Outdoor boiler / how they work

[E Yoder]

You'd have to experiment. It won't change it significantly as far as efficiency goes. Probably burn cooler.

 

[brenndatomu]

Question of the day
Would it be any benifit to get rid of the grate and fire brick the bottom? Direct the draft either up the back or front of the unit. It seems most wood stove do not have grates, even an old bk i used to have.

Does the air come in under the grate? If so then you can't eliminate it...if not then you probably can...not sure it would make much difference though

 

[E Yoder]

It comes in under the grates, so you'd have to fab up some kind of air channel to bypass the grates. I'm not sure what benefit there would be.

 

[Indianawood]

I

It comes in under the grates, so you'd have to fab up some kind of air channel to bypass the grates. I'm not sure what benefit there would be.

s there no benefits to firebrick on the bottom?

 

[E Yoder]

No. There's sand or maybe ash beside the grates on that model that insulate anyway.
An updraft water jacketed boiler is completely different than a warm air furnace. It's a cool fairly dirty burn. That's why all the new style outdoor boilers are downdraft models that blow the wood gas into a separate brick chamber to burn off.

 

[Indianawood]

No. There's sand or maybe ash beside the grates on that model that insulate anyway.
An updraft water jacketed boiler is completely different than a warm air furnace. It's a cool fairly dirty burn. That's why all the new style outdoor boilers are downdraft models that blow the wood gas into a separate brick chamber to burn off.

Sand? Is there supposed to be sand between the L brackets and water jacket?

 

[E Yoder]

I'm going by memory and maybe I'm confused with a Heatmor. Sorry. I'm probably wrong there. But what I'm saying is the ash insulates pretty well, having firebrick underneath wouldn't make a noticable difference I'd guess. The whole firebox is water cooled so it burns fairly cool and dirty. Not saying it doesn't work, I'm just saying tweaking the air inlets into the firebox isn't the main thing that makes it what it is.
Basically it's a super basic updraft burn with no heat exchanger tubes or baffles, just a pipe out the top. A lot of heat lost out the chimney, but it works and there are thousands of them chugging along here in my neck of the woods.

 

[Indianawood]

I'm going by memory and maybe I'm confused with a Heatmor. Sorry. I'm probably wrong there. But what I'm saying is the ash insulates pretty well, having firebrick underneath wouldn't make a noticable difference I'd guess. The whole firebox is water cooled so it burns fairly cool and dirty. Not saying it doesn't work, I'm just saying tweaking the air inlets into the firebox isn't the main thing that makes it what it is.
Basically it's a super basic updraft burn with no heat exchanger tubes or baffles, just a pipe out the top. A lot of heat lost out the chimney, but it works and there are thousands of them chugging along here in my neck of the woods.

Do you know of any hacks for the Hardy H2 to slow the heat out the stack that anyone has had luck with? The one i saw that i was going to try was sticking the 6" pipe 6" into the firebox

 

[brenndatomu]

But what I'm saying is the ash insulates pretty well, having firebrick underneath wouldn't make a noticable difference I'd guess

My brother uses a large CB and has found that leaving lots of ashes in it helps...he only cleans it out a few times per winter now...basically when there isn't enough room for wood
The other thing that helps is to not fill the firebox...he now only loads only the front half of the firebox, and only as high as needed for a 12 hour...has saved lots of wood this way...she's still a smoky pig though!

 

[Indianawood]

My brother uses a large CB and has found that leaving lots of ashes in it helps...he only cleans it out a few times per winter now...basically when there isn't enough room for wood
The other thing that helps is to not fill the firebox...he now only loads only the front half of the firebox, and only as high as needed for a 12 hour...has saved lots of wood this way...she's still a smoky pig though!

Ok thanks. I don't think there's any way around the smoke. Hard to justify getting rid of something that smokes but works to spend 10k plus. I'll have around $1500 in this. Including pipes

 

[brenndatomu]

I'll have around $1500 in this. Including pipes

Must be a pretty short run...the only brand lines that are worth having are $12-15/ft.

Hard to justify getting rid of something that smokes but works to spend 10k plus

Its not just about the smoke...that smoke represents wasted BTU's/wasted firewood...lotta extra work...but like you said before, it will work long enough to save up for an upgrade.

 

[Indianawood]

Must be a pretty short run...the only brand lines that are worth having are $12-15/ft.

Its not just about the smoke...that smoke represents wasted BTU's/wasted firewood...lotta extra work...but like you said before, it will work long enough to save up for an upgrade.

Doing my own lines. Foam in place. 50ft

 

[brenndatomu]

Doing my own lines. Foam in place. 50ft

Ah, that's right...sounds like that works fine, as long as the right materials/procedures are used.

 

[Indianawood]

Ah, that's right...sounds like that works fine, as long as the right materials/procedures are used.

Going an extra step. Using closed cell pipe insulation and then foaming in place

 

[maple1]

Ok thanks. I don't think there's any way around the smoke. Hard to justify getting rid of something that smokes but works to spend 10k plus. I'll have around $1500 in this. Including pipes

You might find justification reasons after living with it for a year or two.

 

[E Yoder]

I don't think extending the pipe into the firebox will help much, it's still a straight shot up the chimney with no impact into the water.
I've heard of guys hanging an auger or deflector in the chimney below the water line, to make the hot exhaust hit the sidewalls and dump heat into the water.

 

[Case1030]

I'm going by memory and maybe I'm confused with a Heatmor. Sorry. I'm probably wrong there. But what I'm saying is the ash insulates pretty well, having firebrick underneath wouldn't make a noticable difference I'd guess. The whole firebox is water cooled so it burns fairly cool and dirty. Not saying it doesn't work, I'm just saying tweaking the air inlets into the firebox isn't the main thing that makes it what it is.
Basically it's a super basic updraft burn with no heat exchanger tubes or baffles, just a pipe out the top. A lot of heat lost out the chimney, but it works and there are thousands of them chugging along here in my neck of the woods.

The Heatmor has what they call a dry bottom with sand + they also have 2.5" brick lined Firefox part way. Simple boiler I haven't examined them much in person. The Heatexchangers are square tubes above the firebox. To me they burned well bit of smoke but not bad at all.

I know the newer Ultimizer by Portage&Main have a dry bottom + 2.5" Brick linned firebox part way up. Being mild steel they put a Stainless Steel linner/sleeve between the bricks and the 1/4 mild steel to reduce ash corrosion and dry bottom keeps the ash bed hot.

They have air being introduced both from the grates and above the fire to create a type of hybrid gasification very hot intense fire with a Multipass Heat exchanger which I thought was impressive. When looked at few in operation zero smoke -few minutes after call for heat until idle.

Very important to have dry wood, adequate heat, and oxygen.