Reloading Times

[Woodsplitter67]

Your influence and command on this site is well known...... surely you took pics of these many cracked stoves to share and educate us so the danger that is preached here is also backed up? Please post them up.

There is a reason the price point is where it is.. No body makes a quality cast or steel and sells it at a low price. Your getting what your paying for. If you think your purchasing zinc plated nuts and bolts and getting the same quality as stainless steel nuts and bolts your wrong. Not all steel is the same. There are high quality stove.. medium quality and low quality.. the op has a really low quality stove. If you have the same stove.. its a low quality stove also. The people her including myself are here to help.. nobody here including myself have to prove anything.. If you dont like what people have to say,dont post.. Were here to help and educate, sometimes the truth hurts. I stand by my.post above.. This stove is slightly better grade then that average burn barrel. As I stated above Id be concerned about using that in my home.. Others seem to agree.. @bholler doesn't have to post anything. A person can look and see the quality of say a grill and see the quality and decide for themselves. There a big difference between a 200 dollar grill and a 1200 dollar grill.. the one for 200 is basically a throw away.. the 1200 dollar grill will last for years..

 

[Vg3200p]

I think it's great that the op is doing what he can with what he has. Not everyone can drop 3k on a stove. I happen to like my us stove co that I bought for $899. It's better than freezing

 

[bholler]

I think it's great that the op is doing what he can with what he has. Not everyone can drop 3k on a stove. I happen to like my us stove co that I bought for $899. It's better than freezing

No not everyone can but I would absolutely go with an older used steel stove than one of the boxwood POS stoves.

The ussc steel stoves aren't bad. There are better ones available from SBI and Englander for just a little more. But their steel ones are just fine

 

[BillBurns]

I know its not ideal, but for free, ill take it any day. I just want to know how itll burn me out of a house, if the flue is cleaned? Im not running 700-900F, more like 450F. And I doubt it will crack. I have mexican cast iron skillets that cook the same way as my Griswolds and Wapaks. Plus I happen to like the look of this stove. Call me dumb, ignorant, uninformed, whatever. You only live once. Dont worry, be HAPPY!

 

[BillBurns]

And what is a Kerosene heater? Nothing more than a tank of kerosene with a wick in it. Like a Molotov Cocktail I guess.

 

[bholler]

I know its not ideal, but for free, ill take it any day. I just want to know how itll burn me out of a house, if the flue is cleaned? Im not running 700-900F, more like 450F. And I doubt it will crack. I have mexican cast iron skillets that cook the same way as my Griswolds and Wapaks. Plus I happen to like the look of this stove. Call me dumb, ignorant, uninformed, whatever. You only live once. Dont worry, be HAPPY!

No one is calling you dumb or ignorant. You clearly understand the limitations of your stove. They just aren't tight enough to be controllable. So your strategy of controlling it be loading small amounts is reasonable.

As far as kerosene heaters I wouldn't use one because of air quality not really fire risk. The same reason I won't use unvented gas

 

[Ashful]

I think it's great that the op is doing what he can with what he has. Not everyone can drop 3k on a stove. I happen to like my us stove co that I bought for $899. It's better than freezing

Agreed. But bholler's point is correct, that there are far better and safer options at or near that price point (Drolet, Englander, 2nd hand options). Use what you got, but do stay aware of the potential flaws, and keep your eye open for a better option.

 

[begreen]

I think WisdomOak's US stove model is a basic steel stove and not the cast iron box stove in question. Some of them were not that bad. The Vogelzang Performer was a decent step-top heater. Their cast iron box stoves OTOH were not tight fitting, had a tendency to crack, and were notoriously hard to control. Many on the used market are ashen gray or even white from frequent overfirings. Most concerning is that a lot of people carried on the budget idea with flimsy installs and not honoring the substantial clearance requirements of those stoves.

 

[appointed EPA deviant]

There is a reason the price point is where it is.. No body makes a quality cast or steel and sells it at a low price. Your getting what your paying for. If you think your purchasing zinc plated nuts and bolts and getting the same quality as stainless steel nuts and bolts your wrong. Not all steel is the same. There are high quality stove.. medium quality and low quality.. the op has a really low quality stove. If you have the same stove.. its a low quality stove also. The people her including myself are here to help.. nobody here including myself have to prove anything.. If you dont like what people have to say,dont post.. Were here to help and educate, sometimes the truth hurts. I stand by my.post above.. This stove is slightly better grade then that average burn barrel. As I stated above Id be concerned about using that in my home.. Others seem to agree.. @bholler doesn't have to post anything. A person can look and see the quality of say a grill and see the quality and decide for themselves. There a big difference between a 200 dollar grill and a 1200 dollar grill.. the one for 200 is basically a throw away.. the 1200 dollar grill will last for years..

I think I struck some sort of a nerve with you. Why?, I don't even know who you are and wasn't posting to you.
I simply asked for a pic of maybe one of he many cracked USSCo stoves bholler has seen.
It would be helpful as all pictures on here are.....In fact it is one of the first questions asked when someone is actually looking for help on here....."Can you post a pic?
A pic is worth a 1000 words when helping and educating. I really can't understand why I am being chastized by you or anyone for that matter for asking for a pic. A pic that could surely help any one of the MANY owners of these stoves as to where to look for these CRACKS.

INBOLD......right back at you!

..... sorry for this type of reply because I am not trying to start a pissing match.....PM me if you wish to continue a conversation on this topic. No need to hyjack the OP.

 

[bholler]

I think I struck some sort of a nerve with you. Why?, I don't even know who you are and wasn't posting to you.
I simply asked for a pic of maybe one of he many cracked USSCo stoves bholler has seen.
It would be helpful as all pictures on here are.....In fact it is one of the first questions asked when someone is actually looking for help on here....."Can you post a pic?
A pic is worth a 1000 words when helping and educating. I really can't understand why I am being chastized by you or anyone for that matter for asking for a pic. A pic that could surely help any one of the MANY owners of these stoves as to where to look for these CRACKS.

INBOLD......right back at you!

I will look online and try to find some examples later today after installing an insert and liner.

 

[appointed EPA deviant]

Totally agree that IF the OP wishes to upgrade, he may find a great used unit in his area. I'd actually post a WTB as I believe many folks have tried and given up on heating with wood......for a variety of reasons. Or are upgrading stoves themselves.

 

[bholler]

Totally agree that IF the OP wishes to upgrade, he may find a great used unit in his area. I'd actually post a WTB as I believe many folks have tried and given up on heating with wood......for a variety of reasons. Or are upgrading stoves themselves.

Yeah there are allot of old stoves replaced because they aren't very efficient don't have glass etc but are very solid. They would be a big upgrade for the op and usually only cost a couple hundred dollars.

 

[BKVP]

I thought this thread was about burn times. I'll share my loading schedule. I'm running on 3-4 NIELS every 8-12 hours (today it is -1F) so the thermostat is running a bit higher. My much better half is home and is able to monitor the fire for me while I am at work.

I do like the NIELS for several reasons:

1) I still have not emptied ashes after 2.5 months of burning.
2) Each log is nearly identical in weight to the next
3) I can monitor the number of lbs of biomass being consumed every 24 hours
4) They stack neatly

Things I don't like:
1) I wish the logs were 10" diameter. My KE40 looks pretty sad with just 3-4 4"diameter logs
2) They are stored in my garage (detached) and did I mention it's -1 today
3) They are "dusty" but my vacuum has no problems (in fact much better than cordwood debris) for clean up
4) Did I mention a 4.27 cu ft firebox looks sad with only 3-4 NIELS laying in there

My plan, once I finish my study of NIELS performance is to then run NIELS + Western Larch in combined runs. I am doing this all to study ash accumulation in the combustors, creosote development in stack and firebox and lastly east of use. I have just enough NIELS to finish up in February or so. Then I'll run straight cordwood and weigh each and every load so inputs are about equal in terms of Btu's.

Now back to burn time intervals folks....

 

[BillBurns]

Thanks for the post. I think thats great what you are doing...keep it up! And post results if you can in the spring.

 

[appointed EPA deviant]

I thought this thread was about burn times. I'll share my loading schedule. I'm running on 3-4 NIELS every 8-12 hours (today it is -1F) so the thermostat is running a bit higher. My much better half is home and is able to monitor the fire for me while I am at work.

I do like the NIELS for several reasons:

1) I still have not emptied ashes after 2.5 months of burning.
2) Each log is nearly identical in weight to the next
3) I can monitor the number of lbs of biomass being consumed every 24 hours
4) They stack neatly

Things I don't like:
1) I wish the logs were 10" diameter. My KE40 looks pretty sad with just 3-4 4"diameter logs
2) They are stored in my garage (detached) and did I mention it's -1 today
3) They are "dusty" but my vacuum has no problems (in fact much better than cordwood debris) for clean up
4) Did I mention a 4.27 cu ft firebox looks sad with only 3-4 NIELS laying in there

My plan, once I finish my study of NIELS performance is to then run NIELS + Western Larch in combined runs. I am doing this all to study ash accumulation in the combustors, creosote development in stack and firebox and lastly east of use. I have just enough NIELS to finish up in February or so. Then I'll run straight cordwood and weigh each and every load so inputs are about equal in terms of Btu's.

Now back to burn time intervals folks....

I had to research what NIELS are.
Does the aprox. 10 to 12 logs per day keep your house livable without any back up heating source?

I'm only asking because there are many posts about long burn times (reload intervals), especially with cat stoves, without saying ;

A. what temp it keeps their house
B. what level of insulation their house has
C. square footage of house OR portion of house you live in/heat
D. if the wood fuel doesn't provide sufficient heat what percent is needed in back up heat?
E. I realize I should be asking question A. to the lady of the house (if there is one) to get an honest.... er I mean accurate answer.

I appreciate that you mentioned your local temps and amount of fuel used, but I can't help but think that the longer the BTUs get strung out (as is possible in a cat stove) the more likely is that a back up heat source is kicking in.

So NIELS cost aprox. $2.30 per log when you buy a 240 log pallet?

 

[BKVP]

I had to research what NIELS are.
Does the aprox. 10 to 12 logs per day keep your house livable without any back up heating source?

I'm only asking because there are many posts about long burn times (reload intervals), especially with cat stoves, without saying ;

A. what temp it keeps their house
B. what level of insulation their house has
C. square footage of house OR portion of house you live in/heat
D. if the wood fuel doesn't provide sufficient heat what percent is needed in back up heat?
E. I realize I should be asking question A. to the lady of the house (if there is one) to get an honest.... er I mean accurate answer.

I appreciate that you mentioned your local temps and amount of fuel used, but I can't help but think that the longer the BTUs get strung out (as is possible in a cat stove) the more likely is that a back up heat source is kicking in.

So NIELS cost aprox. $2.30 per log when you buy a 240 log pallet?

Well the logs are $300 a skid here. My house is 1895 Craftsman 2,850 Sq ft, very upgraded to be energy efficient. (R34 in all walls...made them into 2 x 6 walls during remodel.

We do have a full house HVAC furnace that runs on NG. We do NOT rely on the furnace for warmth in the living space. It is used to keep old plumbing designs in exterior walls and crawl spaces from freezing. If it drops below 15F, we use furnace And set it at 69. All registers are closed...EXCEPT basement registers.

12 logs can easily keep us at 69-71 for 18-24 hours, depending on outside temps. Anyone that owns a BK, knows the energy is metered out, so no big swings in temps.

 

[Ashful]

I can't help but think that the longer the BTUs get strung out (as is possible in a cat stove) the more likely is that a back up heat source is kicking in.

Yes, at least some of us have done this. When I was on a work schedule that was only allowing a reload every 12 hours, I was just setting the stove for that interval, ignoring the actual heating demand of the house. How much heat each floor demanded from the oil-fired boiler would vary with outside temperature.

You're only putting 500k - 1M BTU into the box per load, depending on wood species and stove size. If you choose to dole it out at a rate lower than the heat loss of your house, you get to choose between being cold and letting the central heating pick up some of the slack.

The beauty of the BK's and others that can support very long burn times, is having the flexibility to choose the burn rate that suits your schedule or heat demand, even when the demand is very low or the available reload windows are far apart.

 

[begreen]

I will look online and try to find some examples later today after installing an insert and liner.

He can search for them. They are here. I'll start -

Buy old 26000 Buck Stove or new Vogelzang boxwood stove?

I am looking to get a wood burning stove to heat my workshop which is about 20x30. I want to stay on the cheap side so was looking for help with a decision: Either get the Buck Stove 26000 insert/free standing wood stove or a new Vogelzang boxwood stove. Both of them are not EPA certified...

www.hearth.com

Vogelzang Boxwood wood stove

I just bought one of these small boxwood stoves (super deal) as an introduction to wood stoves. I cannot justify spending $1500 on a stove and another $1000 on installation so I decided to spend three months with this to figure out what I really want (or do not want!) I am going to plumb this...

www.hearth.com

 

[Jotel me this]

I only reload one or two pieces at a time, once it is up to running temps. I just dont feel safe loading it to the gills. Its more trouble to load so often, but I can control the fire and burn rate with my damper. I get one hour burns, but low wood useage. I just try to keep it between 300-500 F. I never burn overnight, Im not comfortable enough for that. How often, and how much do you reload? And I have no luck with the top down method. I can have a fire built and running 400 F in less time than it takes to stack up all the wood, ect. To each their own tho, cause Ive heard great stuff about it. Just not my thing.

Its whatever works for you. For me, loading full is more efficient, burns longer and hotter. Loading one piece at a time (for me) I find lowers the internal temp of the stove leading to energy loss used to get the stove back up to temp.

 

[Ashful]

Its whatever works for you. For me, loading full is more efficient, burns longer and hotter. Loading one piece at a time (for me) I find lowers the internal temp of the stove leading to energy loss used to get the stove back up to temp.

Not just you. At least on a cat stove, efficiency plummets when you have to open the bypass to reload and then leave it open to get back up to secondary light-off temp. I imagine a similar effect takes place with non-cats, albeit sans bypass damper.

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

Well the logs are $300 a skid here.

If I could get a pallet of these for $300, I certainly would give them a try. NIELs Inc states that a pallet is equivalent to about 1.5 - 2 cords of dry firewood. I believe the shipping to Illinois would more than double that price. They weigh about 1 ton per pallet.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

If I could get a pallet of these for $300, I certainly would give them a try. NIELs Inc states that a pallet is equivalent to about 1.5 - 2 cords of dry firewood. I believe the shipping to Illinois would more than double that price. They weigh about 1 ton per pallet.

The Red stone ones are pretty good if you can get them near you.. They are sold by tractor supply.. I tried them just to see how they perform.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

I’ve used the ones from TSC. They work well. I like mixing it in with cordwood though.

 

[BKVP]

If I could get a pallet of these for $300, I certainly would give them a try. NIELs Inc states that a pallet is equivalent to about 1.5 - 2 cords of dry firewood. I believe the shipping to Illinois would more than double that price. They weigh about 1 ton per pallet.

@begreen knows the name of NIELS distributor. They may have a dealer near you...

 

[appointed EPA deviant]

Not just you. At least on a cat stove, efficiency plummets when you have to open the bypass to reload and then leave it open to get back up to secondary light-off temp. I imagine a similar effect takes place with non-cats, albeit sans bypass damper.

Secondary burn stoves are more like traditional stoves from what I am reading on here concerning your cat stoves. Only diff is that we achieve a more efficient burn of the gasses than an older pre EPA stove....at least my build does. It goes into secondary burn within 15 minutes of start up.
I heat with wood in my basement and duct to the entire house. I doubt there is a cat unit that could maintain an avg. home in this type of set up when the need for BTUs is at a max like now with -5 and -40 windchill. ..... At least not without losing long burn bragging rights.

Educate me. Does any manufacturer offer a wood stove with a central ducted system in the catalytic type stove?