Newbie question here - is the BTU value of corn comparable to wood pellets? Are they harder to start burning?
(Ok, 2 questions.) Thanks in advance for any insight and info..
The world has gone mad.
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Newbie question here - is the BTU value of corn comparable to wood pellets? Are they harder to start burning?
(Ok, 2 questions.) Thanks in advance for any insight and info..
Bioburner
Moderator
Most of your biomass fuels are pretty close to same per pound btu wise but the density of corn is more per cubic foot. Can be close to 10% more that pellets. Corn needs another couple hundred degrees to start burning. That's why the older stoves that burn straight corn start with some pellets. With pressure ignition starting corn was resolved.
Probably the same scenario here (Just pellets for getting the old girl going)... unless I go to hard coal and thats a possibility.
I dunno, ask Lake Girl, she has the stats, I don't.
I could build an auger that would transport twist off bottle caps down an auger tube.... of course that don't mean a stove would burn them.....
Bioburner
Moderator
Tell that to every big pellet mill in Georgia, chickenman! EVERY pellet they make goes to Europe. AND we gave them local grants and tax breaks to build here plus they use up our forests. I guess the incentive is that they don't have to deal with picky, uneducated consumers and pushy box store purchasing agents.
Myself, I never roast corn that high. It has to be 12 or less (preferrably less) for me to roast. The higher the moisture the more nitric issues you have and clinkers too....
I'm out on oilseed. A couple winters ago (when corn was stupid high, for kicks and grins I mixed in some soybeans with the pellets (maybe 2 parts pellets and one part beans) to try. The results were a very hot, almost uncontrollable fire. I'll pass on oilseeds.
Life these days is all about who can screw who over, the middle class is getting smaller, either your rich from screwing people over, or poor cause your the fool
Sounds logical to me. I never saw so many finiky pellet buyers until I came to this site. I've had some less than optimum pellets in the past but, they all burned nonetheless.
From a business model, it's more lucrative in the end to sell in bulk rather than smaller quantities, not only is it easier to ship, it takes less labor.
Thats the great thing about seasonally renewable fuels like corn. You get a new batch every fall.
I think what transpires in Oz isn't what occurs here.....
Nuts! Especially in light of the fact that heating oil is so cheap now. I just got an oil fill last Tuesday, $2.06 a gallon! That's btu-equivalent to less than $250 a ton of pellets.
I was referring to....."From a business model, it's more lucrative in the end to sell in bulk rather than smaller quantities, not only is it easier to ship, it takes less labor.....
You don't have that much in forested land anyway...do you??
Gotta be nuts to burn a SPACE HEATER, that's for sure! I'd rather have the whole house warm for less money than watch my money get burned up in a flaming blow torch.
I prefer around 13 to 14, but did burn some 17.9 early on this winter. It burned ok,but lost 20 to 30 * burning off the moisture
CladMaster
Minister of Fire
Lake Girl
Moderator
I don't have a clue ... must be getting great pricing off Ontario to convert the Atikokan PG from coal to pellets.
Resolute Forest Products and Rentech are the two companies doing this. From Resolute's webpage: Another example is the construction of an industrial wood pellet plant that will convert a currently underutilized residual material into a reliable source of renewable energy. This plant will be built adjacent to the Company’s sawmill in Thunder Bay, Ontario, and is scheduled for completion in 2014.
It appears to be that they are using sawmill residuals.... I've seen (live near) an area Resolute just logged over. They didn't slash pile - took the pine and ran. Birch and poplar cut and left lying there. They have lost 3 certificates so far...
(broken link removed to http://www.greenpeace.org/canada/Global/canada/pr/2013/12/Resolute-loses-three-sustainability-certificates-proving-forests-mismanaged.pdf)
Rentech info: (broken link removed to http://www.eadcorporate.com/projects/rentech-wawa-wood-pellet-processing-plant/)
Wawa Facility
This idle strand board plant is being converted to a wood pellet production facility capable of producing approximately 450,000 tons annually. The first contracted delivery is scheduled for the fourth quarter of 2014. The facility is expected to consume approximately 890,000 tons of certified sustainably managed fiber annually.
Old Spartan
Burning Hunk
Fact is ,,,,,, Most new production capacity is being built for "industrial pellets" and export. That is the business plan.
Capital does not purposely accumulate for the construction of unprofitable industry.
It therefore follows that SOMETHING about industrial pellets makes them cheaper to produce otherwise the new production would not be constructed.
5% ash tells me there are by products in these pellets that residential pellets do not contain. These by products MUST lower the cost basis of the product. Add to this the lower cost per ton of shipping ,,,, The lower cost of administrating a business that deals with a few large customers instead a myriad of small businesses. Do not forget the financial advantage of secure long term contracts for production.
I am sure there are other inputs that lower the cost too.
In my preretirement career my plant served 19 accounts -- One accounted for 24% of our volume and 21% of our profit. We had a 12 year contract to serve that account. A second was 19% of volume and 17% of profit with a 10 year contract. They accounted for less than 10% of our service costs COMBINED. I would gladly have traded the other 17 (with 1 - 3 year contracts) for two more of the larger accounts with long term deals.
There is a lot that goes into business plans and decisions that are behind the scenes.
The most important thing I as a consumer keep at the front of my mind is ...... In the modern world of commerce I am insignificant to an entity that conducts business on a National or International level. I purchase most consumable commodities from large businesses because I am price sensitive regarding such items. I purchase most NON commodities from small local firms because service becomes a larger issue than price and I am not insignificant to the small business owners. I am still deciding where my pellet supply fits into that mind set.
The majority here and everywhere largely follows the same purchasing pattern. Most simply nver give it conscious thought and therefore fail to realize it.
Capital does not purposely accumulate for the construction of unprofitable industry.
It therefore follows that SOMETHING about industrial pellets makes them cheaper to produce otherwise the new production would not be constructed.
5% ash tells me there are by products in these pellets that residential pellets do not contain. These by products MUST lower the cost basis of the product. Add to this the lower cost per ton of shipping ,,,, The lower cost of administrating a business that deals with a few large customers instead a myriad of small businesses. Do not forget the financial advantage of secure long term contracts for production.
I am sure there are other inputs that lower the cost too.
In my preretirement career my plant served 19 accounts -- One accounted for 24% of our volume and 21% of our profit. We had a 12 year contract to serve that account. A second was 19% of volume and 17% of profit with a 10 year contract. They accounted for less than 10% of our service costs COMBINED. I would gladly have traded the other 17 (with 1 - 3 year contracts) for two more of the larger accounts with long term deals.
There is a lot that goes into business plans and decisions that are behind the scenes.
The most important thing I as a consumer keep at the front of my mind is ...... In the modern world of commerce I am insignificant to an entity that conducts business on a National or International level. I purchase most consumable commodities from large businesses because I am price sensitive regarding such items. I purchase most NON commodities from small local firms because service becomes a larger issue than price and I am not insignificant to the small business owners. I am still deciding where my pellet supply fits into that mind set.
The majority here and everywhere largely follows the same purchasing pattern. Most simply nver give it conscious thought and therefore fail to realize it.
I'd be surprised if the ash content was <5%. Higher bark content and the use of undesirable southern hardwood species NOT used for lumber production are also reasons for higher ash content.
I wouldn't be surprised if waste pallet wood and demolition end up in industrial pellets.
The placement of these plants is curious. Most are 100 miles or less from port (no brainer). Just outside or very near high population density areas and close to heavily farmed areas. I've heard of possible eucalyptus, sugar cane byproduct and hemp feedstocks in the works for southern mills.
My curiosity makes me wonder if in the near future cellulosic crop residue ,farm wastes, waste from food production (fruit pulp/seeds),wood demolition ( Florida landfills are impossible to permit due to water table/nimbyism), etc will be used/mixed with wood for industrial pellet production = cheaper,,,, if not a profit center from tipping fees.
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