2016-17 Blaze King Performance Thread (Everything BK) Part 2

[webby3650]

Just blow some air through that cat already! Even though you've vacuumed the face, there will be ash build up on the back half of the cat that you will NOT reach any other way. Even if you pull the cat you'll need some air to remove it all. It will take very, very low pressure to remove it. Most of these suggestions and experiences are from ones with cerimac cats or ones that don't burn near as long as you. Build up in the nether regions for others would obviously take longer for "normal" operation. Sweeping the face of the cat works well for 3/4 seasons for most, you have an extreme condition though.

 

[Woody Stover]

What is considered average? I average 5 months 24/7 burning so at that rate I would get less than 3 yrs out of a cat, correct?

Yeah, but there are probably variables within that as well. Are you burning like the guys in AK, air wide open and going through a ton of wood, or just loafin' along in Seattle? Same amount of hours, but...
I think most cat warranties are 6 yrs, 3 yrs. full replacement/3 yrs. prorated.

 

[Highbeam]

Just blow some air through that cat already! Even though you've vacuumed the face, there will be ash build up on the back half of the cat that you will NOT reach any other way. Even if you pull the cat you'll need some air to remove it all. It will take very, very low pressure to remove it. Most of these suggestions and experiences are from ones with cerimac cats or ones that don't burn near as long as you. Build up in the nether regions for others would obviously take longer for "normal" operation. Sweeping the face of the cat works well for 3/4 seasons for most, you have an extreme condition though.

Tonight. It's only 4 pm here. I may even dork out and take pictures! Will clean out the firebox and the dome so I can maybe keep track of how much junk blows out.

Does anyone know if the firecat price of 186$ for a new cat is the regular price? It doesn't say it's a special deal or anything.

 

[webby3650]

Tonight. It's only 4 pm here. I may even dork out and take pictures! Will clean out the firebox and the dome so I can maybe keep track of how much junk blows out.

Does anyone know if the firecat price of 186$ for a new cat is the regular price? It doesn't say it's a special deal or anything.

And it may just be worn out. You are experiencing the same issues my Ashford was having. A little air did the trick!

 

[Woody Stover]

All what i found was this at BK site. Some interstate details here including the use of barometric damper if necessary. (broken link removed to http://blazeking.com/PDF/Wood%20Stove%20TroubleShooting%20Guide.pdf)

BKVP has been mentioning ACI lately, and I think he said Sud Chemie is no longer their supplier. Not that there isn't plenty of useful info in the link you posted... Here's the Applied Ceramics cat page, but I didn't look at their maintenance info yet....
http://www.firecatcombustors.com/category-s/1209.htm

Even though you've vacuumed the face, there will be ash build up on the back half of the cat that you will NOT reach any other way. Even if you pull the cat you'll need some air to remove it all....Build up in the nether regions for others would obviously take longer for "normal" operation. Sweeping the face of the cat works well for 3/4 seasons for most, you have an extreme condition though.

I've seen most of the ash on the face, the way I run. But if you run the BK on full air for half an hour after you close the bypass, or on high for an hour every week, maybe more ash gets sucked into the middle of the cat? You said you don't do all that, so maybe you get away with just cleaning the face once in a while?

 

[Woody Stover]

I may even dork out and take pictures!

Now you're talkin'!
Does anyone know if the firecat price of 186$ for a new cat is the regular price? It doesn't say it's a special deal or anything.[/QUOTE]I'd say that's the regular price, for that ceramic. Sounds about right.

 

[Highbeam]

Now you're talkin'!
Does anyone know if the firecat price of 186$ for a new cat is the regular price? It doesn't say it's a special deal or anything.

I'd say that's the regular price, for that ceramic. Sounds about right.[/QUOTE]

In the past, people have spent much more for ceramic replacements. If 186$ is the new norm then that's great news. They're easy to change so keeping the cost low would make it much more likely that folks would just swap in a fresh one. Heck, people spend 186$ just to have their oil changed.

 

[Woody Stover]

Here's the ACI FAQ: http://www.firecatcombustors.com/Articles.asp?ID=250
Applied Ceramics probably has more info elsewhere, if one were to poke around a bit.

 

[Dieselhead]

So i turned my king back on after a nice cleaning and being off for 2 days. I loaded her up with wood and i never really noticed if it did this before but i can hear like wind being sucked inisde threw the back channel between the fans. I recorded it for you guys to listen but you gotts turn up your speakers a lil but, it kinda sound wierd but the air. I put the microphone in the back of the stove right underneath the air opening. You can her some ticks also whcih is the stove getting hotter. Not sure if the sound id playing threw the uplaod either. Let me know.

I couldn't get your upload to play, but know the noise you mention quite well. My stove has done it since new.

 

[Woody Stover]

people have spent much more for ceramic replacements. If 186$ is the new norm then that's great news.

The old Ws ceramics were $125 from the company. At firecat, Fv $99, Ks $90...but size is only like 20 sq.in. or less. The Princess is about 40, right? King is 50, and $293. And the Buck 91 is about 60 sq.in.... $325. Sounds like your Princess cats are a deal! Grab 'em all, before they wise up!

Heck, people spend 186$ just to have their oil changed.

Holy Cow, that could be @black smoke signals' 24-cylinder Limberger-ini... it must hold about a 50-gal. drum!

 

[webby3650]

BKVP has been mentioning ACI lately, and I think he said Sud Chemie is no longer their supplier. Not that there isn't plenty of useful info in the link you posted... Here's the Applied Ceramics cat page, but I didn't look at their maintenance info yet....
http://www.firecatcombustors.com/category-s/1209.htm
I've seen most of the ash on the face, the way I run. But if you run the BK on full air for half an hour after you close the bypass, or on high for an hour every week, maybe more ash gets sucked into the middle of the cat? You said you don't do all that, so maybe you get away with just cleaning the face once in a while?

Or possibly choosing to shovel rather than using the Ashdump? I don't know, but the steel cats have more trouble with clogging. A quick hit with the vac is enough for a cerimac cat, not always the case with steel in my experience.

 

[lsucet]

Well this is from firecat. I know lately is been discuss the point to not wait for the cat probe to read into the active zone before closed the bypass. Maybe that can be one reason of cat clogging and more with steel cat.

Why Combustors Might Struggle to Work Properly

• Light-Off
  • Light-off was not achieved before the stove's by-pass was closed. This means the catalyst was not at the temperature necessary to receive and burn the inlet gases. This will result in the combustor cells plugging with fly-ash and creosote.
  • When starting a fire in a cold stove, the catalyst needs 500°F of temperature focused on it for 20 — 30 minutes to allow proper light-off.
• Refueling Wet
  • Wet or unseasoned wood will shut the catalytic combustor down at once. This will result in the combustor's cell plugging with fly-ash and creosote. This will also cause thermal shock to the combustor's substrate and hair line cracks will occur in the cell walls.
• Masking
  • Masking blankets the combustor with a substance that prevents catalytic activity. This can occur when burning materials other than seasoned, dry wood.
• Plugging
  • Plugging is a build-up of soot, creosote and/or fly-ash in the combustor's cells. This occurs when the combustor is operated or positioned improperly.
  • Inlet gas temperature must be maintained around 500°F to keep the catalytic reaction active.
  • This will also occur when burning material that produce large flakes of char, I.E. wrapping paper and cardboard.

 

[webby3650]

Well this is from firecat. I know lately is been discuss the point to not wait for the cat probe to read into the active zone before closed the bypass. Maybe that can be one reason of cat clogging and more with steel cat.

Why Combustors Might Struggle to Work Properly

• Light-Off
  • Light-off was not achieved before the stove's by-pass was closed. This means the catalyst was not at the temperature necessary to receive and burn the inlet gases. This will result in the combustor cells plugging with fly-ash and creosote.
  • When starting a fire in a cold stove, the catalyst needs 500°F of temperature focused on it for 20 — 30 minutes to allow proper light-off.
• Refueling Wet
  • Wet or unseasoned wood will shut the catalytic combustor down at once. This will result in the combustor's cell plugging with fly-ash and creosote. This will also cause thermal shock to the combustor's substrate and hair line cracks will occur in the cell walls.
• Masking
  • Masking blankets the combustor with a substance that prevents catalytic activity. This can occur when burning materials other than seasoned, dry wood.
• Plugging
  • Plugging is a build-up of soot, creosote and/or fly-ash in the combustor's cells. This occurs when the combustor is operated or positioned improperly.
  • Inlet gas temperature must be maintained around 500°F to keep the catalytic reaction active.
  • This will also occur when burning material that produce large flakes of char, I.E. wrapping paper and cardboard.

The cells on a steel cat are about half the size of a ceramic cat. In places that demand a higher heat load they tend to clog. I think it's related to a couple of things: a much longer heating season, more activity in the firebox causing more airborn ash(loading, cleaning out ashes) combined with the smaller cells in the cat. From what I'm finding, a steel cat needs pulled every 3/4 years under normal use for a thorough cleaning.

 

[kf6hap]

Cat info and cleaning from Condar:

(broken link removed to https://www.condar.com/combustorcleaningmanual.pdf)

But I would hold off for BKVPs info.

 

[Ashful]

Well this is from firecat. I know lately is been discuss the point to not wait for the cat probe to read into the active zone before closed the bypass. Maybe that can be one reason of cat clogging and more with steel cat.

Why Combustors Might Struggle to Work Properly

• Light-Off
  • Light-off was not achieved before the stove's by-pass was closed. This means the catalyst was not at the temperature necessary to receive and burn the inlet gases. This will result in the combustor cells plugging with fly-ash and creosote.
  • When starting a fire in a cold stove, the catalyst needs 500°F of temperature focused on it for 20 — 30 minutes to allow proper light-off.
• Refueling Wet
  • Wet or unseasoned wood will shut the catalytic combustor down at once. This will result in the combustor's cell plugging with fly-ash and creosote. This will also cause thermal shock to the combustor's substrate and hair line cracks will occur in the cell walls.
• Masking
  • Masking blankets the combustor with a substance that prevents catalytic activity. This can occur when burning materials other than seasoned, dry wood.
• Plugging
  • Plugging is a build-up of soot, creosote and/or fly-ash in the combustor's cells. This occurs when the combustor is operated or positioned improperly.
  • Inlet gas temperature must be maintained around 500°F to keep the catalytic reaction active.
  • This will also occur when burning material that produce large flakes of char, I.E. wrapping paper and cardboard.

A cat plugging with ash, due to normal operation of the stove, is a stove design issue. In this case, mine is plugging with fly ash, while operating in active zone, not creosote. Thankfully, in my case, all ash was on inlet face and was very easily resolved with a vacuum cleaner.

Highbeam may have another issue. I had steelcats clog for two different reasons in my Jotuls:

1. Creo clogging, if it fails to light off, or falls out of active during the burn. This can happen at low burn rates during the latter part of a burn, when a cat is reaching end of life.

2. Distortion due to high cat temps, which can happen if your door or glass seal are leaking. This distortion reduces free passage, and can increase likelihood of creo or ash plugging.

 

[begreen]

Heck, people spend 186$ just to have their oil changed.

What, Lamborghini owners? I'm more used to $35 oil changes.

 

[webby3650]

What, Lamborghini owners? I'm more used to $35 oil changes.

Or powerstroke diesel owners that change it themselves! Mine holds almost 4 gallons of full synthetic!

 

[Highbeam]

It's snowing again and the stove has been lit. I discovered that I could shove my phone up in front of the cat like a periscope and take photos right into the cells. As you might imagine, sweeping the face clean of debris does nothing to remove the debris within the cells. My cells were heavily loaded with the debris. Fingers crossed for some smoke free burning!

 

[tarzan]

It's snowing again and the stove has been lit. I discovered that I could shove my phone up in front of the cat like a periscope and take photos right into the cells. As you might imagine, sweeping the face clean of debris does nothing to remove the debris within the cells. My cells were heavily loaded with the debris. Fingers crossed for some smoke free burning!

I've tried that with my phone, didn't work well for me. I couldn't really see into or through the cells.

Anyway, best of luck to ya!

 

[Ashful]

Isn't there an EPA required 6 yr life for catalysts? I don't recall that being in hours, but will check. I would expect most east coast burners to run up 3500-4000 hrs a year. If the life expectancy is 10,000 hrs that would mean only 1667 hrs a year for those 6 years.

I have never seen anything about an EPA required lifetime of 6 years, only that manufacturers warrant them (pro-rated after year 2) for 6 years. In fact, I assume very few make it to 6 years, in the house of a 24/7 burner. They seem to be willing to replace them, sometimes multiple times, for us rare birds going through them faster than that.

However, the likes of this forum aside, I'm guessing most stove owners burn less than 200 hours per year. At that rate, a combustor might live 50 years!

 

[Ashful]

What is considered average? I average 5 months 24/7 burning so at that rate I would get less than 3 yrs out of a cat, correct?

Correct. No 24/7 burner is an "average" woodstove owner.

 

[Highbeam]

It's like saying a 6 pack of beer will last 6 years. Sure, if you only drank one per year.

I got some pretty good cell photos. As found, after sweeping, and after the deep clean. For me, the best tool was the soft shop vac hose end pressed right up to the cat face. I could hear the cells release their payload into the hose.

 

[Ashful]

I think it would be prudent for some of us to have a spare cat gasket in the cupboard, as I believe this is going to be a recurring theme. Any recommendation on where I can order a proper OEM gasket online?

 

[huauqui]

I think it would be prudent for some of us to have a spare cat gasket in the cupboard, as I believe this is going to be a recurring theme. Any recommendation on where I can order a proper OEM gasket online?

I actually called my dealer for a quote for a pair today.

 

[lsucet]

I think it would be prudent for some of us to have a spare cat gasket in the cupboard, as I believe this is going to be a recurring theme. Any recommendation on where I can order a proper OEM gasket online?

(broken link removed to http://www.hechlers.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=31_9&products_id=799)

Try this site