First look at Drolet's new EPA 2020 wood furnace...

[brenndatomu]

I just sent them an email asking. Unfortunately the “canned” response is all in French.

I like that side tool holder, need to fabricate one.

If they haven't gotten final approval yet, they can't sell to the USA.

 

[Case1030]

If they haven't gotten final approval yet, they can't sell to the USA.

Probably on the same waiting list as the VF200... everything is backed up.

 

[laynes69]

However, I do see that the Heat Commander was removed from the Drolet website today.

So why are they forced to remove their literature if they changed to say pending approval and took them off the market? If the VF200 hasn't officially been approved, it's still advertised on your site but not for sale? I don't see where that's fair for the company.

 

[lampmfg]

So why are they forced to remove their literature if they changed to say pending approval and took them off the market? If the VF200 hasn't officially been approved, it's still advertised on your site but not for sale? I don't see where that's fair for the company.

I agree with you. The only thing they shouldn't be able to do is to say EPA approved without actually being EPA approved. Unfortunately, they had EPA approved in many different locations.

 

[laynes69]

I agree with you. The only thing they shouldn't be able to do is to say EPA approved without actually being EPA approved. Unfortunately, they had EPA approved in many different locations.

I'm not trying to come off as being a dick....but honestly it's a slippery slope with advertising. Either way I have no say in the game.....but I see similarities against a complaint.

 

[lampmfg]

I'm not trying to come off as being a dick....but honestly it's a slippery slope with advertising. Either way I have no say in the game.....but I see similarities against a complaint.

Lol - I see what you're saying. However, that is a very vague correlation, but I guess it could be assumed. They had a direct question on the sight and in the manual saying yes EPA Phase 2 certified.

 

[brenndatomu]

HC was not showing up on the MFP site earlier...its back now though...still shows 11 in stock for some reason...

 

[SBIMarc]

Just to end the speculation from all of you nice folks... The Heat Commander is EPA-certified. EPA indeed did not want us to advertize the product until the official paperwork had been sent to us, even though the certification report had been completed and filed. We were okay with that and took the furnace off our web site right away when asked to. Anyway, we did receive official certification, so the unit is back online. It should appear on the EPA directory in a matter of days now. Hope that answers your questions! We are very pleased with this unit. The build quality is as good as it gets. It is more sophisticated than our previous models though, in that the unit is more "intelligent" (if I may say). It will self-adjust to correct operator errors and prevent the unit from smoking (for instance, if loading door is closed too quickly). It is impressive how clean it burns. Aside from that, it is a true central heater that will increase combustion and plenum temperature (and hence kick blower on) based on thermostatic demand. This was not easy to achieve because smoke mainly occurs during these "transitions" between high and low burn. But we got there. It took us more time than we would have liked but there was no point in botching the job. The good side of this is that the unit has been burning in our lab for a very long time. It is rugged. Beautiful fire through the glass door. Long burn times and good effficiency on all burn rates. Extremely good value for something with that level of technology, especially for less than $3,000. Have a great fall everyone.

 

[brenndatomu]

Just to end the speculation from all of you nice folks... The Heat Commander is EPA-certified. EPA indeed did not want us to advertize the product until the official paperwork had been sent to us, even though the certification report had been completed and filed. We were okay with that and took the furnace off our web site right away when asked to. Anyway, we did receive official certification, so the unit is back online. It should appear on the EPA directory in a matter of days now. Hope that answers your questions! We are very pleased with this unit. The build quality is as good as it gets. It is more sophisticated than our previous models though, in that the unit is more "intelligent" (if I may say). It will self-adjust to correct operator errors and prevent the unit from smoking (for instance, if loading door is closed too quickly). It is impressive how clean it burns. Aside from that, it is a true central heater that will increase combustion and plenum temperature (and hence kick blower on) based on thermostatic demand. This was not easy to achieve because smoke mainly occurs during these "transitions" between high and low burn. But we got there. It took us more time than we would have liked but there was no point in botching the job. The good side of this is that the unit has been burning in our lab for a very long time. It is rugged. Beautiful fire through the glass door. Long burn times and good effficiency on all burn rates. Extremely good value for something with that level of technology, especially for less than $3,000. Have a great fall everyone.

Welcome to Hearth Marc, and thanks for the update.
You should check in here once in a while...many people miss having an SBI rep participate here since Fyrebug left some years back. (I don't recall his real name, @laynes69 would remember)
And I think SBI benefits by being able to head off bad PR problems when you get some hothead on here spewing venom about their new unit that doesn't work and "is a POS" becuase of XYZ blah blah blah (read: usually wet wood )
Not to mention answering questions when people are shopping...I know I have seen more than once where people end up making the decision to buy a certain unit due to a factory rep being on here participating...

 

[laynes69]

Yes, very nice to see a SBI rep (president maybe)? I'm excited to see real world reviews and knowing the furnaces were tested with cordwood is promising. Bert Plourde was very helpful on the site when he worked for SBI as I also had the pleasure to meet him in person. Anyhow @SBIMarc , is the new furnace a load and go unit? Also since the burn is cleaner and knowing the heat exchanger, what is heating power comparable to the Caddy or does it can it produce more heat?

 

[SBIMarc]

Welcome to Hearth Marc, and thanks for the update.
You should check in here once in a while...many people miss having an SBI rep participate here since Fyrebug left some years back. (I don't recall his real name, @laynes69 would remember)
And I think SBI benefits by being able to head off bad PR problems when you get some hothead on here spewing venom about their new unit that doesn't work and "is a POS" becuase of XYZ blah blah blah (read: usually wet wood )
Not to mention answering questions when people are shopping...I know I have seen more than once where people end up making the decision to buy a certain unit due to a factory rep being on here participating...

Sure, I will be happy to participate when I can contribute. We have employees checking the forum once in a while but they are not registered. They alerted me that there was a lot of speculation about the Heat Commander, so I thought an update was a good idea. This can be time consuming if it becomes a pissing contest between manufacturers. It is not really our style to get involved with that. I think we should all be proud to have a healthy industry here in North America. Everyone is trying to make a living and is generally very passionate. I admire that. Plus, many of us work together on industry committees and we have way more to gain by working together than bitching at each other. It's not our style to be the ones stiring the pot.

 

[SBIMarc]

Yes, very nice to see a SBI rep (president maybe)? I'm excited to see real world reviews and knowing the furnaces were tested with cordwood is promising. Bert Plourde was very helpful on the site when he worked for SBI as I also had the pleasure to meet him in person. Anyhow @SBIMarc , is the new furnace a load and go unit? Also since the burn is cleaner and knowing the heat exchanger, what is heating power comparable to the Caddy or does it can it produce more heat?

Yes, it is a load and go unit. You load and press the "start button" and you're basically done. The heat power is almost identical to the Caddy. It is a bigger unit though (physically). You will load more wood into it, which is nice. We can't wait to get field reviews. It was all tested with cordwood and we had numerous random users try it, all with different loading techniques. The unit was able to accomodate everyone and minimize smoke. This one comes with the plenum is and more of a DIY unit. A pro version in our Caddy line will hot the market next year.

 

[SBIMarc]

(broken link removed to https://www.drolet.ca/en/products/furnaces/heat-commander-wood-furnace/)

Looks like its called the Heat Commander...but some of the parts are listed as being for the Tundra III too, so...anyways, looks like list price of $2799 USD. (and it still has a window!)
I was hoping to figure out it they are using a thermocouple, or a O2 sensor to sense/control for the stepper motor...couldn't find anything yet.

Thermocouples!

 

[brenndatomu]

will increase combustion and plenum temperature (and hence kick blower on) based on thermostatic demand.

So the Tstat calls for heat, the air control stepper motor(s) open to kick up the fire, then the blower responds according to plenum temps, right?

 

[brenndatomu]

Thermocouples!

I have no doubt this will work well, but I personally was really hoping to see someone use lambda sensors on a forced air furnace...I have studied in depth several outdoor wood "boilers" that are set up that way, and the control of the fire and emissions was impressive! Air adjustments made continuously for the perfect stoichiometry almost all the time. Got to spend some time talking with the designer/builder of the one unit...very interesting stuff!
The unit that was running when I was there would actually condense when idling, and the condensate was perfectly clear. You could take a big whiff of the exhaust right at the chimney exit and it smelled like fresh autumn air with a hint of "roasted wood" to it.
I know that an indoor unit could not be ran in a way that lets it condense though...

 

[SBIMarc]

So the Tstat calls for heat, the air control stepper motor(s) open to kick up the fire, then the blower responds according to plenum temps, right?

Pretty much. We have not reinvented how our furnaces work. Conceptually, the HC works like our other furnaces. However, we have put more intelligence and more precision into the whole process. The HC is just as effective, but it is able to significantly reduce the level of smoke while in operation.

 

[brenndatomu]

I think we should all be proud to have a healthy industry here in North America.

I agree...except for that miserable POS FC1000e that HY-C is flooding the big box/DIY market with...Consumer Product Safety Commission should be involved with that one...

 

[brenndatomu]

We have employees checking the forum once in a while but they are not registered

Kind of suspected as much...when Tundra 1 got to be popular, and then issues started popping up , eventually the thread got to be 100 pages plus, figured that surely someone at SBI was monitoring things by that point...even if just on their own time...

 

[brenndatomu]

We can't wait to get field reviews. It was all tested with cordwood and we had numerous random users try it, all with different loading techniques. The unit was able to accomodate everyone and minimize smoke.

I'm sure I can speak for @laynes69 and say that he, as a current Caddy owner, and myself as a former Tundra owner would gladly volunteer our beta testing services...

 

[Mrpelletburner]

Also, as a current Heat Max II owner and a previous owner of FC 2 models, I would also be open to volunteer as a testing site.

 

[SBIMarc]

Also, as a current Heat Max II owner and a previous owner of FC 2 models, I would also be open to volunteer as a testing site.

Thanks guys. I will note your interest. Just so you know, the Heat Commander has the built-in capability to be a connected object. We are planning on launching a project in Quebec with specific users where we can capture filed data about many aspects of the combustion and run algorithms to see what we can find out. This could eventually improve homeowner experience by spotting potential install problems, advising on maintenance, etc. We could potentially extend this project to some people in the US. We would need to organize a videoconference with interested users. It would be nice to get to know some of you, see your face, learn about your background and how you could contribute to this project.

 

[laynes69]

I'm sure I can speak for @laynes69 and say that he, as a current Caddy owner, and myself as a former Tundra owner would gladly volunteer our beta testing services...

Absolutely! This little old house needs some new iron in the basement! I'm all setup, wouldn't take long to install....lol. The ol' Caddy has served well, but I'm ready for something new. Actually been driving the wife crazy over the new furnace.

 

[brenndatomu]

Actually been driving the wife crazy over the new furnace.

As someone who has installed 5 different wood furnaces (plus 3 stoves) in the last 11-12 years, (plus the ones I have done for others too) my wife can relate...when I did the permanent install of the VF100 she said "this better be the last change for a while" I told her nope, I won't switch anymore...this year. (that was last year...the VF100 was set up temporarily as an "add on furnace" winter '18-'19 too)
That probably sounds worse than it is...I have a basement garage so the "in and out" of changing is not that bad...except for that dang Yukon Husky Wood/Oil...had to totally disassemble it and take the door and frame out of the wall to get it through the furnace room door!

 

[SBIMarc]

Absolutely! This little old house needs some new iron in the basement! I'm all setup, wouldn't take long to install....lol. The ol' Caddy has served well, but I'm ready for something new. Actually been driving the wife crazy over the new furnace.

Good! We will reach out to those interested when we are ready. Thanks for your interest, and nice house by the way. Seems like a quiet and peaceful place. Have a good weekend. Canadian Thanksgiving here, so many people off Monday.

 

[lampmfg]

Just to end the speculation from all of you nice folks... The Heat Commander is EPA-certified. EPA indeed did not want us to advertize the product until the official paperwork had been sent to us, even though the certification report had been completed and filed. We were okay with that and took the furnace off our web site right away when asked to. Anyway, we did receive official certification, so the unit is back online. It should appear on the EPA directory in a matter of days now. Hope that answers your questions! We are very pleased with this unit. The build quality is as good as it gets. It is more sophisticated than our previous models though, in that the unit is more "intelligent" (if I may say). It will self-adjust to correct operator errors and prevent the unit from smoking (for instance, if loading door is closed too quickly). It is impressive how clean it burns. Aside from that, it is a true central heater that will increase combustion and plenum temperature (and hence kick blower on) based on thermostatic demand. This was not easy to achieve because smoke mainly occurs during these "transitions" between high and low burn. But we got there. It took us more time than we would have liked but there was no point in botching the job. The good side of this is that the unit has been burning in our lab for a very long time. It is rugged. Beautiful fire through the glass door. Long burn times and good effficiency on all burn rates. Extremely good value for something with that level of technology, especially for less than $3,000. Have a great fall everyone.

Congratulations, as you alluded to, the testing process is challenging. Speaking with the EPA, I had a feeling it was close to being certified. I also know that the EPA doesn't want to listen to us again, so they were making sure to dot their I's and cross their t's. I see the test results now and will be interested in looking through them in detail. Zeigler did the testing, and I know he learned a lot from us going through the process previously.