Dialing in the Drolet Escape (1500, 1800 and inserts)

[Woodcutter Tom]

The hole the the thermal probe is in was already in the adapter. I added the hole for the damper.

How long is that thermal probe?
Does it measure the center of the flue?
When you pulled it our 3 inches, was it at the edge of the flue? Tip touching the flue?
Does the probe contact your damper plate when you rotate the damper?
Do you already have the magnehelic or manometer?
Have you considered inserting the magnehelic or manometer tubing into the temp probe hole to temporarily test draft?
Is there SS flexible liner under the hose clamp and what looks like foil?

 

[EbS-P]

I believe that I have an air leak by the glass in the stove door.
Consider this:
STT = 570 F
Draft is .04 "
Flue = 750 F
Primary air is fully closed.
Stays like this for 1/2 hour. then.....

the flue temp starts to slowly creep up. and up and up. The air flowing over the glass starts to ignite. At first just a bit. Soon there are flowing flames at the front of the stove They reach about 1/2 down the glass. Secondary flames from the tubes are robust and completely throughout the firebox. See first pic and video.

After the wood has burned up, the glass looks like the second picture.

I have diligently worked to seal the door and it passes the $ bill test. I do not recommend anybody does this, but, I sprayed a little compressed air at the glass gasket and have had flames ignite inside the fire box. Thus I am going to replace it, or maybe seal with RTV.
I do have a new OEM glass seal on order.

I just wonder how small of a leak would cause this?

View attachment 306570 View attachment 306572

check the glass screws.

The flames have a nice roll to them. Pack the stove as tight as you can. 750 is a bit high but I’m thinking that we will find it’s probably more normal than not for these fireboxes.

You might try adding a small piece of gasket between bottom clip and the metal rail to see if you can clamp the bottom tighter. I keep a roll of flat gasket material on hand.

 

[EbS-P]

How long is that thermal probe?
Does it measure the center of the flue?
When you pulled it our 3 inches, was it at the edge of the flue? Tip touching the flue?
Does the probe contact your damper plate when you rotate the damper?
Do you already have the magnehelic or manometer?
Have you considered inserting the magnehelic or manometer tubing into the temp probe hole to temporarily test draft?
Is there SS flexible liner under the hose clamp and what looks like foil?

It’s Auber’s double wall probe 4”.

I can set anywhere in that 3” range. Looks to me at full insertion it was over the center holes. 1” it’s over the damper plate.

The damper does contact the probe so I don’t have 360 degrees of rotation.

I have a magnahelic but it’s not installed. It going to be tricky as I must be below the damper but not interfere with it. I think I can drill the left side below the damper hole and make it work with. But then I’m limited to 200 degrees of rotation which is fine.

It’s 24’ if 6” SS lightweight liner wrapped with UL listed liner insulation. The foil is the aluminum tape that came with the insulation kit to seal the ends of the ceramic insulation.

Eventually it will get a blockoff plate and the 6” will get wrapped with 8” stovepipe section that the damper will operate through. (Probably drilled for the probe and a pressure tube.

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

check the glass screws.

The flames have a nice roll to them. Pack the stove as tight as you can. 750 is a bit high but I’m thinking that we will find it’s probably more normal than not for these fireboxes.

You might try adding a small piece of gasket between bottom clip and the metal rail to see if you can clamp the bottom tighter. I keep a roll of flat gasket material on hand.

View attachment 306573

Thanks, I have checked the screws. I do not want to over tighten. I like the gasket between the clip and rail idea. I did buy some of the gasket material you suggested last year to help with the door seal.
For three days I have been getting notification that my spare parts have shipped.....expect the FEDex tracking states Label Created. Will have more info when Fed EX has package. ARggg.

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

It’s Auber’s double wall probe 4”.

I can set anywhere in that 3” range. Looks to me at full insertion it was over the center holes. 1” it’s over the damper plate.

The damper does contact the probe so I don’t have 360 degrees of rotation.

I have a magnahelic but it’s not installed. It going to be tricky as I must be below the damper but not interfere with it. I think I can drill the left side below the damper hole and make it work with. But then I’m limited to 200 degrees of rotation which is fine.

It’s 24’ if 6” SS lightweight liner wrapped with UL listed liner insulation. The foil is the aluminum tape that came with the insulation kit to seal the ends of the ceramic insulation.

Eventually it will get a blockoff plate and the 6” will get wrapped with 8” stovepipe section that the damper will operate through. (Probably drilled for the probe and a pressure tube.

View attachment 306574

If the damper is fully open, I considered that at 0 degrees. At fully shut it is at 90 degrees. I usually have my damper set between 75 and 85 degrees to get the draft at acceptable levels. I consider .05 " WC to be acceptable. I think you need to know what your draft measures.

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

Update:

I put some RTV between the glass window gasket at the door frame. I now do not feel that I have a leak via the window.

I seem to still have a leak from the door seal; but not all the time. It leaks where the door latch is located. The opening in the stove that receives the door latch roller results in a smaller surface area for the gasket to contact. The gasket has a narrower area to contact.
It also seems that as the fire progresses and everything gets hotter, the door seal seems to fail. Where the seal passed the dollar bill test along the bottom when cold, I can see flames erupting once it get hotter.

I placed a plug into the center hole of the doghouse. These holes only allow air into the firebox whne the primary air controll is closed 80% or more. The jury is still out, however, I am seeing improvement. More control, less air wash air ignition, (and when it does ignite it is for a shorter period of time and less intense). Since I have had milder temps ( 20 - 34F) and less wind (0 - 7, gust to 12) since I put in the plug, I need more time to evaluate. This stove definitely was running different when it was windy.

Last year I could not get 600 F STT unless I had a nuclear reaction in the firebox and the flue temp was 1000 F plus. The flue still runs hotter than what others report their STT/flue ratio. Seems to be 200 F hotter. That maybe a characteristic of this stove.

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

Yep those three holes look like a typical boost air setup. My stove has two holes like that, plugged them with a couple screws and it made a big difference.

About 2 weeks ago I plugged one of the three doghouse air holes. Just stuck a #6 bolt into the center hole. I saw an improvement. Less volatility, better control, less ignition of primary 'air wash air', longer burn times.
This morning I plugged a second hole. I will run for 10 -14 days to determine how this effects the stove. I do not base my findings on one fire.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

I just covered the OAK knockouts (still intact) on my 1800 (equivalent) insert with sheet metal on both sides to control my overdraft situation. Super easy, just got a couple of cheap baking sheets and wedged between the fireplace bricks and the stove.

I also bought a piece of ceramic blanket and a steel weight to put above the baffle to slow the draft, but my sheet metal solution works so well, I never put it in.

I like the idea of a damper in the appliance adapter, and was going in that direction when I made the sheet metal discovery.

IIRC, my chimney is 24'. Insulated liner installed.

Also, shutting the air down gradually before it gets to blazin', has also helped avoid runaway burns.

She runs like a dream now. Cut my wood consumption down significantly, as well as burn times increased significantly, because I'm not sending all that heat up the chimney. Never get runaways, unless I'm being negligent attention-wise during reloads.

Such a ridiculously simple solution that completely solved my overdraft troubles.

 

[EbS-P]

I tried a diy turbulator. Four 2” long pieces of angle iron standing on end. With a 6” long piece on its side in front of the stock deflector. Flame patterns in the edges now will roll down a bit. But I do think it will result in more heat on the thin stainless heat shield that protects the down wash deflector. It spores this thin sheet steel is warping. Is that ok?

I got down to a bottom of one stack and have some wetter wood. So I’m definitely not testing the top end temps. It got warm so I only have 3 loads.

By biggest improvement was NS loading.

I can, with the damper on a cold start starve the fire for even after it’s been running at 700 for 2 hours. Took a peak at the chimney cap and it looked decent up top.

I am content not making any more changes this season.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

Forgot to mention, I started cutting most my wood to 20", as the 1800 fits 20" e/w. I also tried some cut to 16" to burn n/s. Quickly discovered e/w loading limits the size of the load, and the fires were slow and cooler. I really need my stove to be a serious heating machine, so I recut cords and cords to fit n/s. I finally settled on cutting to 15.5" as cutting to 16" puts you almost right up against the glass, and leaves no margin of error for getting the door closed.

 

[EbS-P]

So with a damper is it better to run the damper full closed with a primary air at 10-25% open or damper open a bit and air control full closed?

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

So with a damper is it better to run the damper full closed with a primary air at 10-25% open or damper open a bit and air control full closed?

I ...... don't have an answer for this question. For my set up I monitor my manometer for draft, and my digital flue probe for stove pipe temperature. Then I make adjustments accordingly. In my set up I get a lot of draft, therefore I end up closing my damper nearly all the way closed in order to achieve the .05 " WC of less that I want. I do this in 2 - 3 adjustments as the fire is building. I close down my primary air in very small adjustments. Just a tap of my fist against the coil handle. I might do 7 - 8 adjustments as I turn down the primary air. I watch what happens after I make an adjustment. Nothing happens right away. The rate of increase of the flue temp will start to slow. Then it may stop, and slowly start to drop. Then it may increase the speed of the drop. Then the speed of the drop may start to slow, and then it may stop. Then it might fight back and start to rise again; slow at first, then faster. I try to make my adjustments so that this pattern is minimualized. If I make a big change to the primary air when closing it down, I can see the flames in the firebox slowly go out. I have extingushed the flames by making a big close movement. Therefore small increments work for me.


When I have a good fire on a cold day, my damper is nearly fully closed and and my primary air is full closed.

Today the stove is acting goofy. It is 37 F outside and drizzley. Hard to start. Have the primary air open more than usual.


What type of climate do you have in SE North Carolina?

 

[FredS2]

First post, great thread.
I will be installing an Escape 1800 soon.
I hadn't planed on installing a damper, after reading this maybe I should.
I have 21’ chimney pipe plus stove pipe.

Any other thoughts on install?
Thanks!

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

First post, great thread.
I will be installing an Escape 1800 soon.
I hadn't planed on installing a damper, after reading this maybe I should.
I have 21’ chimney pipe plus stove pipe.

Any other thoughts on install?
Thanks!

At 21'+ stove pipe, in NY, I'd install the damper, and be prepared to figure out your strategy for restricting airflow from the intakes. I can't help with the location of the intakes on the free stander, as I have the insert, but I'd start by looking for the outside air knockout, and start there.

 

[FredS2]

I will have 3’ of single wall stove pipe from stove. What is best place to put damper? Close to stove?
Would intake air need adjustment from startup to burn or would stove controls be enough?

 

[EbS-P]

First post, great thread.
I will be installing an Escape 1800 soon.
I hadn't planed on installing a damper, after reading this maybe I should.
I have 21’ chimney pipe plus stove pipe.

Any other thoughts on install?
Thanks!

Any elbows? Insulated? Size of chimney? Liner?

Get a flue probe thermometer.

 

[FredS2]

Plan is 3’ of vertical single wall 6” pipe from stove, to sw elbow to double dw tee, to 1’ dw pipe to adapter to 21’ insulated 6” chimney pipe.

 

[EbS-P]

Plan is 3’ of vertical single wall 6” pipe from stove, to sw elbow to double dw tee, to 1’ dw pipe to adapter to 21’ insulated 6” chimney pipe.

I think one damper will be more than enough. I can run mine to cold with the damper full closed on a cold start. 24’ insulated liner.

 

[ABMax24]

So with a damper is it better to run the damper full closed with a primary air at 10-25% open or damper open a bit and air control full closed?

I've found it better to run the flue damper full closed and the stove damper as open as possible.

The start of the burn is similar, but running the stove damper open burns the coals hotter and burns them down faster.

 

[EbS-P]

I've found it better to run the flue damper full closed and the stove damper as open as possible.

The start of the burn is similar, but running the stove damper open burns the coals hotter and burns them down faster.

That’s what I’m finding. Unrelated secondary air is probably never the limiting the burn rate.

 

[EbS-P]

I finally marked my air control rod. Should have done it sooner.

 

[FredS2]

Just received my escape 1800 with legs. I am impressed by the build.

 

[Ajsteffen]

I finally marked my air control rod. Should have done it sooner.

View attachment 308734

I wish the stove versions had an air control rod like this. Mine is a lever that slides back and forth, and it’s too far away from the ash tray to really make any demarcation lines.

 

[Woodcutter Tom]

My Summer Project: I was always having trouble with air leaking past the bottom of the door on my stove. The front of the stove and the door are not completely on the same plane. The portion of the front of the stove below the door opening angles toward the back of the stove. Therefore there is a gap and I could not get a good seal.

I tried multiple methods in an attempt to seal the lower portion. I placed a ‘backer’ behind the door seal. I added more silicone behind the door seal and let it swish out as I installed the gasket and closed the door. With each of these I thought I could bring the door seal out enough to force it to press against the stove body enough to seal the gap. I even glued gasket material to the stove body where it met the door gasket. I was not successful in my attempts. I still had air leak into the firebox which ignited flames. These flames would then ignite the primary air-wash air. The result would be lots of flames at the top ½ of the glass and a build up of soot on the bottom ½.

Over the summer I added a ridge along the entire face of the stove where the door seal meets the stove body. I also built up the section of the stove body that angled away toward the rear of the stove. Now the area of the stove body that meets the door seal and the door are on the same plane. The ridge will press into the door gasket creating a better seal.

I disassembled the stove completely (except for the primary air control lever; I could not get it off). After grinding and sanding the paint off, I built up the indented area at the bottom of the stove body with weld. Then I ground it flat so that it is on the same plane as the rest of the stove front. I then welded a bead along the face of the stove where the gasket meets the stove face. I used multiple pieces of paper for my dollar bill test. The pieces held firm. Therefore I am hopeful that the leaks are stopped.

The stove has now been painted and reassembled. I am ready for some cold weather for testing. Wish me luck.

 

[EbS-P]

My Summer Project: I was always having trouble with air leaking past the bottom of the door on my stove. The front of the stove and the door are not completely on the same plane. The portion of the front of the stove below the door opening angles toward the back of the stove. Therefore there is a gap and I could not get a good seal.

I tried multiple methods in an attempt to seal the lower portion. I placed a ‘backer’ behind the door seal. I added more silicone behind the door seal and let it swish out as I installed the gasket and closed the door. With each of these I thought I could bring the door seal out enough to force it to press against the stove body enough to seal the gap. I even glued gasket material to the stove body where it met the door gasket. I was not successful in my attempts. I still had air leak into the firebox which ignited flames. These flames would then ignite the primary air-wash air. The result would be lots of flames at the top ½ of the glass and a build up of soot on the bottom ½.

Over the summer I added a ridge along the entire face of the stove where the door seal meets the stove body. I also built up the section of the stove body that angled away toward the rear of the stove. Now the area of the stove body that meets the door seal and the door are on the same plane. The ridge will press into the door gasket creating a better seal.

I disassembled the stove completely (except for the primary air control lever; I could not get it off). After grinding and sanding the paint off, I built up the indented area at the bottom of the stove body with weld. Then I ground it flat so that it is on the same plane as the rest of the stove front. I then welded a bead along the face of the stove where the gasket meets the stove face. I used multiple pieces of paper for my dollar bill test. The pieces held firm. Therefore I am hopeful that the leaks are stopped.

The stove has now been painted and reassembled. I am ready for some cold weather for testing. Wish me luck. View attachment 315639 View attachment 315640 View attachment 315641

Nice work! Hope it works out this winter. How long a bead did you weld at a time? My concern would be warping the front?