2022-2023 BK everything thread

[Tron]

Well, Huntsville is significantly further north than we are, so entirely believable.

 

[snojetter]

Been waking up to 15 below the last few mornings with highs all the way up to 7 below. I don't even want to think of the windchill...but walking from the parking lot into work this morning was not fun. The TV and the Princess are in the same room. That's very convenient during stretches like this.

 

[MichiganSnowman]

Evening all, first comment but I have been soaking up the information on this site for a while now. This forum convinced me into getting a BK. 2 questions at the bottom, background info below:

House: Post frame construction, insulation is OK. Ceiling is poor due to all cathedral ceilings. Very open floor plan with very high ceilings (15' foot over stove, dining, kitchen (loft above these areas) and 22' in great room), ceiling fans in many areas including above the stove. We only recently purchased and moved into the house.

Woodstove: Stove is replacing a very old pot belly (PD Beckworth Round Oak E16, made between 1896-1925 per my research). New stove is a BK Princess 32.

Install: Cash and carry deal since the dealer install team is so backed up. I temped in the stove for this weekend since we are in the middle of the blizzard, -27 wind chill. Currently flue is single wall 6" for about 3', increases to 7", 90 degree turn, 15" horizontal run and dumping into a block and clay lined chimney, 8"x 8" clay, chimney rises another 20' or so. There is a clean out door at the bottom of the chimney, seems to seal well. There is also another tiny (coal?) pot belly tied into the same chimney, key damper is closed. This is a temporary install, our chimney sweep will be installing double wall insulated liner next week. I say all this because I suspect that my draft is poor with the current setup.

Wood: Mostly cherry with some oak, all from my FIL. Cherry measured 14% and oak 16%. Once seasoned, I will be burning exclusively oak from our 30 acres.

Finally the questions:
1) What does WOT look like on a properly drafted princess? I have been running pretty much WOT as long as the hyper active CAT is not getting crazy hot (passed the K on the thermomter, ~5:00) This is barely keeping the house at 65. I suspect that my poor draft is not maxing out the WOT. Pics of WOT would be great! I do plan on measuing the draft on the final install.

2) Do most princess stoves have the blower kit? I setup a box fan off to the side of the stove and that really helped move the heat off the stove. The stove is free standing in the middle of the dining + kitchen area so getting electric there is not super simple.

Thanks for the insight!

 

[BKVP]

Get the blowers! Move hot air into living space.

 

[Larch]

If possible would a out side air kit help here guys? It slightly increased draft in my situation and it was a bit high to begin with. Big holes in floor is a serious decision to make for maybe no return. I sure noticed warmer corners and less drafts
On the blazeking web sight there was a short video of a stove on high

 

[Ashful]

Welcome to the group, MS! With a Princess dumping into a clay tile flue, I suspect you're going to be very limited in how low and slow you can burn, as the weather warms. If your intent is only running at higher settings, this may not bother you.

I had a cat stove running into an 8" round clay tile chimney, and this was a problem for me, until I eventually slid a blanket-wrapped liner into it. At 7x7, there's no room for a blanket in yours, but even an uninsulated liner or one with vermiculite pour around it may offer some improvement. Of course, @bholler may tell us that's not legal without confirming your existing chimney is to code.

 

[MichiganSnowman]

If possible would a out side air kit help here guys? It slightly increased draft in my situation and it was a bit high to begin with. Big holes in floor is a serious decision to make for maybe no return. I sure noticed warmer corners and less drafts
On the blazeking web sight there was a short video of a stove on high

I will take a look at the site. Thanks!

 

[kennyp2339]

Currently flue is single wall 6" for about 3', increases to 7", 90 degree turn,

When the new chimney liner goes in, use (2) 45 deg elbows for the 90 into the thimble, this will reduce turbulence and let you breath easier, the 8x8 clay is prob reducing your draft since the flue gases are cooler, draft should pick up w/ a 6" insulated liner, I guess just make do with what you have for now, also you may already have but check your cap and make sure its clean and not restricted from the old stove, a semi clogged cap creates some heart ache with newer stoves.

 

[MichiganSnowman]

When the new chimney liner goes in, use (2) 45 deg elbows for the 90 into the thimble, this will reduce turbulence and let you breath easier, the 8x8 clay is prob reducing your draft since the flue gases are cooler, draft should pick up w/ a 6" insulated liner, I guess just make do with what you have for now, also you may already have but check your cap and make sure its clean and not restricted from the old stove, a semi clogged cap creates some heart ache with newer stoves.

Checked and cleaned last week, thanks! Good idea on the 45's!

 

[Nelson]

I know thermostat settings are entirely subjective to personal conditions but wondering what setting you all are using for a 12 hr burn. I've been doing exclusively 24 hr burns but want to experiment with a 12 hour cycle in very cold conditions and looking for a ballpark setting to start with.

 

[Tron]

I know thermostat settings are entirely subjective to personal conditions

Not only subjective, but largely dependent on wood mass (=fuel) that's in the stove. I have mostly pine around here, and that's probably about 1/2 of the density of oak or beech, so currently running the stove at about 3/4 open (roughly 4 o'clock) I hardly get 6 hours out of a load (hot reload with some coals present).
A cold start with no ashes and packed with oak will give significantly longer burn times.

 

[kennyp2339]

@Tron totally true, I’m running 12hr loads at 3 O’clock with the damper 3/4 closed, since it’s literally zero here with a decent wind my basement is 90 but the upstairs is 65 which is perfectly fine by me since it’s all wood heat and not fo$$ile

 

[panderson03]

I disagree though you may have been joking, hard to tell through the interwebs. Obviously, these BKs are optimized for low/medium output where emissions are lowest and efficiency is highest. They are capable of a wide range of outputs. A successful sizing of a BK does not require any loads to be run at maximum output. I think it's more likely the opposite, that if you often find yourself running at maximum output for a full load (unless catching up from a mistake or absence) then you likely bought too small of a stove or not enough stoves!

Wouldn't you be happier Poindexter running a 2x sized ashford at a slower rate? Longer burn time with less load cycles and more available heat capacity if needed? Wood consumption should be lower if you were down at higher efficiency levels. It's almost like there should be a BK furnace.

I run some short and hot loads near the warm ends of the shoulder seasons just to clean or keep clean the firebox as much as possible since corrosion seems to be a realistic concern. 95% of the time I'm at a pretty low output keeping the house warm for our very long burn season and I am very happy with my stove sizing choice.

that's exactly why we're considering replacing our little Princess with a King this summer

 

[begreen]

that's exactly why we're considering replacing our little Princess with a King this summer

That can be a very costly decision if there is not already an 8" flue system in place. A Regency 3500 or Woodstock Ideal Steel could be an alternative option if the goal is to keep the 6" flue system.

 

[Tron]

BTW, a question for y'all that have the fan kit: how exactly does the rheostat for the fans work? Does it have a few fixed speed settings or can you adjust the fan speed continuously? And turned down, is it really audible or just a faint whisper?

Thanks!

 

[Judge80]

I’m waiting on my blower kit from BK on back order. My stove does okay but I think I’m losing a lot of heat up the chase cubby in the basement. My basement is finished and insulated and heat is being pushed up the staircase to the main floor. I just think the blower kit will make a massive difference in getting more usable heat into the basement and upstairs even better.

 

[showrguy]

BTW, a question for y'all that have the fan kit: how exactly does the rheostat for the fans work? Does it have a few fixed speed settings or can you adjust the fan speed continuously? And turned down, is it really audible or just a faint whisper?

Thanks!

It’s variable speed, from a whisper to a hurricane..

 

[Tron]

I’m waiting on my blower kit from BK on back order. My stove does okay but I think I’m losing a lot of heat up the chase cubby in the basement.

I wouldn't say that the blower fans improve efficiency (if that's what you mean), but rather distribute the warm air more effectively. Besides, they can raise the burn rate, because at Thermostat wide open, it will still be a bit closed when it gets hot. The fans help remove heat from the stove, cooling it, so the stove can deliver more BTU/hr. as it does not "overheat" to the point where the thermostat closes to prevent overfire.

 

[Judge80]

I wouldn't say that the blower fans improve efficiency (if that's what you mean), but rather distribute the warm air more effectively. Besides, they can raise the burn rate, because at Thermostat wide open, it will still be a bit closed when it gets hot. The fans help remove heat from the stove, cooling it, so the stove can deliver more BTU/hr. as it does not "overheat" to the point where the thermostat closes to prevent overfire.

I’m just talking about a more effective use of my heat being produced and staying inside the house. I know it won’t improve stove efficiency per se, but if the heat is being better used with the blowers, I could turn the thermostat on the stove more and get longer burns. Or at the very least, similar burn times as now after being turned down to a lower temperature.

I know the blowers will cool the stove more and cause it to require more from the thermostat as a result.

 

[Ashful]

Although fans wouldn't have much impact on the efficiency of the stove itself, they can improve the efficiency of the stove/house system, in some circumstances, such as people stuffing the stove back inside a fireplace (see my avatar). By stripping heat off the stove and sending it out into the room, less is available to be absorbed by the masonry surrounding it, and thus less is radiated to the back yard through the stone wall separating the stove from outside.

Once or twice per year I'll shut the fans off for maintenance or something, and then forget to turn them back on when lighting back up. I do notice the stonework getting warmer than usual, with the fans off.

 

[Poindexter]

I know thermostat settings are entirely subjective to personal conditions but wondering what setting you all are using for a 12 hr burn. I've been doing exclusively 24 hr burns but want to experiment with a 12 hour cycle in very cold conditions and looking for a ballpark setting to start with.

Since you are likely home tomorrow, I suggest loading it however you usually load it, leave the throttle at the top mark and see how fast it burns down. With two data points you can say "here is the setting for a 24 hour burn" and at the WOT setting you can say the load burns out in xyz hours here, and then kinda squint and wing it on the next load.

Remember colder outdoor air will increase your total draft. That can shorten your burn times at predetermined settings if it is cold enough out.

 

[Ohio123]

Hey everyone I am in need of advice from the experts here. This is my second year with Sirocco 25 insert. I have decently seasoned hardwood I am using this year. I am not getting close to the burn times others have posted here. I probably get 2hrs in the active cat zone.

My process is getting the fire going till it gets into the cat zone, close bypass, burn on high for 15 min, then dial down to the thermostat. At that point I turn the fan on the lowest setting and burn for 2hrs before cat isn’t active.

My questions:
When people speak of long burn times are they implying total time in cat zone or just when their isn’t any hot coals at all?

Are long burn times influenced by having blower on? I’ve tried using no blower and still get same amount of time in cat zone?

Once you burn on high for 15min in the cat zone and dial down thermostat, are the flames supposed to die down pretty quickly? When I dial down their seems to be no change in flames, it seems to burn pretty strongly. I’m wondering if my thermostat is faulty or I’m letting too to much oxygen in(door not closing).

I am starting to think I bought a lemon BK insert. From the factory the catalyst meter was installed incorrectly. I’m wondering if anything else was misinstalled.

 

[BKVP]

Hey everyone I am in need of advice from the experts here. This is my second year with Sirocco 25 insert. I have decently seasoned hardwood I am using this year. I am not getting close to the burn times others have posted here. I probably get 2hrs in the active cat zone.

My process is getting the fire going till it gets into the cat zone, close bypass, burn on high for 15 min, then dial down to the thermostat. At that point I turn the fan on the lowest setting and burn for 2hrs before cat isn’t active.

My questions:
When people speak of long burn times are they implying total time in cat zone or just when their isn’t any hot coals at all?

Are long burn times influenced by having blower on? I’ve tried using no blower and still get same amount of time in cat zone?

Once you burn on high for 15min in the cat zone and dial down thermostat, are the flames supposed to die down pretty quickly? When I dial down their seems to be no change in flames, it seems to burn pretty strongly. I’m wondering if my thermostat is faulty or I’m letting too to much oxygen in(door not closing).

I am starting to think I bought a lemon BK insert. From the factory the catalyst meter was installed incorrectly. I’m wondering if anything else was misinstalled.

The cat thermometer is a switch. It's not like the type used on other models. When the thermal couple gets to 500F, it switches "on".

Then it stays in a very limited range referencing a clock, 12-1 range.

As for the burn times, most reference to a coal bed. The use of fans will shorten burn times. Long burn times are typically best observed in shoulder season heating but also in dead of winter, depending upon a homes size, r-value and homeowner comfort level.

Are you able to post an picture of your full load? Can you weigh it before you load to get idea of Btu input?

 

[Ohio123]

BKVP,
Thanks for replying. I was hoping to get your opinion on things. Today I will start a fire and get a hot bed of coals going, then weigh and take a pic of the reload. The initial load to start the fire weight 25lbs. I plan to keep the blower off and burn it on low after it is 15-20 min burn on high once cat is active.

Can I ask how quickly a the flames should die down once I cut the thermostat down? How should a slow burn look to the eye?

 

[BKVP]

How quickly the flames die-down is highly variable based upon piece size, loading orientation and draft.

Make certain you've clean out all but 1" deep coals so you can get maximum load.