Lopi Endeavor and secondary issues

[p301]

Blower is on now the few times i used it it did make a difference. I guess i didnt want to face the fact that i needed electricity to run my wood stove enough to heat the house. Also with the not so hot wood the blower sometimes cools the stove enough to put out the secondaries and id be left with a smoldering fire. What was your guys standard setting for the blower low, med, high?
Do you guys know the amps they draw if i had the deep cycle from boat (not like i use it in winter anyway) hooked to and inverter i wonder how long they could run that fan if the power was out

 

[moresnow]

Add air to maintain your correct burn. Normal consequence from using the fan. More fan speed =more air required to maintain stove temp. I try to use the least fan speed as I can. No idea what your power draw is. Doubt its much.

 

[p301]

Thanks for the help guys
I think the cooling stove is more of a function of wood i can get the stt up with more air but to maintain it my flu temps really skyrocket to around 900 degrees i like to keep it at about 600 i think next year with more seasoned wood i will be better off

 

[p301]

Blower made a nice difference. The convective properties of the stove without it are not that great. I am still not overly impressed with the heating capacity of the stove and feel that the specs are very misleading and a stretch to say the least.

Just out of curiousity do any of you know your flu temp and stove temp when running the blower if your running it hot trying to crank out the heat

 

[rdust]

Just out of curiousity do any of you know your flu temp and stove temp when running the blower if your running it hot trying to crank out the heat

Wish I could help, I had double wall pipe and no probe so no idea on flue temps. Wasn't uncommon for the center of the stove top to be 700+ with the secondaries firing off. I always felt like it blew a bunch of heat up the stack but with close to 30' of chimney it liked to run hot. Once I had the air dialed down I could put my hand on the pipe without burning myself.

 

[p301]

Well thanks for help anyway. Im usually around 550-600 on the stove and 600 on the flu. When im starting or reloading the flu gets up to about 800 or 850 and the outside of the dual wall pipe is about 225 when its hot...
When you ran it at 700 did it seem to put out plenty of heat? What did you switch to and do you like it better?

 

[redktmrider]

Well thanks for help anyway. Im usually around 550-600 on the stove and 600 on the flu. When im starting or reloading the flu gets up to about 800 or 850 and the outside of the dual wall pipe is about 225 when its hot.

On my BK (cat stove), I have a probe thermometer on double wall pipe. When I reload, the flu temp gets to about 800F when getting the stove top to 500F. After the stove reaches temp and starts to cruise, the flu temps drop down +/- 50F of the stove top.
I've read that tube stoves send more heat up the flu than a cat stove, so your flu temps may be higher. My tube stove is an insert, so I don't have a flu thermometer on it.

 

[p301]

That sounds more inline with what i am getting begreen was telling me in an earlier thread he can have his stove at 600 and keep the flu at 400 but i cant get anywhere near those numbers

 

[rdust]

What did you switch to and do you like it better?

I switched to a Blaze King Princess. I made the move for multiple reasons. I wanted a larger firebox(wife went from working at home to back to an office) and the turn down ability you get with a cat stove. My Endeavor had one speed and that was HOT. I decided I'd prefer to control temps with the twist of a knob and not the amount of wood loaded.

When my Endeavor was loaded full and rolling the heat output was more than sufficient to heat my 2k sq'. That was probably my biggest dislike, I wanted a slower/lower release of the heat instead of all at once.

I like the cat stoves operation and repeatability better than my Lopi was. Unlikely I'd ever switch back to a non cat at this point for my primary heater.

 

[p301]

I switched to a Blaze King Princess. I made the move for multiple reasons. I wanted a larger firebox(wife went from working at home to back to an office) and the turn down ability you get with a cat stove. My Endeavor had one speed and that was HOT. I decided I'd prefer to control temps with the twist of a knob and not the amount of wood loaded.

When my Endeavor was loaded full and rolling the heat output was more than sufficient to heat my 2k sq'. That was probably my biggest dislike, I wanted a slower/lower release of the heat instead of all at once.

I like the cat stoves operation and repeatability better than my Lopi was. Unlikely I'd ever switch back to a non cat at this point for my primary heater.

I have been getting decent secondary burns. I usually load the stove up an hour before i go to bed to give it time to get settled in. I got it dialed down like i normally do and to the same spot on the damper that i put it each night and had a low fire going will some secondaries. I went upstairs for about 20 min and came down to take a peek before i went to sleep and the firebox was full of flames the flu had went from 500 to 650 so i closed the air all the way and it continued to rage as i watched the flu climb to 750 and then 800. I finally turned the blower on high and it took a good half hour for the temps to get back to 600. To me this is scary i wouldn't have thought twice about going to bed the way it was it had been dialed down for a good half hour and burning nice. What would make it take off like that? Who knows how high it would have climbed had i not been there to close the air. Sometimes the difference of 1/8" makes the difference between this thing smoldering and being a raging inferno. I dont know how an older person could run this stove i am constantly on my hands and knees looking at the damper trying to find the sweet spot. It seems there is no repeatability as rdust said it does something different every time. My old stove you run it wide open for 15 min close the screws to a half turn open and reload in 4 hours. Tips/Tricks/Suggestions?

 

[redktmrider]

I went upstairs for about 20 min and came down to take a peek before i went to sleep and the firebox was full of flames the flu had went from 500 to 650 so i closed the air all the way and it continued to rage as i watched the flu climb to 750 and then 800.

I struggled with a similar problem on my T5 insert. I would shut the air control completely with stove top temps around 400F, 25 minutes later the temp was 750. This is a typical problem with a tube type stove, I've heard it called a pulse and glide. You get this huge surge off heat in the early stages of the burn as most of the wood off gasses , then its drops down during the coaling stage. The reason your old stove didn't do this was all the gasses were going out the flue un-burned. I try to get the air closed completely as soon as the stove will sustained the secondaries at that setting.
My T5 is an insert so right now I don't monitor flue temps, but from what I read here 800F is not uncommon on a tuber.

 

[begreen]

While the T5 is a non-cat, it is not a tube stove. Better to call it a non-cat. Cold weather increases draft. One needs to adjust their burning habit accordingly. You can not go by stove top temperature alone. Generally that is the last thing I go by. Instead I go by the visual cues from the way the wood is igniting in the firebox, backed up by flue temperature. That has led me to shutting down the air much sooner.

For example, yesterday I did a cold start due to 50º temps the day before. In 10 minutes the fire was burning strongly and flue temp was 600F. I turned down the air about 3/4s. The stove top temp was only 225F at that point. The flames slowed down, but within another 10 minutes had renewed vigor. I gave it another 5 minutes and then closed the air down to our normal cruise setting of 1/8 open. Stove top was 400F and flue temp was 475F. Stove top temp steadily increased to a finally cruising temp of 650F after another 20 minutes or so. Fast forward to this morning's cold start (it was 50 when I went to bed). Today I had a balky start due to the way I loaded the wood and where I place the SuperCedar. (in a gap on the right side). The fire was very slow to start and needed more air. It was a completely different and much slower start.

I've run the Endeavor and it has a similar behavior with dry wood. Loaded right with good dry wood it can take off quickly. That stove install has no flue thermometer. I have to use my eyes in that case going only by the flames. I use stove top temperature mainly to watch out for overfire and to tell when the stove is ready to boil water in the kettle. There are so many variables when loading the stove, (wood species, split thickness, spacing between splits, air control setting, air supply reduction timing, draft, etc.. that one needs to use the eyes as well as gauges and timing.

 

[p301]

Thanks guys. Its just weird and scary that i thought it was settled in and the flu gas temp was falling below 600 and a half hour later it took off. Then i closed the air all the way and couldnt get it back down. I wish there was atleast a way to shut it down faster when it does that. I dont like the flu getting up to 800 that seems way to hot to me.

 

[begreen]

Was the flue temp surface or with a probe thermometer?

 

[p301]

Probe

 

[begreen]

800º on the probe is well within safe limits. Ours has gone higher on a few occasions.

 

[p301]

800º on the probe is well within safe limits. Ours has gone higher on a few occasions.

Im not sure if you remember i was getting high readings at the ceiling support box with high flu gas temps. I have been trying to keep that box under 200 external temp at the trim i think when the flu is at 800 im right about there. I wish your friends endeavor had a probe thermometer so i could compare. I personally cant go to sleep with a flu temp that is climbing. Just for safety sake i cant figure out why they dont give you a way to shut it down if you needed to like a master lever that cuts the primary and secondary air i would have gladly paid a little more for that feature

 

[brickie]

This is my third season with the endeavor.
I've found when burning well seasoned 3 to 6 inch splits of hardwood,
you have to get it HOT. My stovepipe surface temp 600F, my stovetop
650F before I close air to 1/2 inch from full.
It will roll on at 650/750F with the fan at 3/4 for a few hours.
If I'm around, I'll open the air all the way at coaling stage to burn them down.
They are a "fiddley" stove for sure. but a lot of heat and very good with wood quantities.
I don't think I would trust this stove without the fan.

 

[begreen]

Im not sure if you remember i was getting high readings at the ceiling support box with high flu gas temps. I have been trying to keep that box under 200 external temp at the trim i think when the flu is at 800 im right about there. I wish your friends endeavor had a probe thermometer so i could compare. I personally cant go to sleep with a flu temp that is climbing. Just for safety sake i cant figure out why they dont give you a way to shut it down if you needed to like a master lever that cuts the primary and secondary air i would have gladly paid a little more for that feature

Yes, I do recall. This seems normal. On my startup fire this morning the flue reached 800F before I started turning down the air. This was a cold start and the stove top temp was only 300F. The stove pipe temp right below the ceiling support collar was 219º and the support collar was 154º. I then went up and measured the chimney pipe temp at the support and it as 91º. There is a 4" gap between the framing wood and that chimney pipe. The surrounding wood was just a couple degrees higher than ambient.

Like I said, pretty normal stuff. I am more concerned by people only going by their stove top temp before turning down the air. I had a good blaze in the firebox at 800F flue temp even with a 300F stovetop. If I had waited until 500F, the flue temps might have been 1200F. That's too hot.

 

[begreen]

So in the last post I turned down the air about 70%. In the time it took to type the previous post and check all temps, upstairs and down. The flue temp has dropped to 500º with the stove top temp at 450º and climbing steadily. That's good control.

 

[p301]

I wish i had a 4" clearance mine is 2" at the ceiling support box as thats the size it had to as per the directions to get framed in. My ceiling support box can go above 200 easily at the trim piece no access to pipe above to check that temperature i dont like it but everyone i talk to says that it is within normal range

 

[begreen]

I have to check but I thought we have the same ceiling support box.

OK, went up and pulled the cover so I could measure. The wood was covered by the shield. There is 2.5" clearance from pipe to wood. The stove has settled in at 700F stove top, 550F flue temp. Stove pipe right below the collar is 153F and the collar is 134F. Above the ceiling support the chimney pipe is 135F and the adjacent wood is 98F. This is 50 minutes from my first posting this morning.

 

[p301]

I have never gotten that much difference between my stove and flu usually only 25 degrees unless im just starting it up. My support box at the trim piece routinely gets to 200 degrees and have had it as high as 260 i have been assured by duratec that this is within their normal range. I would love to know your buddies flu temps running his endeavor, or your support box temp at the trim if u had 800 sustained temps for say 15 minnutes. Thank you for all your investigative work i appreciate the effort

 

[begreen]

I have had the flue temp reach 1200 during a space out on my part. Not proud to admit it. Total time going past 800 and then coming back down might have been 15 minutes. I didn't measure all the data points then, but was very glad to have a properly installed flue system. In my normal daily running of the stove I am turning down the air between 600 and 800 degrees.

 

[TradEddie]

I wish there was at least a way to shut it down faster when it does that. I dont like the flu getting up to 800 that seems way to hot to me.

It may not have been mentioned yet, but if you really did get into the danger zone, one option is to OPEN the door! It's counter intuitive, scary and you certainly can't go to bed, but it works. Sure, you'll have a blazing inferno roaring in your face, but very quickly the cold room air will draw that heat up the flue, you'll just have an open fireplace, the stove and flue will cool off. You won't be able to close the door until lots of the fuel has burned away, but it's better than cracking a weld and damaging the stove.

TE