2018-19 Blaze King Performance Thread Part 1 (Everything BK)

[webby3650]

I'm pretty sure they already know they have some problems. It may only be with some of the stoves, since many other owners have no problem, or at least less problems. Maybe it is manufacturing tolerances, some come out OK, some don't. Or design problems. Maybe they need to do more in-depth R&D before they put their products on the market. I'd think they'd have the money to do that, if they so chose. Seems it would be cheaper and less hassle to catch the problems up front in development than to try to deal with 'em later, and way cheaper than a recall, or worse a re-design. But what do I know, I'm no stove-maker/seller. I'm only guessing as to what might be going on, based on my own prejudices. In any case, as long as any bad press they get doesn't hurt their sales too much, I don't guess it's an issue. Their marketing approach is apparently working..

They burn these stoves to death in testing. R&D is extensive.
You do realize that BK sells more stoves everyday than the regulars on here along with the visitors that show up with an issue. Most of which have been in contact with BK and directed here. Your talking 1 in many hundreds have an issue, I wouldn’t call that a problem that they should be aware of. Wouldn’t it lead one to believe it’s a problem with that particular setup?

 

[jetsam]

After running the stove beyond flat-out with the bypass open for entire loads, you now face the additional hurdle of possibly having melted the bypass retainers. Even after the draft is fixed, you may need parts and a welder to get the bypass working again. (It is also possible that they are still okay.)

Currently the troubleshooting is focusing on the door gasket, which if completely removed would cause short uncontrollable burns but not a smoke smell in a normal install. That is probably not going to get you closer to a fix. Whatever is driving combustion gasses through your door gasket will just drive them out the air intake if you seal the gasket.

I'm not a pro, but I am telling you that at the end of the day it's a steel box with a fire in it. That particular steel box is known to work well under all kinds of conditions. This can be sorted out.

Some photos of the entire setup would most likely help us sort this out. Multiple people who do stoves for a living are watching this thread.... give them some data! Outside chimney and cap, the entire venting system inside, and the stove itself inside and out would be a great start.

 

[claybe]

No, I disagree! HOW you burn should not have any impact on "smoke smell". None at all, and that is a good thing. That is provided the flue is correct and the wood is dry.

The gasket was sent to me by BK so I don't know the actual size but is is significantly larger. The door had to be shimmed out a little to accommodate the replacement gasket. This was done by the installing stove company. They were sent the gasket, shims and an installation procedure sheet. Nothing special about replacing the gasket. It was just larger.

Once the gasket gets replaced say good-bye to all "trick" burning to avoid the small. Then life will be warm and fuzzy once again.

You have to have the right draft to make sure smoke does not find a different way out. If the only way to get the right draft is to burn it a certain way, then it makes all the difference. You can’t just put some wood in light it and close things down and expect it to work right if you have a 3 foot flue. Remember we still have not seen any pictures of this set up in question. This really has me questioning the validity of all this back and forth. I have a princess insert and things work great after I learned the stove, finally installed it correctly with insulated pipe, block off plate, chimney extension....all things I learned about here from you fine folks! I have been maintining 73 inside while 20 outside and have been getting 8-12 hour burn times and haven’t used the fan once Happy BKing

 

[claybe]

Whatever is driving combustion gasses through your door gasket will just drive them out the air intake if you seal the gasket.

Some photos of the entire setup would most likely help us sort this out. Multiple people who do stoves for a living are watching this thread.... give them some data! Outside chimney and cap, the entire venting system inside, and the stove itself inside and out would be a great start.

Great minds think alike!! This is exactly correct as I indicated above....

 

[jetsam]

I have a princess insert and things work great after I learned the stove, finally installed it correctly with insulated pipe, block off plate, chimney extension....all things I learned about here from you fine folks! I have been maintining 73 inside while 20 outside and have been getting 8-12 hour burn times and haven’t used the fan once Happy BKing

Oooh, try the fan, it really pulls a lot of heat off the insert.

Also, that little stovetop on the insert is in fact big enough to hold a stovetop tegfan. I am running one this year, sorta like it.

 

[kf6hap]

Ashford 20? 25? Or 30?

My stove an Ashford 30 for sure but it might apply to others. Francisco at BK can tell you for sure.

 

[claybe]

Oooh, try the fan, it really pulls a lot of heat off the insert.

Also, that little stovetop on the insert is in fact big enough to hold a stovetop tegfan. I am running one this year, sorta like it.

Like this?!? This is my visual alert that I am getting into cat zone...when it starts to go it’s time to check temps. Also it actually moves the air. I don’t like the fan on the princess unless I need it. It makes it too hot in the house!

 

[Ryan723]

@drhiii In addition to the request for pictures, can you give what you know of your BKP's history?

I seem to recall a post where you said it was used when you got it....but only had one fire? Surely a stove removed and sold after one fire has a bit of a story?

And what if that one fire that should have been a 'break-in' burn was like another BK first-burn we read about on here with the bypass open for an hour+ and embers coming out the stack??

In addition to any issue from running with your bypass open now, just wondering if you have a complicating factor in the stove's history that isn't being accounted for.

 

[darktower007]

If you have a cell phone down load Tapatalk app. It makes uploading pictures and videos easy. If the video is long post it to YouTube, then imbed link. Words help, but the visual evidence can explain it much further.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[drhiii]

Kids, a change. Appreciate the ideas. No need to carry on. Stopping posts.

 

[begreen]

That is what I thought. Stove of this level should be ready to go out of the box. My experience has changed this perception.

That is where I am.. unless something else comes down the pike. Fatter gasket, and a method to bolster the upper left quadrant of the gasket as you muse. Hinge side I might add. Have gone through so many iterations of configuration... am at the crazy ideas stage. As in actually had an engineer look at this and in seconds speculated there was a cyclone effect in the firebox.. something that had been explained to me by someone who went through this. The engineer, after listening to the stages I have reconfigured, said he would try and fashion a plate to weld on the inside of the firebox to alter the flow of air near the hinge side to... nevermind. Was like OMG, crazy idea stage for sure. Am so far from out of the box'.,, insert a measure of nervous, hysterical, not normal normal laughter at that point. The engineer was like.. back off slowly.

And yassir, burning twice as much wood when I run this which I can only do to try and figure things out. At that rate, it is cheaper to run the forced air than try and run the stove, which I can't anyway unless in open bypass mode. Which only diminishes the smoke smell, but not enough to live in it still. I can't even run this stove like a non-cat stove.

There are other alternatives and your sanity also has value. Does your dealer sell other stoves? What do they say? If the problem is not resolved will they take the stove back in exchange for a different stove?

 

[Highbeam]

Kids, a change. Appreciate the ideas. No need to carry on. Stopping posts.

Dang it. No pics. Did he ever even have a princess? Was this just bholler playing a prank?

 

[Highbeam]

I hear you! I had one dying and chugged along with it for a bit. I now get to look up at the top of my chimney and see all the black creosote staining on the first couple rows of bricks.

I have a couple of drips that landed on my class a pipe. They are not easy to remove and a nice reminder to change the stupid cat out when it’s done.

 

[Boxer]

Kids, a change. Appreciate the ideas. No need to carry on. Stopping posts.

I really don’t think there is any reason to carry on unless you post some pictures of your setup. You have all these guys that do this for a living willing to help you and you won’t help yourself. For the love of God, please give them the information they need to help you so we can all move on.

 

[rdust]

Dang it. No pics. Did he ever even have a princess? Was this just bholler playing a prank?

Hes real, been posting since 2006. I just searched a bunch of his old posts and feel it’s a chimney problem unless he’s replaced the chimney since he installed his napoleon 1400. I don’t think he has, he has posted the set up worked well with all his previous stoves.

Triple wall pipe, can someone identify?

Total Chimney Length? City says Ok Manual says No

Total Chimney Length? City says Ok Manual says No


Wanted: Flexible flue piping

Total Chimney Length? City says Ok Manual says No

 

[Ashful]

Dang it. No pics. Did he ever even have a princess? Was this just bholler playing a prank?

... and what kind of doctor gives up on diagnosis so easily?

 

[chazcarr]

Merry Christmas Guys, Need some advice. The BK has been burning fine for the last few weeks, and I am getting nice consistent heat.
I am positive though that I have a high draft problem.
On Christmas day, I noticed that the right side of the cat was cracked. Only 2 months in. I sat and watched and I think it is caused by flames reaching the cat. Even when turned all the way down, flames will occasionally flare up in the box and the cat temp stays right at 1500 for many hours. Flames tend to start at the front of the stove and stay there going right up into the cat.
so now 2 of the cat squares are clearly broken. When glowing red it is easy to spot, however I do not have a good pic of it yet cause of the spark shield.
After I reload, I have to run at 50% stat for the initial burn up. If I stay at 100%, even with the fan on it will start to overheat. Again, I think this is due to the draft? I have 33 feet of insulated liner.

It is a BK Princess insert, so not so sure how something like that can be dampened. Any ideas? Everything is in the chimney behind a wall.
Is this something covered by the warranty? No point getting a new one though until I figure out how to prevent this going forward.

Lastly, could my strong draft be the reason so much smoke is continually coming out of the chimney? It seems white and wispy as it should be, but there is a bit of a smell, and it is consistent. Probably smoke for about 2-3hours before no more is visible. Is that condensation from the long chimney?

Thanks for the help, as I am on vacation at home for the holiday I have some time to play around here.

 

[MtnBURN]

Those past threads say it all. Though he said in this thread he had >no< problems until the BK...it is obvious he struggled to get the Napoleon to work without smoke in the house as well. After that, the lack of pics seal the deal here that it isn't the stove. He changed stoves for a reason...and that was to keep from making the required mods to his house to bring it up to date/make it safe to use. (pics would have unleashed the wrath and he knows it)

But hey..whatever. OK....so who's gonna be the first to tell us our stoves suck and keep this thread on track?

 

[moresnow]

Merry Christmas Guys, Need some advice. The BK has been burning fine for the last few weeks, and I am getting nice consistent heat.
I am positive though that I have a high draft problem.
On Christmas day, I noticed that the right side of the cat was cracked. Only 2 months in. I sat and watched and I think it is caused by flames reaching the cat. Even when turned all the way down, flames will occasionally flare up in the box and the cat temp stays right at 1500 for many hours. Flames tend to start at the front of the stove and stay there going right up into the cat.
so now 2 of the cat squares are clearly broken. When glowing red it is easy to spot, however I do not have a good pic of it yet cause of the spark shield.
After I reload, I have to run at 50% stat for the initial burn up. If I stay at 100%, even with the fan on it will start to overheat. Again, I think this is due to the draft? I have 33 feet of insulated liner.

It is a BK Princess insert, so not so sure how something like that can be dampened. Any ideas? Everything is in the chimney behind a wall.
Is this something covered by the warranty? No point getting a new one though until I figure out how to prevent this going forward.

Lastly, could my strong draft be the reason so much smoke is continually coming out of the chimney? It seems white and wispy as it should be, but there is a bit of a smell, and it is consistent. Probably smoke for about 2-3hours before no more is visible. Is that condensation from the long chimney?

Thanks for the help, as I am on vacation at home for the holiday I have some time to play around here.

That stinks! I wonder if running less than your current 50% setting on the burn in period would tame the beast? Kind of like turning down the air early on a unruly tube stove to maintain control. 33 feet of insulated will no doubt develop impressive draw. Just needs to be controlled. Worth a shot. Another example of each setup being completely individual.

 

[Alpine1]

Merry Christmas Guys, Need some advice. The BK has been burning fine for the last few weeks, and I am getting nice consistent heat.
I am positive though that I have a high draft problem.
On Christmas day, I noticed that the right side of the cat was cracked. Only 2 months in. I sat and watched and I think it is caused by flames reaching the cat. Even when turned all the way down, flames will occasionally flare up in the box and the cat temp stays right at 1500 for many hours. Flames tend to start at the front of the stove and stay there going right up into the cat.
so now 2 of the cat squares are clearly broken. When glowing red it is easy to spot, however I do not have a good pic of it yet cause of the spark shield.
After I reload, I have to run at 50% stat for the initial burn up. If I stay at 100%, even with the fan on it will start to overheat. Again, I think this is due to the draft? I have 33 feet of insulated liner.

It is a BK Princess insert, so not so sure how something like that can be dampened. Any ideas? Everything is in the chimney behind a wall.
Is this something covered by the warranty? No point getting a new one though until I figure out how to prevent this going forward.

Lastly, could my strong draft be the reason so much smoke is continually coming out of the chimney? It seems white and wispy as it should be, but there is a bit of a smell, and it is consistent. Probably smoke for about 2-3hours before no more is visible. Is that condensation from the long chimney?

Thanks for the help, as I am on vacation at home for the holiday I have some time to play around here.

Yep, draft is probably (almost surely) too strong. It is always possible to install a flue damper, even though with inserts it is usually a bit of a job (read: tear down a piece of wall, install dampener with long enough shaft, rebuild wall). Excessive draft is probably the reason you see damage on your cat (ceramic cats are more sensitive to thermal shock than steel ones).
About the smoke: it can be due to the high draft (the chimney “pulls” the smoke trough the cat so fast it cannot be burnt completely) or it can be simple steam. Have you tested the relative moisture content of your wood?
Hope this helps, at least a little.

 

[jetsam]

Merry Christmas Guys, Need some advice. The BK has been burning fine for the last few weeks, and I am getting nice consistent heat.
I am positive though that I have a high draft problem.
On Christmas day, I noticed that the right side of the cat was cracked. Only 2 months in. I sat and watched and I think it is caused by flames reaching the cat. Even when turned all the way down, flames will occasionally flare up in the box and the cat temp stays right at 1500 for many hours. Flames tend to start at the front of the stove and stay there going right up into the cat.
so now 2 of the cat squares are clearly broken. When glowing red it is easy to spot, however I do not have a good pic of it yet cause of the spark shield.
After I reload, I have to run at 50% stat for the initial burn up. If I stay at 100%, even with the fan on it will start to overheat. Again, I think this is due to the draft? I have 33 feet of insulated liner.

It is a BK Princess insert, so not so sure how something like that can be dampened. Any ideas? Everything is in the chimney behind a wall.
Is this something covered by the warranty? No point getting a new one though until I figure out how to prevent this going forward.

Lastly, could my strong draft be the reason so much smoke is continually coming out of the chimney? It seems white and wispy as it should be, but there is a bit of a smell, and it is consistent. Probably smoke for about 2-3hours before no more is visible. Is that condensation from the long chimney?

Thanks for the help, as I am on vacation at home for the holiday I have some time to play around here.

You can switch to a steel cat to fix the cat problem, but you'll still have issues trying to use the stove's low range.

Do you have pictures of the fireplace pre-install? That might help determine if a damper is an option. I think bholler and webby have both installed insert dampers.

If a damper isn't practical, maybe a restrictor plate is an option.

If you get the draft sorted, you will be glad in shoulder season.

 

[Ashful]

Merry Christmas Guys, Need some advice. The BK has been burning fine for the last few weeks, and I am getting nice consistent heat.
I am positive though that I have a high draft problem.

I have 33 feet of insulated liner.

BK specs 0.06”WC maximum draft. My 24’ of insulated liner with 6’ double wall pipe (30’ total) pulled 3x that, at 0.18”WC, and you’re at least 10% taller than me. You need a key damper, or even possibly two key dampers. Your starting point is a manometer, I recommend the magnehelic type, with a 0.25”WC range.

Here’s my rig:

 

[kennyp2339]

I just checked the draft on my setup using a digital manometer, I'm over drafting at .15" h20, bk recommends .05" while running the stove on high, so I will be purchasing a damper and flue probe.

Just got notified that my new duravent dvl 6" adapter w/ damper has arrived, I will be installing this after work, has anyone had any issues with installing one of these? Does it fit good over the flue collar on the stove?

 

[Highbeam]

Just got notified that my new duravent dvl 6" adapter w/ damper has arrived, I will be installing this after work, has anyone had any issues with installing one of these? Does it fit good over the flue collar on the stove?

I own one too. Removed it to replace it with a nondamper version. It fits fine and tight. Hopefully you’ve already removed the weld blob in the collar.

 

[rdust]

I own one too. Removed it to replace it with a nondamper version. It fits fine and tight. Hopefully you’ve already removed the weld blob in the collar.

Yep, I dislike that welded collar. My Lopi had a nice one piece collar(think Lopi said it was well casing) that fit my duravent adapter perfect.