Now they're rationing LP keep those stoves going!

[WiscWoody]

The cost increase is supply and demand driven and it seems the price of LP in the East is higher due to more LP users/population and the need to attract more shipments of LP. But it does smell a little fishy when supplies are short and then a refinery or this Wisconsin LP hub has shut down for "maintenance" when it's product is in short supply.

A few years ago when gasoline was sky high they found out a small refinery in California was still running after they claimed they were shutting down for maintenance. The state became suspicious since they had been monitoring the emissions coming from the refinery and they never changed as they should have from a shutdown!!

DOH!!

 

[WiscWoody]

How much does a tank go for...generally?

Just a guess but based on what I paid for my 8 year old 500 gallon LP tank that I was leasing at the time- $700, I'd say around $400 for a 250 gallon tank. Call your or any LP supplier and ask them and compare new and used price for whatever size tank you need.

 

[TmbrCrk]

Propane prices here in the U.P. is $4.63/gal.!! I am sitting at 24%, the propane lady said not to worry till 15%. I am hoping I can make it till the price comes back down a bit. Only using it for hot water heater and oven. Lennox Montecito is working hard to keep house warm.

 

[bag of hammers]

Propane prices here in the U.P. is $4.63/gal.!! I am sitting at 24%, the propane lady said not to worry till 15%. I am hoping I can make it till the price comes back down a bit. Only using it for hot water heater and oven. Lennox Montecito is working hard to keep house warm.

Yeah, I just paid $0.92 for a litre + tax put it well over a dollar/ litre = over $4 / gallon. What a jump from last fill.

Generally I've called in the past when I get to @ 30% and that gives them a couple weeks to get out there, which they're been good about so far. This time I hit 30% just before Christmas, called them up and anticipated an early new year's delivery. I started to panic when the tank hit just over under 15% and still no delivery by mid Jan. I met the driver out there this week and he said they're going crazy right now. They always fill my tank to 80% capacity (250 gal of fuel in a 325 gallon tank) which normally gets me through the season. This year is crazy cold. I started with @ 60% when the cold snap hit early. Guess I should be topping it up in Nov regardless of how much is in the tank. Either that or get a bigger tank, which I asked them to scope out for me last week.

 

[Paulywalnut]

I only use LP for oven. Just about the same price as last year around here.

 

[begreen]

Not just a propane shortage. It is becoming a fuel shortage in cold areas, firewood included. This is when the grasshoppers get separated from the ants.

http://www.pressherald.com/news/Cold_Maine_weather_strains_firewood_supply.html

 

[begreen]

Wood too as posted in the other thread
http://www.pressherald.com/news/Cold_Maine_weather_strains_firewood_supply.html

 

[Badfish740]

Just saw a story today saying that it's hitting us here in the Northeast as well. We rely on oil for backup heat but propane cooks the food. I'm really hoping the 100lb tank I had filled last March is going to last at least a full twelve months... Better tell the wife no using the self clean feature until this blows over

 

[firefighterjake]

Not just a propane shortage. It is becoming a fuel shortage in cold areas, firewood included. This is when the grasshoppers get separated from the ants.

http://www.pressherald.com/news/Cold_Maine_weather_strains_firewood_supply.html

And this is why I am several years ahead . . . no ordering of kiln dried wood in middle of winter or cutting down dead trees in an effort to stay warm for me.

On a related note . . . I had propane delivered Monday for my oven/hot water . . . still haven't seen the bill. Am not looking forward to seeing it with the current news on the cost.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

Ahhh.....Propane $4 a gallon if you can find it. Warm feeling of having a years supply of heat in your backyard.....................................priceless!

 

[MishMouse]

Yes, firewood is also becoming scarce. Some people around here are selling pickup loads for $200.
With 2013 being well below average temps with above average rainfall a lot of people didn't really get a good supply of wood.
With all the rain that fell from August-October the wood that people was able to get got drenched.
Add to that double digits below zero since the beginning of December, then a shortage of propane, plus above average snowfall, people are in trouble this year. Fuel assistance budgets are being stretched to their limit, there is just not enough money to pay for fuel costs.

Listening to the news you hear of house fires almost on a daily basis, because people are running electric heaters or someone lighting stoves and fireplaces that hasn't been used/cleaned in years.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

Yes, firewood is also becoming scarce. Some people around here are selling pickup loads for $200.
With 2013 being well below average temps with above average rainfall a lot of people didn't really get a good supply of wood.
With all the rain that fell from August-October the wood that people was able to get got drenched.
Add to that double digits below zero since the beginning of December, then a shortage of propane, plus above average snowfall, people are in trouble this year. Fuel assistance budgets are being stretched to their limit, there is just not enough money to pay for fuel costs.
Listening to the news you hear of house fires almost on a daily basis, because people are running electric heaters or someone lighting stoves and fireplaces that hasn't been used/cleaned in years.

Fuel cost are variable MM. Like an acquaintance of mine always says "poor planning" or no planning. People should have an emergency fund but they dont. They should have savings but they dont. I Always try to have the whole winters worth of fuel stockpiled by fall. Did the same when i had oil. It was cheaper in the summer anyway. Same old same old. Some of the guys here have 3-4 years supply of wood. An example of good planning.

 

[_CY_]

after Katrina .. there was NO shortage but big oil used that as an excuse to double prices overnight. big oil claimed disruption for fuel all over USA, when in fact there were only two refineries down due to storm.

the fact that nearby refineries could overnight pickup the slack made no difference. everyone panicked by running to gas stations. which created a real shortage by filling everyone's tanks.

the same thing is happening .. no real shortage .. only perception of shortage which triggers everyone to fill their tanks all at the same time. which really does create a shortage.

when supplies does ease up, don't be surprised if prices never come back down .. ever ..

 

[jdonna]

Spot price in Minnesota is toggling 4.15 a gallon and going up. I put a call in to try and sell my contract. Tank is at 75% and sitting on 400 gallons contracted. When I called in they said "what, you are lucky" how could this be. I said solid fuel. Response, "how could this be". Answer, simple, burn more wood.

Feel sorry for the elderly on fixed income, not contracting or budgeting right now paying spot price.

 

[firefighterjake]

Egads . . . got my propane bill today. $4.05 per gallon.

 

[Warm_in_NH]

Just saw that the local power company (public service of NH) kept their main generator which runs on natural gas at 25% today and plan on it for the rest of this cold snap, and ran their 4 other giant generators which run on jet fuel (diesel) take up the difference.
Supposedly the 4 others are "back up" for when the main one that runs on the ng starts to max out. Due to the high demand for ng they throttled back and fired up the diesel. First time they ever resorted to such actions. Interesting.

(broken link removed to http://www.psnhnews.com/press-releases/psnh-power-plant-fleet-called-during-cold-snap)

 

[granpajohn]

Many commercial ng users have "interuptable" contracts. In the case of one I worked closest with, they agree to switch over to fuel oil within an hour of being notified by Washington Gas Co. All figured in to the gas utility's calculations long before it happens.
Many run coal, ng, No.2 fuel, or No. 6 fuel. The 6 seems to be going out of style.

In the case I mentioned, it's not just steam. They also run gas powered turbines for chilling in the summer. Some steam is also needed in summer for hot water,etc.
that's long-story-short.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

My propane supplier called last week to "make sure" we hadn't run out of fuel. I assured them we were fine,tanks are sitting @60%. "Is this a year round residence?"she asks."Yes it is",I tell her. "Well, what else are you heating with?" None of your buisiness is what I thought! I told them I am using pellets. "well your contract requires you to use at least 100 gallons per year,last delivery was one year ago."
"Well,I don't need, or want a delivery. Can't afford it. How's about I pay the rental fee for the tanks?" I ask. "You'll still be billed for 100 gallons." I'm told." What's the current price per gallon?" I ask. "you'll have to talk to our manager,I can't tell you" What? Well, I'm told it's $3.90 per gallon. "BS,I aint takin no delivery". They tell me I'll be billed for the 100 gal whether I take delivery or not! Last year,in January,price was $2.74. WTF!!
After talking with the manager,he has agreed to leave me alone till april. At which time they are gonna come and take one of the 120 gallon tanks.(Have 2 currently)
Boy,are these bastards greedy! Trying to strong arm me into takin 100 gallons,needed or not!
I mean,I offered to pay the rental fee for the tanks. I know they need to make money,but damn!

buy tanks or drop propane all together, look back over your contract and verify if that statement is in the contract, if it is , find another source if possible and work out a contract with no minimums.

if there is no contractual agreement on minimum delivery annually then sue them if the bill you I bet you could find a lawyer who would love to litigate this case unless you have a contract which does stipulate a minimum.

they only have a strong arm when its the only arm in the neighborhood, do some looking see if they have a competitor, enlist their service explain the case and let them know you have friends who could become customers. its that simple , as long as there is competition unless they have formed a trust where they collude to **** you together someone will take less rather than none , and he/she is youre leverage.

 

[yooperdave]

Locally, the price of LP took a HUGE leap.
It was going for 2.70 a gallon on Tuesday-Thursday, its 4.35 a gallon Just what happened??

 

[bbfarm]

Its all over the news now how the price doubled and no propain to be found.

It doesn't matter if you have a contract or not.

I checked with 3 of my friends that have propane furnaces.

#1 said she just got some delivered, but only 200 gallons. they wouldn't fill her up. She has a wood stove so will be alright.

#2 said she hadn't heard about it. She has an indoor add on wood furnace so will be ok, but is running low on wood.

#3 called her propane dealer who she has a prepaid contract with for auto fill at $1.59 a gallon. They told her too bad. the contract is null and void in situations like this. They might be able to bring her some propane if they get some at an inflated price of over $3.oo a gallon. She has no alternative heat source.

 

[IHATEPROPANE]

Its all over the news now how the price doubled and no propain to be found.

It doesn't matter if you have a contract or not.

I checked with 3 of my friends that have propane furnaces.

#1 said she just got some delivered, but only 200 gallons. they wouldn't fill her up. She has a wood stove so will be alright.

#2 said she hadn't heard about it. She has an indoor add on wood furnace so will be ok, but is running low on wood.

#3 called her propane dealer who she has a prepaid contract with for auto fill at $1.59 a gallon. They told her too bad. the contract is null and void in situations like this. They might be able to bring her some propane if they get some at an inflated price of over $3.oo a gallon. She has no alternative heat source.

This is why IHATEPROPANE. You have a contract and when it hurts the dealer they say too bad. Jack the price up and tear the contract......thank god there are alternatives.

 

[Wachusett]

I just got an automatic delivery last weed that I did not need (tank was at 50%). They wanted $4 a gallon. I called and said what the...........!
After requesting they not come again until called, she opened my account and realized they overcharged me.
They own the tank (they claim) and this puts me in a contract (hostage position). The contract price is $2.79 and she will
send a revised bill. $2.79 is a lot better than $4 but still painful.

 

[WiscWoody]

This is why IHATEPROPANE. You have a contract and when it hurts the dealer they say too bad. Jack the price up and tear the contract......thank god there are alternatives.

I do recall a provision in a fuel contract when I was a newb to the rural heating scene that gave them a out if the cost spiked high and it was out of their control. I burn wood now and there's no such Clause in the wood I scavenge during the summer!

 

[bbfarm]

I just think its lousy. Why have contracts at all then? My friend had to prepay X amount to lock in that price in advance.

They just told her to look on the back of her contract.

 

[bbfarm]

oh, and the govenor says they will set up warming shelters for people without heat due to propane. Meanwhile all their pipes freeze in their house.......