2022/23 VC Owner thread

[GrumpyDad]

Last post for the night.
I moved the propane tank, since it alarms some of you
I posted the current outside and inside temp monitor along with my current burn photo .
Stt is at 450
Fleu is at 300
100% air
And cat engaged for over an hour after hot reload.
This bear is manageable with wood drying next to it.
BTW, I hate alder wood. It makes for some sandy ash.
View attachment 310179
View attachment 310178

Looks good. Im surprised at 100% your STT is only at 450.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

So heres an update to my stove...

It seams to be working fine.. Its super hard to tell as its been warm and the stove hasn't been consistently running..
As noted in previous post.. I pulled the air manifold vacuumed out the inside air passages and adjusted the aire shutter..
I ran the stove twice and found out that my catalyst needed to be changed.. I put a new one in.. stove seams to be running normal but Im not able to continually run it and do hot reloads.. so im not 100% convinced..
Also im getting dark glass on the left door.. so at the end of next month when im not really burning ill have to do a door glass gasket..

 

[sargeott]

Is that reading on the outside of the split or on a freshly split face with the pins going with the grain

This stuff has been split for a long time. So just tested on the existing face.

 

[sargeott]

Looks good. Im surprised at 100% your STT is only at 450.

Honestly, given all of the previous folks here. I am too.
When I run with the bypass open the stove can skyrocket on the stt and fleu temps if not monitored. Seems like a very strong draft.
Then I close the bypass and I have to run it wide open to maintain heat, flames and temp....

 

[GrumpyDad]

Honestly, given all of the previous folks here. I am too.
When I run with the bypass open the stove can skyrocket on the stt and fleu temps if not monitored. Seems like a very strong draft.
Then I close the bypass and I have to run it wide open to maintain heat, flames and temp....

Ok I understand now. So that will happen to every new VC owner. It is only one of two things, mostly...wet wood or you aren't getting a good enough bed of coals. Don't mind that bs about cat temps.
Try using smaller pieces of wood, get that initial fire going for a couple of hours feeding it to produce coals then load it up with mediums. Get that on fire, wait till you see the bottom row turning to embers on the bottom of the log...then switch over to secondary and leave air control on high. Watch for awhile then adjust as needed but don't adjust to the point flame goes out OR later in the burn you see a nice tall glowing base of embers. Like 3-4 inches. Then if no flame is showing that's ok with that bed of coals. You are in the super efficiency zone at that point.
Otherwise a flame must always be showing.

All of these take 8 hours to get to the point of cruising. After 8 hours you can load it , let that load catch a bit then switch to secondary pretty quickly in comparison to loads without enough coals or cold start loads.

Then you can watch your cat temps all you want but it will be boring if you don't have an issue with your setup and do the above.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

This stuff has been split for a long time. So just tested on the existing face.

Ok.. if this is what you did then your wood is pretty wet. This is why your stove is slow.
To get a accurate reading you will need to take a piece and resplit it testing on the freshly split face with the pins going with the grain. ..The outside is the driest so if its 18% on the outside its probably low 30s on the inside. The wood your testing should be room temperature.
With dry wood your stove will take off alot quicker and your temperatures will be alo higher because the wood doesn't have to burn off all that moisture..
Dont take the advice above, Grumpydad is incorrect.. Cat temperature are not BS.. Once your wood is properly seasoned your stove will act way different.. cat temperatures are something to monitor for a number of reasons. 1 it will keep your draft up when on a low temperature and keep the stove from stalling. 2 .. this will ensure a clean burn and not a large accumulation of creosote in the stove pipe..
Its completely false the statement from the post above dont not take that advice or believe Grumpy dad.. Its not an 8 hour process to get your stove cruising. Once your wood is properly seasoned.. and if your stove has good draft. the process of getting it to the point of your stove cruising, wl be short.. Id say for most probably an hour or under. My stove takes me about 45 minutes from a cold start to when I engage my catalyst.. Beegreen has noted it takes him roughly 30 minutes.. granted begreens stove is different from ours but still you shoud be under an hour
The advantage of having your catalyst in and monitored and running correctly, is the ability to turn your stove way down on less heat demand days.. this is where your stove will really shine. Not having to keep the temperature of the stove way up and making your room or house to hot.
The 2 things that drive your stove are your wood and your draft.. if 1 is off your stove performance will be way down..

 

[arnermd]

My 2 cents..... Just cuase I can't keep my opinions to myself...haha

Ok.. if this is what you did then your wood is pretty wet. This is why your stove is slow.
To get a accurate reading you will need to take a piece and resplit it testing on the freshly split face with the pins going with the grain. ..The outside is the driest so if its 18% on the outside its probably low 30s on the inside. The wood your testing should be room temperature.

• I will second that.... 18-23% on the outside is high..... Wood is what I would call "wet"
• Temperature matters.... I experimented with this a few weeks ago and it makes a difference. There are temp correction tables out there on the internet but they did not seem all that accurate to me.... Best bet is measure at room temp, as said above.

Cat temperature are not BS.. Once your wood is properly seasoned your stove will act way different..

• I have to agree again, 110%

1 it will keep your draft up when on a low temperature and keep the stove from stalling. 2 .. this will ensure a clean burn and not a large accumulation of creosote in the stove pipe..

• Agree again....
• I would also add #3: To protect your refractory. High cat temps not only shorten the life of the cat they also shorten the life of the refractory. If that's not of concern to you that's OK, but check out the price of new refractory and a complete rebuild..... I suspect you will see value in a cat temp monitor....
• If your stove never has excessive cat temp issues then maybe it is not a good investment.... but i know where I would place my bet.

Its not an 8 hour process to get your stove cruising. Once your wood is properly seasoned.. and if your stove has good draft. the process of getting it to the point of your stove cruising, wl be short.. Id say for most probably an hour or under

• Agree.... (shocker)
• My stove normally takes 45-60 min to come up to temp from cold start. My stove never really "cruises" cat temps are always rising or falling.... but the heat output and STT is settled in about an hour or less. My stove is bigger so I would expect it to take a bit longer than the Encores and your Dauntless. You can see temp plots from my previous posts for details.
  • FYI..... put your stove make and model in your tag line so we know what model you are running in the future....
• I personally do not really monitor the coal bed during start, if the temps are hot enough I engage the cat..... If the cat stalls I open the bypass and let it heat up some more.... Certainly a nice coal bed makes cat light off easier.

Cat benefits:

• I agree with all said above..... My stove struggles with low and slow due to excessive cat temps, but certainly what @Woodsplitter67 said is correct, with a cat you can have a low grade smokey primary fire and not load up the flue with creosote.
• I have run without a cat (or blocked secondary air inlet) and the results were dramatic, a lot more creosote buildup over the course of a burn season.
• Do I get more heat with a cat, is it more efficient?: Yes I think so....but it is hard to measure and it is not a dramatic increase.

 

[arnermd]

So heres an update to my stove...

It seams to be working fine.. Its super hard to tell as its been warm and the stove hasn't been consistently running..
As noted in previous post.. I pulled the air manifold vacuumed out the inside air passages and adjusted the aire shutter..
I ran the stove twice and found out that my catalyst needed to be changed.. I put a new one in.. stove seams to be running normal but Im not able to continually run it and do hot reloads.. so im not 100% convinced..
Also im getting dark glass on the left door.. so at the end of next month when im not really burning ill have to do a door glass gasket..

As I recall you think the root cause of the problem was that the cable got misrouted somehow?

Can you describe what convinced you the cat was dead? Did it just not come up to temp?
- I ask because I have had multiple burns in a row where I thought my cat was dead and then it started working again fine.... weird.
- I have also seen high secondary temps with no cat installed.....
- Wondering if a better indicator might be smoke emissions, but I have also had times when I went outside to check and expected to see no smoke but I do..... not sure that's reliable either?

What Cat did you put in? Metal or ceramic?

Have you found darkened glass to be a good indicator of a sealing problem?
- I would think if you had an air leak the glass would be cleaner in that area due to excess oxygen.... but I could be wrong on that.

 

[GrumpyDad]

Anyone get smoke spillage from top hatch? Of course the one time I leave home and have my wife operate the stove she said there is a good bit of smoke coming out the top hatch. With the damper open it stops. I'm going to just have her operate with it open until I can get back. Cat was just cleaned too

 

[Eman85]

You have to open the damper BEFORE you open the top.

 

[GrumpyDad]

You have to open the damper BEFORE you open the top.

No the smoke is coming out from the top hatch with it closed shut against the stove. No wood pushing up against it and nothing on the gasket area like wood etc.

 

[begreen]

Might have been caused by a puffback due to improper operation of the stove or poor wood.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

No the smoke is coming out from the top hatch with it closed shut against the stove. No wood pushing up against it and nothing on the gasket area like wood etc.

in order for people to understand you.. and answer the question..you actually have to use or describe the problem and use the words that have part names.. Like griddle.. or damper housing or bypass.. your stove doesn't have a hatch.. so nobody understands you..

 

[Woodsplitter67]

As I recall you think the root cause of the problem was that the cable got misrouted somehow?

Can you describe what convinced you the cat was dead? Did it just not come up to temp?
- I ask because I have had multiple burns in a row where I thought my cat was dead and then it started working again fine.... weird.
- I have also seen high secondary temps with no cat installed.....
- Wondering if a better indicator might be smoke emissions, but I have also had times when I went outside to check and expected to see no smoke but I do..... not sure that's reliable either?

What Cat did you put in? Metal or ceramic?

Have you found darkened glass to be a good indicator of a sealing problem?
- I would think if you had an air leak the glass would be cleaner in that area due to excess oxygen.... but I could be wrong on that.

Yes so the cable was an issue.. and adjusting the flapper. I just think that it got out of adjustment after all of the years running.
The catalyst issue.. I know after fixing the stove that I had plenty of air flow.. I could see it, hear it when closing the bypass. The shutter looks to be in the correct position when the stove was at running temperature. Closing the bypass the catalyst was sluggish to get up to temperature to actually light off.. aka 600 degrees.. never got to the normal running temperature of 1100 to 1300 degrees, when the air was dialed back. When the air was dialed back the cat would crash.. going from 1000 degrees and dropping as opposed to how the stove ran normally which is close the bypass at 1000 degrees and have it climb to 1100 to 1300 degrees..
I thought that Id just swap out the cat and make sure. What I had upstairs sitting around was a ceramic cat so thats what I installed.. and the first fire it took off.. went to temperature and when the air was cut back it didn't stall
The past 24 hours confirmed that the stove is running properly. Last night the stove was loaded for the overnight burn at 7pm and when the bypass was closed the catalyst went to 1300 degrees and stayed there eventually dipping down some.. At 11pm the catalyst was at 975 degrees.. so said the wife.. At 5.15 am the stove was 300 degrees with lots of coals.. dropped in some wood got it up to temperature closed the bypass and catalyst was at 1100 degrees.. wife dialed the air back at 9am and when I got in from gathering wood at 4pm the stove had lots of coals.. dropped in a load of wood .. got it to temperature and catalyst is at 1050.. so its definitely running as before
As for the air leak.. I believe that some of it is leaking in from the glass gasket and it effects the air wash which is why the glass gets dirty in some areas.. its not a severe leak where the stove is uncontrollable.. Iv read on here from the people before me that this is the case for some of the dirty glass.. last time this happened I changed the glass gaskets and installed the doors, ran the stove.. it went away..
I feel good about my fix.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Have you found darkened glass to be a good indicator of a sealing problem?
- I would think if you had an air leak the glass would be cleaner in that area due to excess oxygen.... but I could be wrong on that.

Please.. always put your 2 cents in. You've been on here for quite some time.. stove rebuilds Et cetera. you can certainly help others out.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

on the scrounge today with the boy

 

[Eman85]

No the smoke is coming out from the top hatch with it closed shut against the stove. No wood pushing up against it and nothing on the gasket area like wood etc.

I can open my stove with the damper open and never get smoke once draft is established. If I get any smoke out of the griddle with it shut and the damper closed is due to a flashover in the firebox. High quantity of gases and high cat temp. I can see it happen and see the puff of smoke come out as it lifts the griddle.

 

[GrumpyDad]

Might have been caused by a puffback due to improper operation of the stove or poor wood.

It's was continuous though. Not happening now, I'm back and will let that stove go out then inspect top down tomorrow. Something is obstructed. Draft is probably a bit poor due to outside temps, and I put very large pieces of oak in and let it burn a couple hours before leaving. Oak is dead on 20 percent so maybe a couple of pieces I put in were more.

 

[arnermd]

It's was continuous though. Not happening now, I'm back and will let that stove go out then inspect top down tomorrow. Something is obstructed. Draft is probably a bit poor due to outside temps, and I put very large pieces of oak in and let it burn a couple hours before leaving. Oak is dead on 20 percent so maybe a couple of pieces I put in were more.

I have never seen that happen continuously, clearly you have low draft. As you said obstruction somewhere. 2 obvious places to check, which I am sure you already thought of.....
- Cat is plugged up
- Chimney is restricted

 

[Woodsplitter67]

This is my burn from this morning.. I know its hard to see..
I got the stove up to temp this morning after my overnight burn..
I let the stove sit a little while with the coals and let the stove cool some.. cat temperature eventually dropped to 682 degrees...
Loaded it up with 2.. 5x18 inch oak logs and turned the air down immediately and cats rising steadily.. stove will burn like this all day to late afternoon.. I will not add wood, I will not turn the air up, glass will stay clean, house will be warm, wife will sit by the stove and be happy..

 

[dmccoole]

10 degrees here in NH this morning. Burning off the glass now. Wife is happy as well!

 

[arnermd]

Fun things to do with your stove.... this is 10 lbs of eye round, on top is teriyaki jerky, on the mitten warmers is Biltong.

Mitten warmers..... they are not just for mittens. This is also a fun way to torture your little dog.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Fun things to do with your stove.... this is 10 lbs of eye round, on top is teriyaki jerky, on the mitten warmers is Biltong.

Mitten warmers..... they are not just for mittens. This is also a fun way to torture your little dog.

View attachment 310300

Now this.. I gotta show my wife..

 

[arnermd]

Now this.. I gotta show my wife..

If you like jerky.... this is a lot cheaper than buying it. Mind you it is not the super tenderized snacks you buy in the store, you got to work at it to eat it.... the way jerky should be.

Got a nice burn going this morning.... had a very deep bed of hot coals, ~10" or so (~3/4 of the way up the andirons). Cat was at 650. Threw some big oak splits on, closed the bypass right away, air set to 45%.

Cat immediately went to 1400 and stopped....cruising at 1225 right now, STT=500.

I must be dreaming..... Think I can do it again? Not a chance....

 

[Woodsplitter67]

If you like jerky.... this is a lot cheaper than buying it. Mind you it is not the super tenderized snacks you buy in the store, you got to work at it to eat it.... the way jerky should be.

Got a nice burn going this morning.... had a very deep bed of hot coals, ~10" or so (~3/4 of the way up the andirons). Cat was at 650. Threw some big oak splits on, closed the bypass right away, air set to 45%.

Cat immediately went to 1400 and stopped....cruising at 1225 right now, STT=500.

I must be dreaming..... Think I can do it again? Not a chance....

you got this..