Where has customer service gone

[stoveliker]

The old rule about local real estate was a doubling every 10 years, and that trend had been tracked by local realtors, going back quite a few decades before I even bought my first home. I hope that trend continues, as home value is a very big part of retirement cash-out, for many.

I really don't get what you're saying.

The point that one should not ever use an average to describe a very asymmetric (income) distribution remains. Using the much more appropriate median, the case is clear.

Moreover, the "home prices double each 10 years" illustrates my point, because median salaries do not double each 10 years (for those of the same age - mine has come close to that, but I'm lucky).

 

[joop]

took me 31yrs to get to 28 bucks an hour

 

[joop]

iv'e been robbed .but i do have 8 weeks vacation

 

[Ashful]

Moreover, the "home prices double each 10 years" illustrates my point, because median salaries do not double each 10 years (for those of the same age - mine has come close to that, but I'm lucky).

I wasn't refuting your point, just noting that the increasing prices isn't negative for everyone... namely those who already own homes.

On salary... doubling every 10 years is only 7% growth, an achievable bar for anyone in the 20-30 years of their career, where promotions and increases for gained experience should be piling on top of regular cost of living increases. Since this came out of a discussion on home buyers and mortgages, that skews the conversation somewhat toward these employees still in the most rapid growth part of their career, not those winding down toward retirement.

My own history includes some rough years of no increases, and several years of very thin increases, but punctuated with promotions and bonuses that brought the 20 year average up above 7% by a comfortable margin. I was citing the issue of those that saw a doubling in two or three years as a serious problem, but doubling every 10 isn't anything outside of normal expectations.

 

[zrock]

Moreover, "should not have to work multiple jobs to buy a house" - has to be contrasted with the 60s and 70s where a single family house could be bought at 2-2.5 times the median income of a SINGLE person.
These days, the median income is 67k$, but there are not that many homes available for 134-167 k$ ...

No should not have to but you totally missed my point on that one... A walmat worker should not be making the same amount of money that someone who has went to school and gotten a trade, or someone that has put the time and effort into making something of them self... Should we be working 2 jobs to buy a house, well that comes down to how bad you want it and how you want to provide for your family.

I think that has always described some portion of the population, and maybe we're just seeing different subsets of the population as we go through our daily travels. I can say with 100% certainty that I also wanted to get the highest pay for the least amount of work, when I started working nearly 40 years ago. I even remember more than one of my college professors stating our goal is all to make as much money with as little work as possible, as an opening argument to a lecture, 30+ years ago.

Did you want the least pay for the most work, when you were young?

I worked my ass off when i was young to make a living, and i actually worked and not stood theirs with a blank look on my face. Maby i see it more than you since i have been in the hiring and firing area for most of my career and i have been lucky and have about a 98% success rate with my hiring to get good people, now for the other department where i work their hiring is probably 30% success and keep getting people (in the trade) that feel they are entitled and do not want to do any thing or learn. I have talked to managers across the area and they are all in the same boat cannot find good help.
Our generation knew how to work and did it.. Heck im still the first one to work and the last one to leave, i have been that way since i was 18

 

[stoveliker]

No should not have to but you totally missed my point on that one... A walmat worker should not be making the same amount of money that someone who has went to school and gotten a trade, or someone that has put the time and effort into making something of them self... Should we be working 2 jobs to buy a house, well that comes down to how bad you want it and how you want to provide for your family.

You missed my point too.

I did not say anything about walmart (or macdonalds or something like that).
I just noted that one used to be able to buy a home, and car, and be proper middle class on one median income per household. That is not possible anymore.
This was in response to "young ones are complaining all the time".

This could quickly go off the rails into politics of social security etc. but there are valid points to be made that folks complaining is not all because of laziness.

I don't think I qualify as a young one anymore, nearing 50. Yet, I feel there is validity in the notion that the American dream is not as accessible anymore as for those who grew up 40 years ago.
Sure there are always folks who work their assess off and make it. Like myself. (I started working when I was 11 (that was illegal...), every Saturday, every day of every school vacation. I'm nearing 50 and calculated that I could retire if I wish, assuming a 3.5% average inflation for the next 50 yrs and me not helping the kids with college costs. (So I won't, also because I don't like such assumptions.)

 

[Ashful]

I did not say anything about walmart (or macdonalds or something like that).
I just noted that one used to be able to buy a home, and car, and be proper middle class on one median income per household. That is not possible anymore.

Our parents didn't provide $1000 smart phones to every member of the household, or pay $250/month ($3k/year) in telephone plans, or carry dozens of subscriptions to everything from Netflix and Prime to tracking and GPS app's for their Tesla. Face it, you can't compare any challenge regarding the purchase of a first home on a level playing field, between today and 40-50 years ago, too many outside factors have changed around it.

Damn, my parents used to yell at me if I left a room with a light on. One stinkin' light! I'd never even dream of making a long-distance call, without special permission, nor did mom buy much pre-packaged food. Different world, in a totally different economic regime.

 

[stoveliker]

I disagree. If there is one way to compare generational economic possibilities (or more correctly, capabilities), it's how much housing you can buy for your income.
Housing is the first necessity - before any and all phones or other subscriptions.

The other way is Big Macs ;-)

 

[Ashful]

Housing is the first necessity - before any and all phones or other subscriptions.

I agree, but unfortunately there's ample evidence to show that much of our population does not. How many people who claim they can't afford a house are carrying a $1000 smart phone on an unlimited data plan? Priorities.

 

[joop]

ya,but you have to have the latest colour duh

 

[zrock]

You missed my point too.

I did not say anything about walmart (or macdonalds or something like that).
I just noted that one used to be able to buy a home, and car, and be proper middle class on one median income per household. That is not possible anymore.
This was in response to "young ones are complaining all the time".

This could quickly go off the rails into politics of social security etc. but there are valid points to be made that folks complaining is not all because of laziness.

I don't think I qualify as a young one anymore, nearing 50. Yet, I feel there is validity in the notion that the American dream is not as accessible anymore as for those who grew up 40 years ago.
Sure there are always folks who work their assess off and make it. Like myself. (I started working when I was 11 (that was illegal...), every Saturday, every day of every school vacation. I'm nearing 50 and calculated that I could retire if I wish, assuming a 3.5% average inflation for the next 50 yrs and me not helping the kids with college costs. (So I won't, also because I don't like such assumptions.)

their is points on both sides of the fence and are both true... But here is the mentality of the younger age, we hire shop clean up guys and that is all they do is clean the shop, quite often you hear you do not pay me enough to do this job. and then they quit or get fired.. Not a hard job to do and pretty lax and they are getting paid extremely well for what they do.

Our parents didn't provide $1000 smart phones to every member of the household, or pay $250/month ($3k/year) in telephone plans, or carry dozens of subscriptions to everything from Netflix and Prime to tracking and GPS app's for their Tesla. Face it, you can't compare any challenge regarding the purchase of a first home on a level playing field, between today and 40-50 years ago, too many outside factors have changed around it.

Damn, my parents used to yell at me if I left a room with a light on. One stinkin' light! I'd never even dream of making a long-distance call, without special permission, nor did mom buy much pre-packaged food. Different world, in a totally different economic regime.

Unfortunately our world has changed do i agree with parents buying their kid a $5000 bicycle or a $1000 cell phone?... NO.. But im one that had to brake the way i feel about cell phones. With as bad as the world has become i did go out and buy my young daughter a cell phone. She is at the age where she wants some freedom and unfortunately the days are long gone were we as kids would disappear for the day and come back at night and our parents would not worry about us. But if my kid wants some freedom she has to have a way to call for help if needed. Still does help my frame of mind she went uptown the other day for the afternoon with friends, i knew were she was but i sat on the edge of my couch for 4 hours waiting for a phone call..LOL

 

[weee123]

their is points on both sides of the fence and are both true... But here is the mentality of the younger age, we hire shop clean up guys and that is all they do is clean the shop, quite often you hear you do not pay me enough to do this job. and then they quit or get fired.. Not a hard job to do and pretty lax and they are getting paid extremely well for what they do.

Define extremely well paid

 

[joop]

minimum wage in quebec in may will be 15.74,that makes 590 before taxes - 30% for taxes =413 taxes could be higher.rent 750 for 11/2 bus pass 75? .heat, electricity 100 per month groceries 75 per week monthly salary 1652 leaves around 877 to play with add cable 139

 

[Ashful]

minimum wage in quebec in may will be 15.74,that makes 590 before taxes - 30% for taxes =413 taxes could be higher.rent 750 for 11/2 bus pass 75? .heat, electricity 100 per month groceries 75 per week monthly salary 1652 leaves around 877 to play with add cable 139

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(second half, if you're impatient)

 

[johneh]

Now I think I'll move to Quebec A decent 1 bedroom apt. around here is 1800 to 2300
A place I wouldn't live, a one-bedroom apt. starts at 1400 The basic old age pension is
around 1200 so I think when I can not keep this old farm going it's off to La Bell Province
Guess I better brush up on my French Tabernak

 

[weee123]

minimum wage in quebec in may will be 15.74,that makes 590 before taxes - 30% for taxes =413 taxes could be higher.rent 750 for 11/2 bus pass 75? .heat, electricity 100 per month groceries 75 per week monthly salary 1652 leaves around 877 to play with add cable 139

Not to be crass but in this day and age and point in my life I wouldn’t even scratch my balls, let alone get out of bed for $15/hour. I’m not sure how the real estate market is in quebec, but for $750 a month here in NJ you are in the ghetto worrying about getting robbed. That’s if you can even find a place for that cheap.

The laborers who are on the construction sites I work at make at least $35 an hour and all they do is clean up.

$15/hr in this day and age and with how much things cost is no better than the $8/hr I made at my first job at the autoparts store 12 years ago.

 

[joop]

nice homless population 750 is a room