting to get longer burn times. I knew i wasnt going to be running 24hrs very much at all but i thought 12hrs would do more than it does. But so far most of this winter i have been reloading at 8 hours the same as the regency.

 

[Highbeam]

I really dont think my btu load is abnormally high i mean the 3100 heated the house fine. So does the princess but i really was expecting to get longer burn times. I knew i wasnt going to be running 24hrs very much at all but i thought 12hrs would do more than it does. But so far most of this winter i have been reloading at 8 hours the same as the regency.

There’s no magic to a cat stove that creates heat, you need a certain amount of energy delivered to your home and that takes a pretty much fixed amount of wood. The princess is only 2.8 cubic feet of fuel. If you had a king it would burn at least 50% longer at your chosen output rate.

Maybe if your house (and climate) didn’t require so dang much heat you would be able to turn it down into its happy output range and experience the benefits. My heat demand is well matched to the princess model and it really shines.

 

[bholler]

There’s no magic to a cat stove that creates heat, you need a certain amount of energy delivered to your home and that takes a pretty much fixed amount of wood. The princess is only 2.8 cubic feet of fuel. If you had a king it would burn at least 50% longer at your chosen output rate.

Maybe if your house (and climate) didn’t require so dang much heat you would be able to turn it down into its happy output range and experience the benefits. My heat demand is well matched to the princess model and it really shines.

You do realize I have gotten all kinds of crap and been labeled a bk hater for saying that right. I do like the nice even heat it puts out I was just expecting a bit longer burns and some wood savings.

 

[Highbeam]

You do realize I have gotten all kinds of crap and been labeled a bk hater for saying that right. I do like the nice even heat it puts out I was just expecting a bit longer burns and some wood savings.

Its not what you say, it’s how you say it!

I’ve also been “acknowledged” for being honest about the pluses AND minuses to the cat stoves. Some bk fans thought I was too hard on them and some noncat fans think I’m too hard on noncats.

I own both types by choice. My only wish is that my nc30 could put out about twice as much heat.

 

[Diabel]

Its not what you say, it’s how you say it!

Sorry beholler, HB has a point here.

You are pretty blunt with some of your comments, especially about VC products......I can take it and appreciate your honest opinions but others.....not sure...

I think you will have a hard time unhooking the Princess come May..... just a thought.

 

[charger4406]

I can relate to bholler, and Highbeam hits the nail on the head on these stoves,
at the temps we usually get all winter long around here the bk loses alot of its advantages.
Without the F600 run on an 10hr cycle I would be running the ashford hard and using more oil,
the bk is much more controllable but the jotul is contributing the lions share of the heat to this house,
I would hate to heat Ashful's house up here as he has double the square footage that I try to heat.

 

[charger4406]

especially about VC products

My old defiant 2n1 at my brothers is still running strong and throws some serious heat without any problems(knock on wood).

 

[MissMac]

Well @Ashful i will freely admit that you were right. I fired up the furnace to work in tandem with the stove last night overnight, and it has made a wonderful difference in the comfort in the house. Outside is -31*C (-42*C with windchill), and it’s a lovely 22.5*C in side the house evenly. Just wish I didn’t have to go outside to get to work!

 

[Highbeam]

I can relate to bholler, and Highbeam hits the nail on the head on these stoves,
at the temps we usually get all winter long around here the bk loses alot of its advantages.
Without the F600 run on an 10hr cycle I would be running the ashford hard and using more oil,
the bk is much more controllable but the jotul is contributing the lions share of the heat to this house,
I would hate to heat Ashful's house up here as he has double the square footage that I try to heat.

The temperatures aren’t what’s causing you to run the stove so hard it’s your home’s heat loss. If your house was smaller and/or insulated better you wouldn’t need so much heat and you could turn the cat stove down to a more reasonable setting.

 

[charger4406]

The temperatures aren’t what’s causing you to run the stove so hard it’s your home’s heat loss. If your house was smaller and/or insulated better you wouldn’t need so much heat and you could turn the cat stove down to a more reasonable setting.

I agree 100% it is the heat load of this house in this climate that is the problem,not the stove,
now if I was south or perhaps in your area where the temps are less harsh it would be different,
I would likely still need two bk stoves with my layout, but could run them at their optimal settings
more so then where I am.

 

[Ashful]

Its not what you say, it’s how you say it!

I can understand bholler may come across that way to those who don’t spend as much time on this forum, but I admire his blunt honesty. Maybe it’s a PA thing, but I think we’d get along just fine.

Well @Ashful i will freely admit that you were right. I fired up the furnace to work in tandem with the stove last night overnight, and it has made a wonderful difference in the comfort in the house. Outside is -31*C (-42*C with windchill), and it’s a lovely 22.5*C in side the house evenly. Just wish I didn’t have to go outside to get to work!

I spent two years making my family cold and miserable, trying to heat this joint via two stoves, with the corresponding zones on the boiler turned off. So, I was speaking from some (painful) experience, there.

Trust me, you’re still going to save a boatload in fuel costs. Just keep pumping wood BTU’s in that capacitor you call home, and let the furnace modulate the difference between demand and stove capability. With an OAK on your furnace, you’re in better shape than me, but I have a lot of holes in this house.

 

[shoot-straight]

Would love to do it... but with my luck I’d fry the system or electrocute myself next time I touched the fan[emoji38]


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its better to put the stat thats connected to the fan be linked to heat needed for the room, not the stove. i recently put a remote stat controlled switch across the room set at 70. drops below 68 in the room, fan comes on. over 72, fan goes off. i usually have the fan set on medium unless its super super cold. i have encouraged BK to market a similar product but better quality. the chinese one i have is crap.

i find that the heat output is maximum with the fan on. especially when the cat temp drops off. when that needle is just above active, without the fan there is little felt output. with the fan on there is a huge difference in output into the room.

 

[MissMac]

I can understand bholler may come across that way to those who don’t spend as much time on this forum, but I admire his blunt honesty. Maybe it’s a PA thing, but I think we’d get along just fine.


I spent two years making my family cold and miserable, trying to heat this joint via two stoves, with the corresponding zones on the boiler turned off. So, I was speaking from some (painful) experience, there.

Trust me, you’re still going to save a boatload in fuel costs. Just keep pumping wood BTU’s in that capacitor you call home, and let the furnace modulate the difference between demand and stove capability. With an OAK on your furnace, you’re in better shape than me, but I have a lot of holes in this house.

dedicated air for the propane furnace is a mandatory thing. and a good thing too, cause the last thing i would want is the furnace and stove to start competing for air. i can only imagine the sheeit i'd get into. the family was super appreciative of the more even heat when it was time to get up this morning for sure, and you're right, for the little bit i ran it, it made a big difference in house "quality of life" this morning.

running the stove alone when it's this cold highlights all the little holes i have in my house too. definitely feel the drafts running around, and we get some pretty super cold walls. i'm sure the situation would be different if i had an OAK on the stove, however the location of my stove would make installing an OAK more of a PITA than i'm willing to take.

 

[Diabel]

you’re still going to save a boatload in fuel costs. Just keep pumping wood BTU’s in that capacitor you call home, and let the furnace modulate the difference between demand and stove capability.

This is perfectly phrased.

Funny how many of us tried to heat our homes with a wood space heater and failed! I am excited to see my NG bills just for analytical purposes.

 

[kf6hap]

In the northern climates where the BKs have visible flames for most of the burn and the shoulder season is brief perhaps the differences between cats and non cats become closer but then again, why are BKs so popular in Alaska? In my neck of the woods flames are only rarely seen after the load char. My main problem is keeping the flue above the condensing point. Low low burn increases burn time time and burning efficiency enormously and the savings in wood not burned are fantastic. The overall efficiency is very high at the crawl burn rate due to dwell time. 1. The long time spent in the cat (due to the very slow moving gasses) causes a very complete combustion maximizing heat production. 2. Long dwell time in the stove permits the gasses to give up most of the contained heat to the stove and not be wasted up the flue stack.

Generally, an oversized cat stove run at a lower setting than a smaller cat stove at a higher setting increases efficiency. Minimum burn rate might become a problem with most stoves but BKs have exceptional turn-down so that is largely negated. The 2020 EPA regs will make the high turn-down ratios of air-tubers shrink to meet specs.

 

[darktower007]

its better to put the stat thats connected to the fan be linked to heat needed for the room, not the stove. i recently put a remote stat controlled switch across the room set at 70. drops below 68 in the room, fan comes on. over 72, fan goes off. i usually have the fan set on medium unless its super super cold. i have encouraged BK to market a similar product but better quality. the chinese one i have is crap.

i find that the heat output is maximum with the fan on. especially when the cat temp drops off. when that needle is just above active, without the fan there is little felt output. with the fan on there is a huge difference in output into the room.

Exactly. Without the fan I can’t really notice the heat. With the fan it will run out out of there. I’m sure a stand alone stove has a much higher conduction heat ability vs an insert due to much more exposed area and a bigger belly. But I do love wood heat!


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[shoot-straight]

why are BKs so popular in Alaska? s.

i can unequivically say (but not spell) that a BK burns soft, light woods better than a non-cat. lots of spruce and such up there so maybe that has something to do with it. i have a choice here in MD, and get wood of all BTU's and densities but i actually really like the way lighter wood burns. easier to get, easier to split, dries quicker. i still get decent burn times too. right now its lots of poplar. only issue with it is its very ashy. will break out my best oak for this chill coming here sunday.

 

[Woody Stover]

dialed down to low again for the day - yesterday this kept the house at 17*C which was good enough.

Yikes! I would need a few extra layers at least to survive low 60s, sitting at the computer generating no body heat.

in Mac’s case (he will correct me if I am wrong), he is pushing the Princess to its limits and only getting the stove room temp to 20*C.

He's apparently under-stoved when it gets cold out. By EPA high-output numbers, the Ashford is a notch lower than the Princess, which is a notch lower than the King, which is a couple notches lower than the Buck 91 I had at my MIL's house. When that thing is firing, you can't hold your hand where the heat blows out, for more than two seconds. The Ws hybrids are ranked at the top of the charts for high-end heat. The Ashford is given about the same high-output numbers as my Dutchwest 2460 Small Convection, which ain't a lot I can tell ya.

The nc30 can make heat! Gobbles up wood like mad though

I'm perplexed as to why it doesn't rate better for high end on the EPA list? They show it about the same as the lowly Ashford. Maybe their BTU/hr. figures are averaged over the entire load, at the high burn rate, or whichever of the four burn rates they do for each stove? Or maybe they had a bad test, for some other reason? Hmmm..
That brings up another question; In the EPA tests, are free-standing stoves tested with the optional blowers installed? That would definitely yield a higher BTU/hr. output, based on what I've seen with the blower on my Dutchwest 2460, vs. uninstalled. The blower was the difference here between keeping up and not keeping up when it got cold and windy out.

it was definitely colder than we like, especially in the far side of the house where we sleep. had my little hood on in my pjs. and when it's this cold, we definitely notice some of the drafts that we have

Get some fleece blankets and a down comforter. We let our bedroom goes down into the low 60's to concentrate more heat in the main room, but it's toasty out there after about 5 minutes under the covers.
If you have an IR thermometer gun, walk around the house when it's cold and windy out, find out where your worst air leaks are and work on those over the summer.

Does the BK/Ashford 25 have an automatic blower that turns on when the stove comes up to temp?

No it does not. Unless they changed it for the gen 2s.

My 2012 princess has a fan system from bk that turns off and on with temperature automatically. New models lost that feature.

What? I figured that only low-end stoves wouldn't be equipped with a variable speed auto-blower like the Buck 91 had.

Why in the world would one remove that feature? Should have read up more on the Ashford 25. I would have went with a different model, or something that had this feature.

It's hard not to get swept up in the moment, and buy before you have done much research. I bought my stove in a rush as well, to beat the deadline on the federal tax rebate. I got lucky, and ended up liking most things about the stove I grabbed.

Fixed that for you!

Ashful said: ↑
This is the way I run my house, since i̶t̶’̶s̶ ̶t̶o̶o̶ ̶l̶a̶r̶g̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶h̶a̶n̶d̶l̶e̶ ̶e̶n̶t̶i̶r̶e̶l̶y̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶ ̶w̶o̶o̶d̶ ̶s̶t̶o̶v̶e̶s̶ I bought little stoves because Kings clash with my doilies.
To each, his own, but if I'm going to the trouble involved with wood heating, I'm not messing around with the "gentleman wood-burner" approach. And like I said, you don't have to load Kings as often so that would be a bit less hassle than the 30s. You'd obviously be hauling more wood with my approach though, and he said he doesn't have time..the time he spends posting notwithstanding.

if you car was sitting in the driveway with a flat tire, I suppose you would wait till you needed to go some where to think about fixing it.

Yes I would, if it was -40 out.

Last post here for a little while, I need a break from this, actually feel a little emotional

Ah cheeze, crank up the furnace, ya tightwad! Or your gas cook stove at least. A few generations back, they froze their butts off all winter long, whether they were inside or out!

why are BKs so popular in Alaska?

i can unequivically say (but not spell) that a BK burns soft, light woods better than a non-cat. lots of spruce and such up there....i have a choice here in MD, and get wood of all BTU's and densities but i actually really like the way lighter wood burns. easier to get, easier to split, dries quicker.

In AK, I bet they pay a lot more attention to insulation and air-sealing than most of us do. If your place is tight enough you can heat it with a candle.
Agreed, it's nice to have a bunch of lower-output woods on hand, Red Maple, Black Cherry etc. Another feature is that they start quicker in a cold stove. You don't want to be trying to start a load of Black Locust or White Oak with a couple chunks of SuperCedar. Red Oak is a good middle of the pack wood for all-around utility.

 

[lsucet]

Get some fleece blankets and a down comforter. We let our bedroom goes down into the low 60's to concentrate more heat in the main room, but it's toasty out there after about 5 minutes under the covers.
If you have an IR thermometer gun, walk around the house when it's cold and windy out, find out where your worst air leaks are and work on those over the summer.[/QUOTE

Or move the bed next to the stove as you do.