Blaze King - Poor Burn Time

[bholler]

OK, I'll give you a pass due to the whole haunted castle thing, but who else burns on low in the middle of winter??

He also still burns a lot of oil

 

[Highbeam]

OK, I'll give you a pass due to the whole haunted castle thing, but who else burns on low in the middle of winter??

Me! It’s dark, raining, and in the 40s outside. Perfect for low and slow.

 

[Ashful]

OK, I'll give you a pass due to the whole haunted castle thing, but who else burns on low in the middle of winter??

Folks with spray-foamed 2x6 construction? I burn the same rate in any outdoor temperature below 60F. The only thing that varies is the amount of oil I burn to compensate the wood.

 

[Diabel]

I will burn on low in the middle of winter after two three days of 24/7 burning. The house where the Princess resides is insulated well beyond 2x6 spray foam construction.

 

[lsucet]

I burn on low 99% of the time. Having the choice of run one or both depending outside temp.
Having figured out how much wood to load so so, for about 24hrs burn is a blessing. No need to pack them full, if I do, I go over the 30hrs burn and screw up my schedule or I have to load when still wood left.

 

[Howdebody89]

Thanks, Highbeam, for the explanation re: wood and water. And thanks to everyone else for their help.

I honestly think something is wrong with the stove (he says half sarcastically - ). Below are pictures of my combuster indicator and an infrared thermometer directed immediately adjacent to the indicator / on the surface of the stove. Seems WAAAAY too hot. This is ~ 45 minutes after lighting kindling/starting and running as follows: open damper/turn off combuster, turn thermostat on high, light kindling, load wood (largest splits) fully only after kindling established, close door, close damper only when gets in active zone, immediately lower thermostat to lowest possible setting (7 PM) and leave fan off.

I cannot imagine this is all because my chimney is 25-30 feet high! Minimum wind right now. Still rather vigourous flame. No smoke out of chimney.

Again . . . thanks for any help.


Tom

 

[lsucet]

Thanks, Highbeam, for the explanation re: wood and water. And thanks to everyone else for their help.

I honestly think something is wrong with the stove (he says half sarcastically - ). Below are pictures of my combuster indicator and an infrared thermometer directed immediately adjacent to the indicator / on the surface of the stove. Seems WAAAAY too hot. This is ~ 45 minutes after lighting kindling/starting and running as follows: open damper/turn off combuster, turn thermostat on high, light kindling, load wood (largest splits) fully only after kindling established, close door, close damper only when gets in active zone, immediately lower thermostat to lowest possible setting (7 PM) and leave fan off.

I cannot imagine this is all because my chimney is 25-30 feet high! Minimum wind right now. Still rather vigourous flame. No smoke out of chimney.

Again . . . thanks for any help.


Tom

Did you check if the knob is not spinning on the shaft not actually going to low.

On the freestanding stoves I know the adjustment procedure but on inserts I don't know.

 

[weatherguy]

Looks like you have as super draft, same problem I had with my Princess insert, cuts down on the burn time. They really like an optimal draft.

 

[Howdebody89]

Knob does not seem to be spinning freely. It does seem to be engaging properly. Could the thermostat be broken in some other more subtle way?

" . . . same problem I had with my Princess insert . . . "

Weatherguy . . . you say you 'had' the same problem. Is there a way to adjust the draft on these - other than the thermostat? Very frustrating, these short burn times.

 

[Ashful]

I had the same problem on one of my two BKs, a 30’ pipe that generated more than 3x the ideal draft. I solved it nicely with a key damper, as many others have, but that could be a challenge with an insert.

I haven’t looked at an insert manual, but they specify 0.06” maximum water column for my freestander, and 0.05” as ideal.

 

[Howdebody89]

This is very depressing. I have absolutely no control of the burn rate on this thing and can't get more than 6 hours. I lit this fire at 3:30 PM today and I am looking at large embers now (8 PM). The cat gauge traveled ~ 270 degrees it was so hot, and my surface temp check with infrared could read nothing but HI at its peak. I would have thought the Blaze King dealer would have advised me re: the specs (per Ashful) given the dimensions of my chimney.

Anything I can put at the top of the chimney to serve as a damper? Key damper does not seem to be an option for this/an insert. Someone mentioned a 'reducer'. I have read that the damper option results in increased creosote build up and can be impossible to fully clean.

 

[lsucet]

This is very depressing. I have absolutely no control of the burn rate on this thing and can't get more than 6 hours. I lit this fire at 3:30 PM today and I am looking at large embers now (8 PM). The cat gauge traveled ~ 270 degrees it was so hot, and my surface temp check with infrared could read nothing but HI at its peak. I would have thought the Blaze King dealer would have advised me re: the specs (per Ashful) given the dimensions of my chimney.

Anything I can put at the top of the chimney to serve as a damper? Key damper does not seem to be an option for this/an insert. Someone mentioned a 'reducer'. I have read that the damper option results in increased creosote build up and can be impossible to fully clean.

I don't know if there is something that you can install at the top but for sure it will not be legal and recommended. Either way you should be able to kill the flames if you complete shut the tstat. At least on freestanding is like that. If with the tstat all the way closed to the stopping point flames still going, you have something else going on. Did you try to go lower than the low mark and see ? Maybe you can go lower that what you are doing. Just a thought.

 

[Howdebody89]

I turned it is far 'off' as it can go and it was still roaring. I am at a loss.

 

[Ashful]

This is very depressing. I have absolutely no control of the burn rate on this thing and can't get more than 6 hours.

If that is the case, then there’s more than just strong draft happening here. Even on my 30 foot pipe, my stove was completely controllable under all conditions.

@BKVP is traveling, I think, but he will likely be along for some better advice, before long.

 

[weatherguy]

Theres a way to put a damper on an insert, Bhollers done it, I was going to put one on mine but switched stoves.

 

[Howdebody89]

I really appreciate you guys. I am almost resigned to the inevitability of a short, hot burn which cannot be controlled with my tstat due to excessive draft/tall chimney, but MAYBE @BKVP and/or Bhollers can help. I don't know proper etiquette here. Do I wait for them to join the discussion or should I reach out directly to them? If the latter, how do I do so?

Assuming the worst (no way to control the draft with damper ), what would be the optimal way to burn the stove going forward - so the heat is not excessive (? cat-damaging) and get a reasonable burn time? I'm ALMOST resigned to this fact. Should I half load with large splits and run with thermostat in lowest position but fan on high (to keep stove on cooler side)?

As an aside, after getting in active zone, I have been lowering the tstat quickly (with one turn) from high to lowest setting. I assume this is OK and not damaging, but just thought I'd ask if that - in and of itself - is a problem. I know any heat response is delayed (hours), but the actual rapid mechanical adjustment should be OK, right?

Thanks.

 

[Woody Stover]

I bet that installing one damper (since you probably can't get two on an insert,) plus putting a 6'>5.5" reducer on top of the liner will help quite a bit.

I have been lowering the tstat quickly (with one turn) from high to lowest setting. I assume this is OK and not damaging,

That's no problem. Another thing you could try is to burn just a few splits to get the stove up to temp initially, then put the bigger load in and shut the air down fairly quickly. And don't have the coals spread out on the floor of the box, where you're forced to put much of the load on coals where it will take off faster. That way, you don't have a big load initially, where most of the wood gets burning before you can get the stove up to temp and cut the air. But the only way to get a satisfactory low burn is going to be to address the excessive draft issue.

 

[Alpine1]

@Howdebody89 can you post a picture of the whole fireplace? I’m quite sure there must be a way to put in a damper of some sort...

 

[rwhite]

Is there a way to see the thermostat flapper on an insert? Not only to verify that its closing all the way but I was wondering if a small magnet or foil tape could be placed over the hole in the flapper to cut the air even more? When you turn the thermostat from high to low very quickly can you hear the flapper fully close? My princess is very audible when I do it.

 

[BKVP]

Oh....I'm here, just cross-crossing the country compliments of Delta.

First, alert the dealer. If they installed it, they need to perform a few checks.

Second, PM the name of the dealer, date of purchase and serial number as well as your contact information.

You can also send above needed info and pictures to [email protected]

I'm in my office this coming week and can help you out where possible.

BKVP

 

[drstorm]

Or if you can get NIELS!

Or Tractor Supply stores have Redstone compressed wood blocks.

 

[Ashful]

Sounds like BK is on the case. But just to clear up some general misconceptions, at least one of which may be based on something I said above:

1. Strong draft will not prevent long burn times. I don't own that particular insert, but I do own two BK's, and can say the OP's issue is almost surely not solely related to strong draft. My Ashford 30.1 could still achieve 20+ hour burns on a 30 foot pipe, and possibly longer, I just never tried on that particular stove.

2. Strong draft will likely cause you to overheat your stovepipe while running in bypass, and waiting for the cat to reach active temp. A 30 foot pipe on a bypassed stove will sweep flame right up the chimney, and I always worried about a chimney fire when running that way, although I never actually had one.

3. Strong draft seems to cause or accelerate cat combustor cloggage, mostly only an issue with Steelcats, and possibly only on some of the newer BK models with more aggressive air wash systems. I believe the issue is high air velocity, created by the tall stack, kicking up small amounts of fly ash.

I might add a few more points later... I'm being called for dinner!

 

[begreen]

Me! It’s dark, raining, and in the 40s outside. Perfect for low and slow.

Wow, quite the difference. We were were 53º and sunny yesterday afternoon, today too. I worked outside on the garden beds.

 

[Highbeam]

Wow, quite the difference. We were were 53º and sunny yesterday afternoon, today too. I worked outside on the garden beds.

yep, the rain cleared up mostly and we’re in a warm spell too. I saw 54 today.

 

[jetsam]

I really appreciate you guys. I am almost resigned to the inevitability of a short, hot burn which cannot be controlled with my tstat due to excessive draft/tall chimney, but MAYBE @BKVP and/or Bhollers can help. I don't know proper etiquette here. Do I wait for them to join the discussion or should I reach out directly to them? If the latter, how do I do so?

Assuming the worst (no way to control the draft with damper ), what would be the optimal way to burn the stove going forward - so the heat is not excessive (? cat-damaging) and get a reasonable burn time? I'm ALMOST resigned to this fact. Should I half load with large splits and run with thermostat in lowest position but fan on high (to keep stove on cooler side)?

As an aside, after getting in active zone, I have been lowering the tstat quickly (with one turn) from high to lowest setting. I assume this is OK and not damaging, but just thought I'd ask if that - in and of itself - is a problem. I know any heat response is delayed (hours), but the actual rapid mechanical adjustment should be OK, right?

Thanks.

You have an air leak or a messed up thermostat/flapper. High draft doesn't explain what you have going on.

If you turn down the thermostat all the way, the fire should immediately look different, and the flames should be gone within a minute.

If you've tested the door gasket and the glass gasket, I am betting that the fault lies with the flapper or thermostat. Failing that, maybe someone drilled an extra hole in your stove with a forklift.