I've got over 35 feet of chimney and with my Alderlea T6 I used a large magnet and covered 2/3 or so of the hole next to the boost air hole. I left the boost air hole open, but I do think it would be easier to block by just dropping a bolt down through the top rather than tape on the bottom. I do not have a key damper in the stove pipe. I never fill my firebox right full, and I keep the loads smaller on windy days. I also mix and match large to small pieces of wood. Several small splits will increase the surface area of the wood and make it burn faster, so I tend to make my loads as much as possible based on total surface area. If the splits are small and I don't have some larger chunks to balance it out, I put in a smaller load. The larger firebox even if not filled, allows using much longer pieces of wood so the advantage is still there IMO. Derf
Looking for some advice on new Alderlea T6
- Thread starter KG19
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Following…. I replaced a 2.3cuft basic wood stove last January with a PE Summit LE and have been battling the exact same scenario. Had two fires reach flue temps of 1100F which I ended up smothering to put out last winter. Shortly after I installed a key damper with some but little effect at which point I had a draft test done my by inspector which fell at 0.1” water column at max which falls under the PE engineering spec of 0.14”. My flue is 90% inside my house at around 21-22’ with 2x 30deg elbows before the ceiling adapter.
Since having these issues last year I added a PE blower and blocked the boost air as new measures to try and tame this stove. This season. Have only been doing 2-3 splits per load to try and regain confidence in using it as I’ve been back to using my electric heat more not having confidence to leave it burn when I can’t monitor it. I should also mention my wood moisture is sitting at 16-18%.
$4500CAD into this stove now and still not happy with it.
I’m not sure if anything changed pre/post 2020 epa standards but a couple of my friends have pre 2020 super 27s with no issues running them. Still not sure if I want to keep fighting this battle or sell it for what I can and look at other options like a Osburn, Regency or even Blaze King all 3 of which I know people that have installed recently with 0 fire control issues.
Since having these issues last year I added a PE blower and blocked the boost air as new measures to try and tame this stove. This season. Have only been doing 2-3 splits per load to try and regain confidence in using it as I’ve been back to using my electric heat more not having confidence to leave it burn when I can’t monitor it. I should also mention my wood moisture is sitting at 16-18%.
$4500CAD into this stove now and still not happy with it.
I’m not sure if anything changed pre/post 2020 epa standards but a couple of my friends have pre 2020 super 27s with no issues running them. Still not sure if I want to keep fighting this battle or sell it for what I can and look at other options like a Osburn, Regency or even Blaze King all 3 of which I know people that have installed recently with 0 fire control issues.
EbS-P
Minister of Fire
I wouldn’t focus to much on the flue gas peak temperature. But rather where does it cruise at. Where are your measuring and with what device? What is the stove top temp when flue gas gets that hot? What effects does the damper have.
The 1100f fires I mentioned above be what I’d consider cruising temp as it sat there for 1-2hrs with STT around 750F before dropping down to about 900f and 600-650F STT. have a condar probe thermometer in my dual wall flue 18” above the stove which is the same as the OP shared pictures of.
As far as the damper we proved it has an effect during the draft test but in terms of fire characteristics I notice minimal difference. I try and use it only when temps start getting 650F+ to avoid over firing as I don’t want the flue temps too cool causing creosote buildup.
Man, it’s a night and day difference with the boost air hole covered up… this morning I did a test run with only 5 medium sized splits, filling the firebox about halfway and notice much more control and lower temps.
So this afternoon I filled it with 7 splits, about 3/4 full. I had to cut down the much much slower, over the course of about 30 minutes whereas previously I was just completely shutting it immediately after the logs ignited. I also didn’t even need to close off the damper at all until about 2 hours into the burn. I noticed it the flue was at about 600 and the STT was at about 700, so I closed the damper halfway (45 degree angle) and the fire actually SLOWED and the temps CAME DOWN. Haha. Previously that would never happen, it had been that once the temps started going up, literally nothing could bring them down or slow them.
I’m also noticing now, about 2.5 hrs into the burn after closing the damper halfway, that I’m basically only getting nice secondary combustion and basically no flame from the bottom of the wood. Temperature of stovetop has settled at a little over 600F and flue is also at 600F. Previously there would be flames coming up from the bottom and there would be like a tornado of roaring flames from the secondaries…
All this to say, it seems like a serious design flaw to have that air boost hole… it causes the fire to just roar from both above and below. With the covered, with stove works as intended.
Thanks to everyone for helping me sort this out! You guys are life savers!
So this afternoon I filled it with 7 splits, about 3/4 full. I had to cut down the much much slower, over the course of about 30 minutes whereas previously I was just completely shutting it immediately after the logs ignited. I also didn’t even need to close off the damper at all until about 2 hours into the burn. I noticed it the flue was at about 600 and the STT was at about 700, so I closed the damper halfway (45 degree angle) and the fire actually SLOWED and the temps CAME DOWN. Haha. Previously that would never happen, it had been that once the temps started going up, literally nothing could bring them down or slow them.
I’m also noticing now, about 2.5 hrs into the burn after closing the damper halfway, that I’m basically only getting nice secondary combustion and basically no flame from the bottom of the wood. Temperature of stovetop has settled at a little over 600F and flue is also at 600F. Previously there would be flames coming up from the bottom and there would be like a tornado of roaring flames from the secondaries…
All this to say, it seems like a serious design flaw to have that air boost hole… it causes the fire to just roar from both above and below. With the covered, with stove works as intended.
Thanks to everyone for helping me sort this out! You guys are life savers!
That’s promising to hear! I’ve only had one small fire since I blocked my boost air hole so I’ve yet to determine how it effects my stove. I was looking at other manufacturers today to see how their systems work and I saw the company Quadra Fire has a similar system to the PE boost hole but their system is on a spring damper that closes automatically after 20mins.
Metal tape works well. Good to hear of the improvement. Keep us posted.
What are your typical running temps for flue? Do you start shutting down your air based on flue temp or something else? I’ve read through your post of startup with the 3 temps last winter when I started having issues with my Summit and have yet to master this thing. Seems you have the most experience with the PE stoves of anyone on this forum so any feedback is appreciated before I loose more hair and sleep over this stove!
This thread shows my flue temps over time for an average fire.
In this case it sounds like there is unusually strong draft. Stoves are built to work well under lab testing. In the real world, there are a lot more variables. The boost air helps fire starting when the stove is installed with weak to average draft which is a common scenario. It would be nice for PE to have a tech bulletin for the strong draft scenario with recommendations to compensate. Threading the boost air hole and providing a bolt to plug it would be nice.
I’ve spoken to the design/lab tech a couple times at PE. Great guy and very informative but not once has he recommended altering the stove as I’m sure it’s a liability issue. He was the one that recommended I get a draft test done and it came back within their testing spec even though I was still experiencing the same issues as the OP. I sure have seen a number of PE owners with the same issues on this forum numerous times. Is this boost hole a post 2020 thing I wonder for emissions?
No, I was one of the firstowners of the T6. Ours is the original 2008 model. I discovered this during the first season of burning thanks to some early reports from owners of other stoves. It's not unique to PE. Many stoves have some sort of unregulated boost air.
Good to know I’ve been wondering what the older models were like vs the new ones. So you’ve been running yours with the boost hole covered all these years? Does yours also have the fixed primary air intake hole beside the hole that’s variable with via the air control lever?
No, I think this changed with the LE models. Ours is a more basic version that hits a stop. The stop can be bent slightly to adjust the minimum intake opening.
Interesting. That’s my next step if covering the boost hole doesn’t cut it for my stove is to half/fully cover the fixed air hole for the primary. Just concerned doing that would make the stove glass fully black with no primary air flow.
Try the boost air alone. Is there alreeady a key damper on the flue? Is there another thread that describes this installation?
Yes I installed a key damper as my first approach to resolve running hot last winter. I have had better success running smaller loads of wood vs using the key damper as of now. But just on my second fire as we speak with the boost hole blocked and as the OP said it definitely changes things for the better so I may start putting 3-4 splits in and see how that goes.
I did create this tread earlier this week but didn't get any traction on it. https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/over-firing-summit.205450/
Based on my experience, I think having the boost air blocked, in combination with the key damper, is gonna work just fine for you. My chimney is taller than yours, fully insulated liner inside of an interior masonry chimney. I had an extremely strong draft. Just covering the boost air has been a game changer.
After a couple days of using the stove with the boost air completely blocked off, here’s my update -
The stove is MUCH more responsive to adjusting the air control on a reload. Almost too much haha. I’ve found that if I turn the air down too quickly, the fire will smolder out and I’ll just have a charred logs in there. Giving it a few minutes to rebuild doesn’t help much, so I’ve found myself opening the air all the way back up and starting over on tuning in down. When I do this, the fire starts roaring again within 30 seconds, and I’ll have to turn in down slowly in stages. I think it’s gonna just be a learning curve again for me. I’ve found though that I really can’t turn the air control fully closed for about an hour after reloading. I’ll typically turn it down slowly over the course of 5-10 minutes until it’s about half closed, then wait for maybe 15-20 minutes before turning it down slowly in stages again until it’s about 3/4 closed. Then after another 15-20 minutes as long as secondaries are still going strong I’ll close the air completely. So the “negative” to this is that need about an hour to “babysit” the stove while I’m getting to this stage, but the positive is that if I do this correctly, I can completely eliminate primary combustion and just have floating secondary combustion that will last for hours. Last night I loaded at 8:30pm and still had a ton of red hot coals this morning at 7am. This is absolutely crazy to me when comparing to my junky old stove that could only get a max of 3 hours burn time haha.
If anything about this process seems off to you guys, I welcome feedback. Maybe I should be closing the air a little sooner and just giving more time for the fire to rebuild? I typically give it 5 or so minutes and if it hasn’t started building a flame again, I’ll open it all the way up and restart the closing down procedure. I ask mainly because I do still find myself having to use the flue damper to varying degrees to keep the STT at around 600-650. I’ll adjust the damper maybe 30 or so minutes after closing the air control fully (usually about an hour after reload).
The stove is MUCH more responsive to adjusting the air control on a reload. Almost too much haha. I’ve found that if I turn the air down too quickly, the fire will smolder out and I’ll just have a charred logs in there. Giving it a few minutes to rebuild doesn’t help much, so I’ve found myself opening the air all the way back up and starting over on tuning in down. When I do this, the fire starts roaring again within 30 seconds, and I’ll have to turn in down slowly in stages. I think it’s gonna just be a learning curve again for me. I’ve found though that I really can’t turn the air control fully closed for about an hour after reloading. I’ll typically turn it down slowly over the course of 5-10 minutes until it’s about half closed, then wait for maybe 15-20 minutes before turning it down slowly in stages again until it’s about 3/4 closed. Then after another 15-20 minutes as long as secondaries are still going strong I’ll close the air completely. So the “negative” to this is that need about an hour to “babysit” the stove while I’m getting to this stage, but the positive is that if I do this correctly, I can completely eliminate primary combustion and just have floating secondary combustion that will last for hours. Last night I loaded at 8:30pm and still had a ton of red hot coals this morning at 7am. This is absolutely crazy to me when comparing to my junky old stove that could only get a max of 3 hours burn time haha.
If anything about this process seems off to you guys, I welcome feedback. Maybe I should be closing the air a little sooner and just giving more time for the fire to rebuild? I typically give it 5 or so minutes and if it hasn’t started building a flame again, I’ll open it all the way up and restart the closing down procedure. I ask mainly because I do still find myself having to use the flue damper to varying degrees to keep the STT at around 600-650. I’ll adjust the damper maybe 30 or so minutes after closing the air control fully (usually about an hour after reload).
