Need Help With Smoke Leaking Into Home

[bholler]

WA state legislature made the wording vague so that some local authorities interpret it to be required on all new installs. That was not supposed to be the intent. It was supposed to be for all new home construction, the thinking that these homes would be tighter.

Like i said i don't know the local code you would have to check with the local code authority then

 

[brenndatomu]

Just tried a quick test. Disengaged the cat. Didn't notice any difference in smoke output. Hmmm . . .

Funny you say that, I was just sitting here contemplating the possibility that the cat or bypass is not functioning properly. Like say, the cat has failed from excessive smoke long term, or maybe the bypass is not closing (seating) properly...? Not familiar with the particulars on the inner workings on this model

 

[Tenn Dave]

Just tried a quick test. Disengaged the cat. Didn't notice any difference in smoke output. Hmmm . . .

It almost sounds like your cat has failed. Is it possible for your dealer to do a temporary swap with a known functioning cat to totally eliminate the cat as being the problem?
Sometimes when I am in a rush and engage my cat too soon before the firebox gets really hot enough, I will see and smell smoke coming from the stack outside. I then bypass the cat again and open up the air all the way until stove temps rise past the temp needed to fire the cat. I wait a few more minutes and then engage the cat again. This works every time for me. The chimney smoke and smell immediately disappear. Just a thought. And if you can't do the cat swap, I would try the vinegar deep cleaning process.

 

[blueguy]

Sounds like your bypass door may need adjustment. Mine has had to be adjusted twice this season, and my stove is only a year old. The gasket is getting replaced next season.

If the bypass isn't sealing right, you'll get some smoke leaking by. I doubt this is why you have the smoke smell inside, but it might explain the constant smoke outside. Before you swap out cats, burn the stove on high for a bit - the cat probe should rise (and hold) and the cat itself should start glowing. If both of those happen, your cat is GTG. Although if it is clogged up a bit, the high burn will self-clean it too.

The other thing I would look at is the cat gasket itself. Is it there, intact, and sealing the cat body to the housing?

Edit: we had some warmer weather one night this week, and I started getting the smoke smell again. I almost burned my nose, but I am 99% sure it's not coming from the probe hole. It seems to be coming from the top left of the door, although my gasket is good, dollar bill test passed and no visual signs of soot / creosote on the outer parts of the knife edge. Odd. Once I can start back to 24 hr burns again, I'm going to chase this down properly.

 

[Edav]

I also have the slight smell top left of door, but on Princess.

 

[Parallax]

The cat definitely glows when I have the fire burning well. Yet I get smoke no matter how I burn the damn thing. Have been running regular wood this past weekend. Still a steady stream of smoke. When the stove is cool, I'll pull down the protective plate and give it a visual inspection and clean any buildup. Would not surprise me if the bypass plate needs adjustment. Adjusted it once but it didn't seem to have much effect. Perhaps the gasket is bad. How would one inspect that?

The smell inside the house is reduced but has not gone away entirely. No doubt stove is running better without OAK. Very odd that the OAK would have suffocated the fire. The four inch pipe was completely clear of obstructions. And given what a short run it had, I'm surprised there was a problem. Yet there's no denying the difference. Perhaps, for the stove, it was like drinking cool air through a straw.

 

[maple1]

The smell inside the house is reduced but has not gone away entirely. No doubt stove is running better without OAK. Very odd that the OAK would have suffocated the fire. The four inch pipe was completely clear of obstructions. And given what a short run it had, I'm surprised there was a problem. Yet there's no denying the difference. Perhaps, for the stove, it was like drinking cool air through a straw.

Not overly surprising, if the inlet for it is on the side of the house away from prevailing winds. The prevailing winds would actually serve to create a vacuum on that side of the house, and it would have had a slight sucking effect on the OAK vent. So the fire was being pulled from both sides. At worst, that is - it was likely at least creating a blocking effect.

 

[begreen]

Theory is that the oak was acting like a vacuum sucking on the intake of the stove. This was due to it being located on the opposite side of the house from the prevailing winds. The leeward side of the house is at lower or negative pressure. The problem could be compounded by the chimney location relative to the roof and surrounding terrain.

http://www.woodheat.org/the-outdoor-air-myth-exposed.html

 

[Parallax]

I don't imagine it makes sense to run the oak down through the floor and then across the crawl space to the windward side of the house. Though there'd be positive pressure at the intake, that's a very long straw through which the stove would be sucking its air supply. Probably best to just let it chow down on air from inside the house, no?

It is a fairly new home (constructed in 2006). If I run exhaust fans when the stove's not on, it will suck wood smoke into the house. We've nut been running the exhaust fans at all during heating season out of fear of worsening the wood smoke. Would it maybe be a good idea to install some sort of air exchange system into the wall of the house? I understand those run about $1500.

 

[Tenn Dave]

I don't imagine it makes sense to run the oak down through the floor and then across the crawl space to the windward side of the house. Though there'd be positive pressure at the intake, that's a very long straw through which the stove would be sucking its air supply. Probably best to just let it chow down on air from inside the house, no?

It is a fairly new home (constructed in 2006). If I run exhaust fans when the stove's not on, it will suck wood smoke into the house. We've nut been running the exhaust fans at all during heating season out of fear of worsening the wood smoke. Would it maybe be a good idea to install some sort of air exchange system into the wall of the house? I understand those run about $1500.

If your crawl space is adequately vented, I would think you could just run the OAK straight down into the vented space. But you would need to check if it is code in your area.

 

[Parallax]

That's an interesting idea. Would be really easy to pull the vents on the windy side of the house. Not sure if the result would be good in terms of overall heating as it would allow cold air into the crawl in winter, cooling the ground story floors and make the stove's job that much harder.

 

[maple1]

I don't imagine it makes sense to run the oak down through the floor and then across the crawl space to the windward side of the house. Though there'd be positive pressure at the intake, that's a very long straw through which the stove would be sucking its air supply. Probably best to just let it chow down on air from inside the house, no?

It is a fairly new home (constructed in 2006). If I run exhaust fans when the stove's not on, it will suck wood smoke into the house. We've nut been running the exhaust fans at all during heating season out of fear of worsening the wood smoke. Would it maybe be a good idea to install some sort of air exchange system into the wall of the house? I understand those run about $1500.

How are humidity levels in your house?

If not high (high would be rare in winter), you might not (likely won't) have to run exhaust fans at all this time of year. We have an HRV, and it doesn't run at all, all winter. Don't have any other exhaust fans. Our house is fairly tight, but the winter time stack effect might be moving enough air through your house without needing anything else. Actually if there is enough of a stack effect, it might also hinder chimney draft too.

 

[Tenn Dave]

That's an interesting idea. Would be really easy to pull the vents on the windy side of the house. Not sure if the result would be good in terms of overall heating as it would allow cold air into the crawl in winter, cooling the ground story floors and make the stove's job that much harder.

You make some good points that need to be considered. Is your floor over the crawl space insulated? Also, you need to be concerned about freezing pipes. But in your warmer climate it might not be an issue. My crawl space in Tenn is vented but winters are warm enough and heat leakage into the space from the main house protects the pipes.

 

[Parallax]

How are humidity levels in your house?

If not high (high would be rare in winter), you might not (likely won't) have to run exhaust fans at all this time of year. We have an HRV, and it doesn't run at all, all winter. Don't have any other exhaust fans. Our house is fairly tight, but the winter time stack effect might be moving enough air through your house without needing anything else. Actually if there is enough of a stack effect, it might also hinder chimney draft too.

At this moment, the hydrometer by the stove reads 37.5. Upstairs it's quite a bit wetter, as we get condensation on skylights. I'm thinking of putting a dehumidifier upstairs as the stove doesn't seem to be able to dry out the air for the full 2650 square foot envelope.

 

[Tenn Dave]

How are humidity levels in your house?

If not high (high would be rare in winter), you might not (likely won't) have to run exhaust fans at all this time of year. We have an HRV, and it doesn't run at all, all winter. Don't have any other exhaust fans. Our house is fairly tight, but the winter time stack effect might be moving enough air through your house without needing anything else. Actually if there is enough of a stack effect, it might also hinder chimney draft too.

After my Mother-in-law uses the bathroom, you would wish to god that you had a functioning exhaust fan year round ! I also like to use the kitchen exhaust fan when cooking certain foods like fried fish. Just a thought.

 

[Parallax]

You make some good points that need to be considered. Is your floor over the crawl space insulated? Also, you need to be concerned about freezing pipes. But in your warmer climate it might not be an issue. My crawl space in Tenn is vented but winters are warm enough and heat leakage into the space from the main house protects the pipes.

Yes, it's insulated well because the house was designed with radiant heat. It doesn't get that cold around here and our pipes are pex, which is pretty forgiving in the event they do freeze. Just paid to add some insulation to the water pipes so there's no way they should freeze. When we go out of town for more than a few days and shut the heating system down, just to be on the safe side I shut the water to the house and drain the system.

 

[Parallax]

After my Mother-in-law uses the bathroom, you would wish to god that you had a functioning exhaust fan year round ! I also like to use the kitchen exhaust fan when cooking certain foods like fried fish. Just a thought.

We use the exhaust fans in the upstairs bathrooms because of the moisture issues on that floor. Doesn't seem to make the smoke issue worse (at least not enough to notice). For a while, we were just opening windows because we weren't sure. The downstairs range exhaust hasn't gotten much use but if we were cooking something really smelly, we'd probably have to turn it on.

 

[Tenn Dave]

We use the exhaust fans in the upstairs bathrooms because of the moisture issues on that floor. Doesn't seem to make the smoke issue worse (at least not enough to notice). For a while, we were just opening windows because we weren't sure. The downstairs range exhaust hasn't gotten much use but if we were cooking something really smelly, we'd probably have to turn it on.

All kidding aside, when I run the exhaust fans in the winter when the wood burner is on, I crack open a window in that room.

 

[blacktail]

With the warm weather recently, any draft or air problems are gonna be worse.

 

[blueguy]

The cat definitely glows when I have the fire burning well. Yet I get smoke no matter how I burn the damn thing. Have been running regular wood this past weekend. Still a steady stream of smoke. When the stove is cool, I'll pull down the protective plate and give it a visual inspection and clean any buildup. Would not surprise me if the bypass plate needs adjustment. Adjusted it once but it didn't seem to have much effect. Perhaps the gasket is bad. How would one inspect that?

The smell inside the house is reduced but has not gone away entirely. No doubt stove is running better without OAK. Very odd that the OAK would have suffocated the fire. The four inch pipe was completely clear of obstructions. And given what a short run it had, I'm surprised there was a problem. Yet there's no denying the difference. Perhaps, for the stove, it was like drinking cool air through a straw.

When's the last time you did a dollar bill test on your bypass? It should be snug all the way around all 4 sides. For the cat gasket, you should be able to visually see a continuous run of cat gasket around the cat. You could also check to see if there's any play in the cat in the housing, i.e. it should be in there snug.

Can you post a pic of the stove end of your oak pipe? The pic further back didn't look like you had the OAK adapter on it, which may have required the ovalizing of the pipe to get it into the intake. That may explain why the stove is working better without....

 

[Parallax]

When's the last time you did a dollar bill test on your bypass? It should be snug all the way around all 4 sides. For the cat gasket, you should be able to visually see a continuous run of cat gasket around the cat. You could also check to see if there's any play in the cat in the housing, i.e. it should be in there snug.

Can you post a pic of the stove end of your oak pipe? The pic further back didn't look like you had the OAK adapter on it, which may have required the ovalizing of the pipe to get it into the intake. That may explain why the stove is working better without....

Will have to check, as best I can, when the stove is cool. Here are some photos of the OAK. Looks like they did not use a kit.

 

[blueguy]

So they just jammed the end of that pipe into the air intake vice using the proper connector? I wonder how closed off that was when it was in the intake? It might have been restricting the air going in the intake enough to cause some of the issues.

 

[begreen]

With the warm weather recently, any draft or air problems are gonna be worse.

Indeed. We are having a very warm February with 50F temps overnight. A few years back we weren't that warm at the end of April.

 

[firefighterjake]

Indeed. We are having a very warm February with 50F temps overnight. A few years back we weren't that warm at the end of April.

I wish you west coast guys would stop . . . seems like we're stuck in a weather pattern of alternating days of either brutally cold temps followed by snow.

I just know that in a few weeks you're going to do that thing again . . . post pics of flowers popping up all over the place . . . while we still look out at the gray skies and yards full of gray-white snow.

 

[jatoxico]

I wish you west coast guys would stop . . . seems like we're stuck in a weather pattern of alternating days of either brutally cold temps followed by snow.

I just know that in a few weeks you're going to do that thing again . . . post pics of flowers popping up all over the place . . . while we still look out at the gray skies and yards full of gray-white snow.

It's not funny