Eshland Wood Gun 140. Please Help! New operator with zero gassifer experience

[Green Mt Heat]

Thanks Wire nut for all of your information. On # 2 I have noticed that I get the worst puffing when i load the WG for a long burn like over night or when I have to leave for work. Both of these are the worst time to have any issues. I have made some improvements over the last 3 weeks from all the help here, what a great website! tonight it will be down below zero, I hope the WG runs well!

My WG is carbon steel but I have no Idea how old it is the guy I bought it from said it was 10 years old but I'm not sure if that is correct?

Thnaks

 

[Fred61]

I'm guessing it's 20 years old.

 

[Green Mt Heat]

Fred
How long have you heard these WG's lasting? Whats the oldest one on this users? I guess I need to be careful how much I put into this thing. Where do they tend to rot out?

 

[avc8130]

Fred
How long have you heard these WG's lasting? Whats the oldest one on this users? I guess I need to be careful how much I put into this thing. Where do they tend to rot out?

Fred's lasted about a week...

 

[avc8130]

label inside cover

Green,

From reading that, I get the impression that there IS an end switch. That would be how to wire up the "ready" light.

ac

 

[Fred61]

Fred
How long have you heard these WG's lasting? Whats the oldest one on this users? I guess I need to be careful how much I put into this thing. Where do they tend to rot out?

Mine only lasted eight years and then was retired to the junkyard. Over those years I fought with numerous problems and quirks associated with the Wood Gun. over the last two or three years I had it in service the firebox became porous and I had a welder patch it several times. It then became un-fixable in my mind so I junked it.

I believe there's a reason they went with stainless. I think the corrosion problem was more than they could overcome.

I was actually surprised to see a unit as old as yours pop up here.

 

[muncybob]

I was previously in touch with a person that had a WG still running and it was over 20 years old. She described it as a hate/love relationship

In my 5th season and have learned a lot, so it's mostly love for me at this point.

 

[Green Mt Heat]

Thanks AC fred and Muncybob,

I worked with a guy that had one and that was over 20 years ago, Ive rarely run in to him much over the years but if I do I will be asking about the WG.

Fred how do you like the EKO 25? I'm sorry that the WG did not work out for you, I cant believe that in just 8 years the WG failed. My last boiler the Van Wert must have been close to 30 years old. I bet it had a couple of hundred cord through it. I would say that I really liked that boiler sad to see go.

Muncybob, did you buy the WG new? What was the deciding factors that lead you to chose the WG? I have no Idea how long this WG will last, I would love to get a few years out of it, im hoping that I will come to at least like it by then... I guess I should start researching my next wood boiler! At any rate I had -9 degrees this morning Im glad i was burning wood instead of oil!

 

[avc8130]

At any rate I had -9 degrees this morning Im glad i was burning wood instead of oil!

...and isn't that what it is ALL about?

ac

 

[Fred61]

Wow, where did you find such a warm spot in Vermont. Here it was -13.

On my sixth year with the EKO. Like it so far. Much simpler than the Wood Gun. Fewer pieces of hardware to fail. I batch burn for about 4 or so hours each evening to charge storage then turn the boiler off and I'm good 'till the next evening. When I lit the fire this evening the storage temperature was reading 121 degrees. Not bad for -13 over night and it never got above +8 all day today.

It was +6 degrees when we turned in last night and when my wife looked at the digital thermometer this morning and read 13 she commented "hey it warmed up over night". I had to point out to her that there was a minus sign in front of that number. We are still amazed that you can't tell what's going on outside in our super insulated house. In most homes you can feel it when outdoor temperatures are that low. The next comment she made was "and the boiler isn't even running". She still doesn't get it.

 

[muncybob]

Thanks AC fred and Muncybob,

Muncybob, did you buy the WG new? What was the deciding factors that lead you to chose the WG? I have no Idea how long this WG will last, I would love to get a few years out of it, im hoping that I will come to at least like it by then... I guess I should start researching my next wood boiler! At any rate I had -9 degrees this morning Im glad i was burning wood instead of oil!

Bought it new...went down to AHS in my friends pickup and dropped into my basement to next day with a skid steer. I knew initially I could not afford storage and the old oil boiler just had to go, so I decided on a combo unit. The WG and one other boiler were the only ones that would fit thru our basement entry and the other boiler's sales rep let me down during the research phase. I got straight answers from AHS and great support when I needed it. Initial learning curve was a bit steep for me(never heated with wood before) but it's all good now. If I had known how little the oil burner would be used I probably never would have gone with a combo unit and probably got an electric boiler for the 3 days or so per heating season we are not home. The area that the oil tanks sit could have accommodated the storage tanks...oh well.

 

[Green Mt Heat]

AC I live near the CT river in Rockingham and it is always warmer here. My friends family lives in Island Pond VT they had -33. AC do you use your EKO year round for DWH production? I dont suppose you saved your refractory before you junked the WG? Did AHS own WG when you bought yours? Did they guarantee the WG at all?

On the plus side I was able to size the load correctly this morning before work with little to no known puffing. I was gone for 10 hours and there was still coals in the fb and the WG temp was @ 175. I know that it was a lot warmer today like low to mid 20's but this is definitely a success. My old boiler would not have done that amount of time. I have concluded that if I use small fuel loads to get the WG to normal operating temp and then add a full load in the fb to get me through the night or day @ work. This technique seems to have limited the puffing?

Muncybob thanks for sharing your purchase decision. I have heard mostly good things about the WG and when I saw this one on craigslist I jumped on it, I had little time to find another boiler as my old boiler gave up in late November. I figured this would be the least risk to learn about the gassifer boilers. I have to say this week has been much better than last week as far as positive progress!

 

[avc8130]

AC I live near the CT river in Rockingham and it is always warmer here. My friends family lives in Island Pond VT they had -33. AC do you use your EKO year round for DWH production? I dont suppose you saved your refractory before you junked the WG? Did AHS own WG when you bought yours? Did they guarantee the WG at all?

On the plus side I was able to size the load correctly this morning before work with little to no known puffing. I was gone for 10 hours and there was still coals in the fb and the WG temp was @ 175. I know that it was a lot warmer today like low to mid 20's but this is definitely a success. My old boiler would not have done that amount of time. I have concluded that if I use small fuel loads to get the WG to normal operating temp and then add a full load in the fb to get me through the night or day @ work. This technique seems to have limited the puffing?

Muncybob thanks for sharing your purchase decision. I have heard mostly good things about the WG and when I saw this one on craigslist I jumped on it, I had little time to find another boiler as my old boiler gave up in late November. I figured this would be the least risk to learn about the gassifer boilers. I have to say this week has been much better than last week as far as positive progress!

The WG works best if you keep it at temp. If you let it drop and then fill the box up, but the time it burns enough wood to get to temp the rest of the wood is charred and dry so it burns fast.

What did you pay for it?

ac

 

[Fred61]

Green Mt Heat New Member Joined: Dec 11, 2013 Messages: 15 Loc: Vermont USA AC I live near the CT river in Rockingham and it is always warmer here. My friends family lives in Island Pond VT they had -33. AC do you use your EKO year round for DWH production? I dont suppose you saved your refractory before you junked the WG? Did AHS own WG when you bought yours? Did they guarantee the WG at all?

AC is the guy with the Wood Gun. Fred is the guy that had a Wood Gun and now has an EKO. I live a little north of you an at a higher elevation so that explains the difference in morning temperatures.

To answer your question, no, I don't use it year round. It's in my basement and I don't want to add heat to the house in the summer and then cool it with my mini splits. I use a Geyser heat pump which I installed last year to heat my water in the summer.

The Wood Gun was made by Eshland and had a 5 year warrantee.

 

[Green Mt Heat]

Ac the issue is if i put more than 25-30% in the firebox I risk getting a lot of puffing. I guess my wood must be to dry (processed this past spring). I had no idea this WG would be this fussy, I'm going to loose my mind. I settled @ $1250.00 for it.

Sorry Fred not sure what i was thinking I knew you had the EKO. Must be the WG making me crazy!

 

[CTFIRE]

Green - Have you tried closing the air damper to 3/4

 

[Coal Reaper]

Must be the WG making me crazy!

now you fit in!

 

[Green Mt Heat]

ctfire. I have tried the damper in many positions, wide open seems to be the best so far. When it's puffing it seems like its starving for oxygen. If you open the fuel door and let more oxygen in the fb the puffing stops.

 

[Fred61]

now you fit in!

Chuckle....Guffaw.....Snort

I'm still crazy from my experience with the WG after several years without it but here are a couple questions.

What's the condition of the plug in the front of the fire tube?. Could there be an air leaking by?

Another wild thought. Not likely but other Wood Gunners can chime in. The condition of the fan blades could be an issue if they are warn enough to diminish their pumping ability. I say "not likely" because they are quite heavy duty for the job and just the fact that the unit has been around this many years tells me that it must have limited use in the past.

 

[avc8130]

Ac the issue is if i put more than 25-30% in the firebox I risk getting a lot of puffing. I guess my wood must be to dry (processed this past spring). I had no idea this WG would be this fussy, I'm going to loose my mind. I settled @ $1250.00 for it.

Sorry Fred not sure what i was thinking I knew you had the EKO. Must be the WG making me crazy!

Green,

What do you have on the end of your air intake? Do you have a tube that just goes to the floor or do you have it piped somewhere?

Are all of your nozzles open and free to flow?

Is there an access to look at your air damper/seal? Is it full open when the boiler is firing?

Have you inspected the boiler at all before firing? Are ALL of the passageways clear?

Huffing IS a lack of sufficient oxygen for the fuel charge. For some reason you are getting excessive wood gassing in the upper chamber that isn't getting brought down into the lower chamber.

Have you tried burning with the manual damper 3/4 close FROM THE START? One of the possibilities is to not allow it to get to the point of huffing.

ac

 

[Green Mt Heat]

Thanks guys,

Fred you didn't happen to strip any parts out of your old WG before you scrapped it did you ( I know it was a long time ago)?

I piped the intake outside after the puffing started. it loops to the floor then vertical about 4 1/2'

The nozzles are worn in the front and the plug has a odd ceramic block above it? The new WG has a plug with a different shape. Do you think the gap above the plug would cause and issue?

What is the "map" or "trail" of the whole combustion circuit? The air comes in from the fresh air valve then through the fire grate in the fb... does it then divide equally to both outer tubes? and then finally through the large steel tube on the bottom?

I ran the wg all day today with small charges and limited load (temps upper 30's low 40's) no issues at all. The fewer times it cycles the fewer the issues.

I have not tried starting off @ 3/4 closed damper but I can give it a shot.

Thanks again for all the imput

 

[avc8130]

Green,

The design is the air comes in the intake, then through the firebox over the wood and down through the nozzles. Then it heads BACK to the rear door. Turns around and comes FORWARD through the side refractory passages. Then down through the big tube in the bottom towards the fan. Then through the swirl chamber and out through the cyclone.

There is a decent graphic of this here:
(broken link removed to http://alternateheatingsystems.com/WoodGasification.aspx)

I'm wondering if that front plug is your problem. It looks worn to the point that the intake could pull air right through that rather than back and through the refractory.

I suggest you give Darren a call at AHS. Speak to either him or Jeff. Both are excellent and really know their boilers. I found spare parts were very reasonably priced, a new front plug might be a decent start.

ac

 

[Fred61]

Sorry, no spare parts. When I decided to hook a chain to the monster and drag it out into the driveway, I wanted to see no part of it again. I have regretted the move since. The tankless coil could have been quite valuable as well as the draft motor and damper motor, aquastats, etc.

On the plug: That "odd shaped piece" is a filler usually attached to the round plug in order to close off the odd shape created when the cast the refractory. It looks to have a small leak that could blow/(suck) by but I don't believe this is the root problem. If you have any refractory cement around you could cast yourself a replacement in short order. Today would be a good day since it's quite warm out. I believe your local hardware store (J&G or something like that) are open today. I don't think you would gum things up if you just trowel a little material on while in place. If you don't clean it first, it probably adhere to the surrounding refractory.

As AC suggested above, check for any restrictions in your intake. Confirm that the air damper is opening completely. From there you may need to remove the fan and check for restrictions on the pressure side. I assume that when you moved the unit you had removed the cyclone. Could anything have gotten in there that could be restricting the flow? Above, I suggested taking a look at the fan. Did you move the unit with the fan installed?

Could the refractory on the rear door have fallen in on the tubes, restricting on that end?

 

[infinitymike]

Hey green

Sorry to chime in so late in the game.
That's an interesting center tube plug set up. Not sure if that's the issue.

I really think the huffing is ONLY coming from too small of a split.

The WG is not fussy at all.
It's a Beast and loves big, heavy, manly splits, not these little wimpy playing card sized splits that the other guys need.

I learned the hard way. I started splitting wood before the WG was connected and I listened to what I was reading in here. Everyone else was saying to split to the size of a playing card
That is way to small for this beast.
And I was huffing and puffing like a big bad wolf.

I have now learned and the smallest I will split is the size of a 4x4 fence post. 6x6 is better and 6x8 even better.
Moisture around 25% is good too.

I had my first case of huffing in over a year, last week. The splits were just to small.

Unfortunately I have 4 cord of oak that is split like a playing card from
October 2011. I have to start burning that now. Another mistake was to let those skinny splits season as long as they have.

This winter I've been burning cherry and maple that was split 6x6 around April of 2013 and it burned like a dream. Unfortunately I just ran out.
It gasified right way and there was no smoke or huffing. Just beautiful heat shimmers coming from the stack and a nice and toasty house. I will let you know how this oak burns. I just put a small load in this morning to take the chill out our the house since the out temps are almost 60* right now.

But not to worry the temps will drop this week and that will be the true test of this stuff.

Anyone want to buy 4 cords of oak split like a playing card?

Just hang in there. You be just fine. Once you get past the learning curve things will smooth out.

Have you called AHS for any of their advice?
They came out with an EPA plug that is to be put in one of the side tubes and is claimed to help with huffing. I haven't gotten one yet but a couple other guys have and they seem to notice the difference.

 

[WireNut]

Agreed, my huffing only occurs when I use wood that is too dry or too small. If I stick big old 12" rounds in and nothing else I don't have any problems with huffing. My theory is a combination of wet big pieces is best, contrary to what you'd think. I've tried all sorts of combinations, and what I've found is that fewer of the small dry maple splits cause the boiler to huff less. If I ONLY load oak I split this past spring, the boiler runs like a champ. Those are big pieces with a 30-35% moisture rating on my meter. The Maple are small splits (think branches and "wood stove size" since I split them before I got the gun). and only at about 15-20% moisture. I one time loaded the boiler with only maple. I acutally got visible smoke out of the air intake.

Since I need to burn up the maple, I've been just putting a few sticks in with a couple of big oak logs I'm also thinking of trying one of those plugs.