New Kuuma VF100 Install

[Ncguy427]

Even though you are heating a large area/volume, your climate doesn't get very cold....and it sounds like your place is somewhat efficient.

My house is just decent now. It was built in 1986, so whatever the standard was back then is what’s in the walls. Maybe R13, or lower even. It has older double pane windows, I’m fairly certain they ran out of money when working on the upstairs and tried to do a lot of the finish work themselves. The difference in quality of mud work is significant between upstairs and downstairs. The bathroom up there they cut out part of the wall behind the toilet because they put the drain too close to the wall. So the toilet bowl sat about 1/4 way in the wall lol. And they had to set the toilet on a 2 inch perch so they would have the required grade for the pipe, because they put the toilet on the wrong wall lol. I had to redo that entire bathroom an all the plumbing.

As for insulation, there was none between the rooms and the attic space that surrounds them upstairs, except some styrofoam that appeared to be from a childrens toy, and only between a few studs. Off one of the rooms is a short walkway to the attic over the garage and there was no blow insulation. Nothing insulating that room from the area over the garage. I could just go on and on. So I’ve been working on it myself. Had blow done in all the spots that needed it. Put up the foam boards on the walls that separate the living space from the attic space upstairs. And i noticed a big difference this winter with my old stove.

But I’m sure all my door seals are lacking, and there must be tons of other places where I’m losing tons of heat. But that seems to be ok. It got down to about 20 last night and I woke up the the house was 74. And quickly went back up to 77. VF is still on the lowest setting. I can’t afford to make the house any tighter or I’ll never be able to run the stove lol. I can’t believe how well it works without having to make any modifications to anything. I was expecting some period where I’d have to maybe tweak it as I figure out how to make it work best for my house but that wasn’t the case.

 

[Gbawol42]

My house is just decent now. It was built in 1986, so whatever the standard was back then is what’s in the walls. Maybe R13, or lower even. It has older double pane windows, I’m fairly certain they ran out of money when working on the upstairs and tried to do a lot of the finish work themselves. The difference in quality of mud work is significant between upstairs and downstairs. The bathroom up there they cut out part of the wall behind the toilet because they put the drain too close to the wall. So the toilet bowl sat about 1/4 way in the wall lol. And they had to set the toilet on a 2 inch perch so they would have the required grade for the pipe, because they put the toilet on the wrong wall lol. I had to redo that entire bathroom an all the plumbing.

As for insulation, there was none between the rooms and the attic space that surrounds them upstairs, except some styrofoam that appeared to be from a childrens toy, and only between a few studs. Off one of the rooms is a short walkway to the attic over the garage and there was no blow insulation. Nothing insulating that room from the area over the garage. I could just go on and on. So I’ve been working on it myself. Had blow done in all the spots that needed it. Put up the foam boards on the walls that separate the living space from the attic space upstairs. And i noticed a big difference this winter with my old stove.

But I’m sure all my door seals are lacking, and there must be tons of other places where I’m losing tons of heat. But that seems to be ok. It got down to about 20 last night and I woke up the the house was 74. And quickly went back up to 77. VF is still on the lowest setting. I can’t afford to make the house any tighter or I’ll never be able to run the stove lol. I can’t believe how well it works without having to make any modifications to anything. I was expecting some period where I’d have to maybe tweak it as I figure out how to make it work best for my house but that wasn’t the case.

Posts like this make me want to get rid of the Heatmax and get the vf100. Especially with that tax rebate right now

 

[Ncguy427]

Posts like this make me want to get rid of the Heatmax and get the vf100. Especially with that tax rebate right now

You won’t regret it. And what the guys here told me was true, it’ll never be cheaper than it is right now with the tax credit, not to mention the ever rising steel prices that will likely result in more price increases over time. This furnace is so efficient it’s crazy. With my old one I’d get 3-4hrs of good heat out of poplar loaded to the brim. With the VF I got 9 hours of blower time on about 2/3-3/4 of a load, so roughly the same size as filling up only old stove. And even after the blower shut off I had a ton of coals hours later. I’d have to burn hickory in my old stove to even have a small chance of coals after 12hrs. The way it controls the burn is super impressive. The furnace just seems to run like a Swiss watch.

 

[JRHAWK9]

Posts like this make me want to get rid of the Heatmax and get the vf100. Especially with that tax rebate right now

It's no doubt a better furnace, but keep in mind where you live compared to Ncguy....you are going to have a higher heat load. I'm not trying to talk you out of it, but just want you to be aware that unless your place is super well insulated, you will not see the same inside temps as he is due to how much colder you are up there.

The way it controls the burn is super impressive.

yep! It makes burning wood stupid easy.

 

[Ncguy427]

So I talked to Dale yesterday and he gave me a couple tips to not overheat the house, we turned my low limit switch up to 120, which should make the blower run for shorter periods of time. And he also said to turn the thermostat down all the way which will ensure only the low speed fan comes on and not the high. these two things seemed to help. It was warmer today and I didn’t run the stove last night, I let it burn out yesterday morning. House was down to 69 this morning so I started a fire with about a half load of poplar and it only got up to 74, and it was much warmer today than the past few days when it was getting up to 77.

I kinda regret meticulously taping and sealing all the joints and seams In the duct work between the VF and my central unit. I wouldn’t mind the basement being a bit warmer. I was used to it being 80 degrees all day with my old stove. So another thought I had was to put a register on the plenum of the VF to get more heat down here and less upstairs, when necessary.

 

[Gbawol42]

It's no doubt a better furnace, but keep in mind where you live compared to Ncguy....you are going to have a higher heat load. I'm not trying to talk you out of it, but just want you to be aware that unless your place is super well insulated, you will not see the same inside temps as he is due to how much colder you are up there.

I hear ya there. I have to do 2 full loads in the Heatmax per day in November. Then try and squeeze in a third smaller load the rest of the colder months. I still burn about 200 gal of propane with the furnace kicking on in the morning to heat the house back up on the really cold days (usually just a few degrees). Buuuuuuuut 200 gal is a lot better than the 1200 gal I was burning pre wood furnace.

 

[JRHAWK9]

So another thought I had was to put a register on the plenum of the VF to get more heat down here and less upstairs, when necessary.

yep, that would do the job!

 

[yooperdave]

Posts like this make me want to get rid of the Heatmax and get the vf100. Especially with that tax rebate right now

Keep in mind that it is a tax credit and not a tax rebate. Only way you'll see it is in the form of a credit on taxes owed to feds...

 

[brenndatomu]

in the form of a credit

Form! 👍👍👍

 

[brenndatomu]

I hear ya there. I have to do 2 full loads in the Heatmax per day in November. Then try and squeeze in a third smaller load the rest of the colder months. I still burn about 200 gal of propane with the furnace kicking on in the morning to heat the house back up on the really cold days (usually just a few degrees). Buuuuuuuut 200 gal is a lot better than the 1200 gal I was burning pre wood furnace.

Sounds a lot like when I had my Tundra 1 (after the mods) (you might be running a bit more wood than I was...and I didn't have to use any auxiliary heat) but the VF just plays with the same heat load.

 

[Ncguy427]

hear ya there. I have to do 2 full loads in the Heatmax per day in November. Then try and squeeze in a third smaller load the rest of the colder months. I still burn about 200 gal of propane with the furnace kicking on in the morning to heat the house back up on the really cold days (usually just a few degrees). Buuuuuuuut 200 gal is a lot better than the 1200 gal I was burning pre wood furnace.

that’s been one of the major differences between my old stove and the VF. I’d pack the stove full of oak or hickory around 11pm and most mornings and I’d wake up and the house would be between 64-67 degrees, depending on how cold it was. Unless I loaded again at 4am whixh didn’t happen much . And I could only get up to 70-71 on the coldest days even during the day. Now with the VF it’s still 74 in the morning, blower is still running and putting out heat. I hated the cold mornings.

 

[yooperdave]

Form! 👍👍👍

.....took my time and made damn sure!

 

[sloeffle]

Posts like this make me want to get rid of the Heatmax and get the vf100. Especially with that tax rebate right now

I'm in the same boat. I'm tried of babysitting my Caddy from December - March. I'm even tossing around the idea of a OWB ( G4000 ) to get the mess out of my basement.

 

[Ncguy427]

I'm in the same boat. I'm tried of babysitting my Caddy from December - March. I'm even tossing around the idea of a OWB ( G4000 ) to get the mess out of my basement.

So far, there is no babysitting the VF. It’s actually quite boring, but in a good way. Sometimes I just crack open the door just to see what’s going on in there lol. Even from a cold start it’s basically all automated. I’ve done a few the last few days cause it’s been warmer. I’ll put my paper in and kindling on the bottom, but on top of that I’ll do like 3 rows of full size splits. You leave the ash door open for about 10 mins until it gets hot enough for the computer to open up the draft door and take over.. Then I close it up and leave it for the next 8hrs. It’s all so simple.

 

[brenndatomu]

Even from a cold start it’s basically all automated. I’ve done a few the last few days cause it’s been warmer

I have really dialed in my "cold starts" this winter...haven't had to do many for a month or so now though, we actually got some real winter temps here for once!
I have a couple buckets full of noodles (what you get when you rip a log with a nice sharp chain saw) I think they were pine or some low BTU wood like that...not sure to be honest, it was some "mystery wood" from my bosses property.
Anyways, I also made myself a bunch of small kindlin from 1/2" and 3/4" thick pallet wood (not sure what it is...very light, and very flammable!)
What I do is clean the grate off, then throw a lil paper on it, throw some noodles on that, a lil kindlin on the noodles, and a few more noodles on top (all the noodles I use in total fit in my palm) then drop a match on it with the ashpan door open, and then close the firebox door...it only takes about 30 seconds to have a bright relatively smoke free fire going, then I load my wood on that.
Pretty much as soon as the computer opens the damper, I close the ashpan door...then I check my baro operation, and the draft, double check that the doors are both fully latched...walk away for 8-12 hours (depending on load size and outdoor temp)
Now If I have a few hot coals the only change is that I don't have to use a match, the noodles take right off once I crack the ashpan door and close the FB door...and like I said, that pallet kindlin really flares up nicely!
If I have plenty of hot coals then just load wood and walk away...its usually burning before I close the door...like you said, boring.

 

[woodey]

So far, there is no babysitting the VF. It’s actually quite boring, but in a good way. Sometimes I just crack open the door just to see what’s going on in there lol. Even from a cold start it’s basically all automated. I’ve done a few the last few days cause it’s been warmer. I’ll put my paper in and kindling on the bottom, but on top of that I’ll do like 3 rows of full size splits. You leave the ash door open for about 10 mins until it gets hot enough for the computer to open up the draft door and take over.. Then I close it up and leave it for the next 8hrs. It’s all so simple.

I have really dialed in my "cold starts" this winter...haven't had to do many for a month or so now though, we actually got some real winter temps here for once!
I have a couple buckets full of noodles (what you get when you rip a log with a nice sharp chain saw) I think they were pine or some low BTU wood like that...not sure to be honest, it was some "mystery wood" from my bosses property.
Anyways, I also made myself a bunch of small kindlin from 1/2" and 3/4" thick pallet wood (not sure what it is...very light, and very flammable!)
What I do is clean the grate off, then throw a lil paper on it, throw some noodles on that, a lil kindlin on the noodles, and a few more noodles on top (all the noodles I use in total fit in my palm) then drop a match on it with the ashpan door open, and then close the firebox door...it only takes about 30 seconds to have a bright relatively smoke free fire going, then I load my wood on that.
Pretty much as soon as the computer opens the damper, I close the ashpan door...then I check my baro operation, and the draft, double check that the doors are both fully latched...walk away for 8-12 hours (depending on load size and outdoor temp)
Now If I have a few hot coals the only change is that I don't have to use a match, the noodles take right off once I crack the ashpan door and close the FB door...and like I said, that pallet kindlin really flares up nicely!
If I have plenty of hot coals then just load wood and walk away...its usually burning before I close the door...like you said, boring.

Mystery noodles 🤔

 

[Ncguy427]

Those tips from Dale are working pretty well. It’s 35 out and in managing to keep the house around 70-72. Much better than 77-78.

I had a idea tonight. I run a small saw milling business on the side and have always wanted to build a kiln. What if I built a small one right next to the house and ran
A pretty big supply duct from the supply that goes from my VF to my central unit. Then installed a motorized damper controlled by a thermostat and set it up in that once the house hit whatever temp we have set, it would stop supplying heat to the house and send it to the kiln. I’d have to run a return fresh air return into the furnace room which isn’t a problem. I think the only concern would be temp stability in the kiln, but if I was running the VF on a higher setting I think it would be sending most of the heat into the kiln keeping temp fairly consistent. I’d have to make sure my insurance company is cool with that. But what are y’all’s thoughts in terms of the furnace and ducting?

 

[Micdrew]

My house is just decent now. It was built in 1986, so whatever the standard was back then is what’s in the walls. Maybe R13, or lower even. It has older double pane windows, I’m fairly certain they ran out of money when working on the upstairs and tried to do a lot of the finish work themselves. The difference in quality of mud work is significant between upstairs and downstairs. The bathroom up there they cut out part of the wall behind the toilet because they put the drain too close to the wall. So the toilet bowl sat about 1/4 way in the wall lol. And they had to set the toilet on a 2 inch perch so they would have the required grade for the pipe, because they put the toilet on the wrong wall lol. I had to redo that entire bathroom an all the plumbing.

As for insulation, there was none between the rooms and the attic space that surrounds them upstairs, except some styrofoam that appeared to be from a childrens toy, and only between a few studs. Off one of the rooms is a short walkway to the attic over the garage and there was no blow insulation. Nothing insulating that room from the area over the garage. I could just go on and on. So I’ve been working on it myself. Had blow done in all the spots that needed it. Put up the foam boards on the walls that separate the living space from the attic space upstairs. And i noticed a big difference this winter with my old stove.

But I’m sure all my door seals are lacking, and there must be tons of other places where I’m losing tons of heat. But that seems to be ok. It got down to about 20 last night and I woke up the the house was 74. And quickly went back up to 77. VF is still on the lowest setting. I can’t afford to make the house any tighter or I’ll never be able to run the stove lol. I can’t believe how well it works without having to make any modifications to anything. I was expecting some period where I’d have to maybe tweak it as I figure out how to make it work best for my house but that wasn’t the case.

Your house sounds a lot like mine I’m also into my first year with the VF100 and was dealing with the same “problem” house was getting to warm 76range, I prefer 72-74, I took the advise of @JRHAWK9 and @brenndatomu and bought a pet scale so I can weigh my wood now I can consistently keep the house between 72-74 and save a little wood too, obviously There’s a few other factors to consider, indoor/outdoor temp wind or no wind anyway glad you’re happy with it!

 

[brenndatomu]

Your house sounds a lot like mine I’m also into my first year with the VF100 and was dealing with the same “problem” house was getting to warm 76range, I prefer 72-74, I took the advise of @JRHAWK9 and @brenndatomu and bought a pet scale so I can weigh my wood now I can consistently keep the house between 72-74 and save a little wood too, obviously There’s a few other factors to consider, indoor/outdoor temp wind or no wind anyway glad you’re happy with it!

Mine is actually an inexpensive shipping scale...think it was $30-40 3-4 (5?) years ago...probably twice that now though!

 

[Gbawol42]

Mine is actually an inexpensive shipping scale...think it was $30-40 3-4 (5?) years ago...probably twice that now though!

So do you guys have a formula for x pounds of wood will give you x amount of heat/btu? Then you kinda just guess how many pounds you need based on current weather conditions?

 

[Micdrew]

So do you guys have a formula for x pounds of wood will give you x amount of heat/btu? Then you kinda just guess how many pounds you need based on current weather conditions?

@brenndatomu probably does but I’ve just kinda learned how many pounds my house needs to keep it at the desired temp.

 

[brenndatomu]

So do you guys have a formula for x pounds of wood will give you x amount of heat/btu? Then you kinda just guess how many pounds you need based on current weather conditions?

I have a rough idea in my head, based on experience...I have threatened to write it down into a chart for my wife to use, but never have...so far she almost never loads anyways....and the chart would likely be a little different for every house.
But if you think about it, yes, at least with a Kuuma, and known dry wood, it can be kinda figured out...Daryl says that they are set up to burn:
3-4 lbs per hour on low
5-7 lbs per hour on medium
8-9 lbs per hour on high
There are lots of variables, but that'll get you in the ballpark...

 

[Gbawol42]

I have a rough idea in my head, based on experience...I have threatened to write it down into a chart for my wife to use, but never have...so far she almost never loads anyways....and the chart would likely be a little different for every house.
But if you think about it, yes, at least with a Kuuma, and known dry wood, it can be kinda figured out...Daryl says that they are set up to burn:
3-4 lbs per hour on low
5-7 lbs per hour on medium
8-9 lbs per hour on high
There are lots of variables, but that'll get you in the ballpark...

The thing I wish the Heatmax had the most. A low, medium, and high.

 

[brenndatomu]

The thing I wish the Heatmax had the most. A low, medium, and high.

Just to be clear, the VF has more than just L/M/H...it's actually infinitely variable from minimum to maximum burn rate...

 

[Ncguy427]

Your house sounds a lot like mine I’m also into my first year with the VF100 and was dealing with the same “problem” house was getting to warm 76range, I prefer 72-74, I took the advise of @JRHAWK9 and @brenndatomu and bought a pet scale so I can weigh my wood now I can consistently keep the house between 72-74 and save a little wood too, obviously There’s a few other factors to consider, indoor/outdoor temp wind or no wind anyway glad you’re happy with it!

Ya it definitely takes some trial and error to not overheat the house. Guess it’s kinda better to have too much heat than not enough? Its crazy since low is only like 10k btu. I bet on high with a full load I could get house up to 90 degrees. And some of these days are our colder days. High teens to low 20s overnight and 30s during the day. That’s cold for Nc. With my old stove with those temps I’d wake up go 64-65 degree house and I’d be lucky to hit 70 during the day running it full blast all day. And the VF is so efficient and controls the burn so well. I’m burning 1/2 as much wood as I was. I’ll probably start selling and donating more of my wood. As it stands now I have enough for probably 5-6 years. And I still have tons of dead standing to take down. With my old stove it was 3 years worth. apparently the VF doesn’t do quite as well with really dry wood, and most of this will be very dry by the time I get around to burning it.

The tips I got from dale have helped quite a bit. raising the low limit switch temp makes it so the blower doesn’t run for as long, and it doesn’t come on quite as often. And also turning the thermostat down all the way so the high speed doesn’t come on helped too.