2018-19 Blaze King Performance Thread Part 1 (Everything BK)

[Highbeam]

Would you accept 65-70? Zero may take a bit of work in here....

Your gauge has no numbers so...

 

[Highbeam]

Yessir... I have run periodic high burns to try and manage the creosote buildup. And yes, am mindful of how I load wood. I always leave an inch or two in back to allow for air flow to circulate along the back of the stove and along the top. And am mindful of loading to reduce wood falling onto the glass. Have been pretty diligent about that.,

And I appreciate your ideas yes. On the changing the gaskets... the original door came on the new stove. It stayed on for what yes, would be a burn in period. The original stayed on for two months before I attempted the first reinstalled gasket. Each subsequent gasket replacement remained in place for a month. This last one is on a replacement door from BK.

Tx for the continuing ideas. I know this is boring for this forum. Just am trying one more time to come at this.

Hello dr, I also have a princess just a bit north if you. About 6 years now on a 12’ chimney. I’ve worn out cats and replaced door gaskets. Burning Douglas fir mostly in a relatively warm climate.

I’ve been reading and you seem to really be making an effort. Everything you tell us sounds to be spot on but you still smell smoke from the hinge side of the door. Usually when this happens there is something obvious causing the problem that is not apparent in the written description.

I think you’ve beaten the heck out of the door seal. It’s tight, passes the dollar bill test. Let’s move on.

The chimney is clean and you either have no screen on top or you verified that it is spotless.

Now let’s talk about your chimney. The princess requires 15’ of “effective” stack height at sea level. That’s all vertical. You report a very tall chimney with only a minor bend which should make up for your elevation.

At this point we need some photos. We need to see the interior black pipe from stove to ceiling and then an outside photo of the roof with the stack. It’s pretty easy to post photos on the forum right from your phone or your computer. You can probably even email pics if you can’t post them. Don’t worry, we’re not crazies, just stove nerds.

You’re going to love the princess once we get the issue fixed.

Here’s mine.

 

[MissMac]

Got this load all ready last night and turned it down for overnight cruise around 20:00 last night. 11 hrs later, up with the cats, crank the stove and watch it roar back to life. Love it. I should mention it’s all pine, for the pine haters

 

[Diabel]

Lit the stove at noon yesterday. All hard maple. The level where the stove sits is comfortable 22*C. I think I will reload in couple of hours.

 

[Ryan723]

Bypass door tension--how much is too much?

Finally had the right (warm out) time to adjust my bypass on my Ashford 30. I haven't done it in the 5 years I've had the stove.

It was loose.....at the point where I knew it was camming over, but I couldn't really feel it at all.

I adjusted and now I'm concerned I went a little too tight?

For the last cam-over bit to lock it in, it now takes a solid downward 'push' on the level. I don't have to lean on it, but it takes maybe ~5-6 lbs of pressure on the handle to lock it in. And it takes a bit of a pull too on the unlock.

I don't feel like i'm over-stressing anything, but am i at risk of hurting anything if its a little too tight? I think i'm just not used to any tension on the bypass and this is just taking some getting used to.

Any insight? worth another cat gasket (which I have spares on hand) to loosen it a bit?

 

[Tar12]

Bypass door tension--how much is too much?

Finally had the right (warm out) time to adjust my bypass on my Ashford 30. I haven't done it in the 5 years I've had the stove.

It was loose.....at the point where I knew it was camming over, but I couldn't really feel it at all.

I adjusted and now I'm concerned I went a little too tight?

For the last cam-over bit to lock it in, it now takes a solid downward 'push' on the level. I don't have to lean on it, but it takes maybe ~5-6 lbs of pressure on the handle to lock it in. And it takes a bit of a pull too on the unlock.

I don't feel like i'm over-stressing anything, but am i at risk of hurting anything if its a little too tight? I think i'm just not used to any tension on the bypass and this is just taking some getting used to.

Any insight? worth another cat gasket (which I have spares on hand) to loosen it a bit?

Your fine..I did the same and left it...it has since lightened up a bit..

 

[Woody Stover]

Regardless, I still have my BK "10 year warranty certificate" to claim when I throw the towel in.
And as I have said prior, I have done the math and know the under over hours on my cat sits right around the magical 10,000 hour mark.

So has anyone called in the 10-yr warranty in year 4, 5, or 6? The wording implies that replacement is still pro-rated after 3 yrs, and the the 10-yr warranty only applies to "defects in manufacturing or materials."
I think I asked about it previously but can't recall if this was addressed in a reply..
1. The original warranty on the combustor, as stated in the owner’s manual, is still in effect.
2. The 10 Year Extended Warranty covers only the original combustor for 10 years against defects in manufacturing or materials.

Bypass door tension--how much is too much?
I adjusted and now I'm concerned I went a little too tight?
worth another cat gasket (which I have spares on hand) to loosen it a bit?

Well, it would be the bypass gasket, not the cat gasket. But yeah, I think the gasket may be compressed and when you adjust the cam-down, it might be damn near bottoming out, so it takes more pressure than you're comfortable with. Same thing just happened to me, adjusting cam-down on my BIL's Fireview. I happen to have the gasket in stock, so I'll swap it soon. It shouldn't be as tight as it feels now. Plus, flame is still pulling back toward the bypass door, even when the bypass is closed, and the cat isn't heating up as fast as I think it should, even though the cat is only a couple years old..

 

[Ryan723]

So has anyone called in the 10-yr warranty in year 4, 5, or 6? The wording implies that replacement is still pro-rated after 3 yrs, and the the 10-yr warranty only applies to "defects in manufacturing or materials."
I think I asked about it previously but can't recall if this was addressed in a reply..
1. The original warranty on the combustor, as stated in the owner’s manual, is still in effect.
2. The 10 Year Extended Warranty covers only the original combustor for 10 years against defects in manufacturing or materials.

I just did a cat at year 5 and decided it wasn't worth it to try the warranty. The aftermarket cat was cheaper than the BK part--as I understand it, you buy the new cat through a dealer and you need to send the old cat back to BK if you're trying to warranty. My performance was degraded, but in good faith, I couldn't say it had failed. Plus, it was worth it to me to be able to keep the old cat after a vinegar bath as a 'usable' spare on the shelf.

4+ years was easily over 14k hours...the first year or two were more abusive than the latter, as i've gotten better running the stove. That cat and BK didn't owe me anything in my mind!

Well, it would be the bypass gasket, not the cat gasket. .... Plus, flame is still pulling back toward the bypass door, even when the bypass is closed, and the cat isn't heating up as fast as I think it should, even though the cat is only a couple years old..

Thanks for this. Sorry...I wasn't too clear: due to my install, it is MUCH easier to pull the cat than take the flue pipe off. So if I was going to adjust the bypass tension bolt, I'd pull the cat to do it. But I have spares, so not a showstopper for me. I don't have a bypass gasket, but will order 2 soon (one to replace and one as a spare).

I've convinced myself i see a reduction in the flame getting pulled towards the bypass now that it is tighter.

EDIT: @Woody Stover As I'm thinking about this more, what you're saying makes perfect sense--as the bypass gasket is more compressed, there is little 'give' on cam-over, so without the bypass gasket being able to compress, the line between the bypass loose and tight is VERY thin--a little more tension feels a LOT tighter as you get near bottoming out. Thank you for this. Very insightful!

 

[claybe]

Thankx for the response. Yes, have had the doors, two of them, off the stove perhaps 20 times measuring edges, etc. I should not have used the word 'defective'. I should have remembered after two gasket replacements in the last month that the two bolts that hold the latch onto the door could be accessible with needle nose pliers. Was able to tighten the latch box and it reduced the play about 50%. The latch still has a fair amount of play, but I understand what you mean about overtightening which could cause the opposite side near the hinges. I will bring attention to this idea. Admit that across two separate doors hence two separate latches, the odds would be against this but hey, I am having to look at anything.

I appreciate any ideas at this point. tx

Can you let us know how you start a fire and what your process is with engaging the cat and thermostat management?

Also, have you disconnected the OAK and tried it?

 

[Ryan723]

How well does a cat gasket work?

I thought the smoke-penetration on this 6-week old cat gasket told the story nicely.

I did my post-shoulder season cleaning yesterday and had the cat out. Gasket was very new, so it came out fully intact. Thought it was interesting how well it worked at keeping the smoke from getting around it--smoke penetration is <0.5" on the sides and <1" on the corners. Nothing different than what it SHOULD do, but just thought it was a good visualization of what it actually does. I know some folks (including myself) have wondered how much difference it would really make. I'm a believer!



Note: that fly ash and surface of the cat looks WAY worse in this photo due to the high angle. A quick vacuum and it looked totally new and fresh and ready to go back in.

 

[black smoke signals]

Happy Holidays to all of you.

I see this site as a wonderful tool for so many people. But is it really very, very small in scope of total wood stove buyers, users etc.

My view and that of our staff is we try to help people when they call us with a stove issue. We track that rate and it is well below 1% of our business. For that small fraction (and they are all important to us!) our staff tries to suggest remedies and in 99% of the cases they are resolved very quickly. A much smaller subset are those that doubt our intent and information, (I've been burning wood stoves my whole life sonny) we send them to hearth.com That has both a plus and minus effect. First the benefit. As has been done so many times before, you as a community help them. At times you question their installs, fuel, operation and sanity. You can say things to them we cannot!

The negative part of sending folks to this site, it concentrates the "problem" owners and can give the impression of a "bigger" problem. So I will review our internal policy about referring owners here. Respectfully, there are a very solid core group of wood burners here and they do a SUPERB job helping those with trying to learn, select and operate their choices of wood stoves. On behalf of Blaze King, thank you. But please keep perspective in mind...whether it's smoke smells, improperly wrapped springs, draft issues, chimney fires etc. Hopefully no one is offended by this but I really need to make this point.

There was once a guy that you all tried to help. He had a new stove, new chimney and a smoke spillage issue. This poor guys stove smoked even with the door closed and bypass open. He told you all he had a new chimney, installed by the dealer and a new stove! In the end, he was so frustrated he told the dealer to pull the stove. So when the dealer pulled the stove, loaded in his truck and went back to tell the owner he would be refunding his money......there was a large thud sound. Dealer and homeowner both looked over to the hearth pad and there, stained with wood stove, was his favorite sweatshirt. It turns out there was a delay between the time the chimney was installed and the stove was set in place. The owners wife felt cold air coming down the stack and you can guess the rest!

No we are not perfect. (like when the guy that build the thermostat springs build 4-5 backwards out of run of tens of thousands). We do endeavor to continually improve our products and our service. It's good to have goals and aspirations. You know that firsthand because your goal is to be helpful.

Keep in mind all wood stoves burn wood and produce heat. As much as wood stoves differ in performance, so do the expectations of those owners. Tube stoves, non cats (whichever you prefer..I prefer secondary combustion because they don't all have "tubes") are as equally capable of satisfying consumer expectations as catalytic stoves. But keep in mind not all cat stoves are alike, nor are all secondary combustion stoves. And when a person or many persons fall in love with the performance of that stove, let them love them. And they too should let others love their stoves. We are all in the same user group if you will.

So let's, as the community we are, continue to post helpful and experienced based support to those seeking the collective experience here. If someone wants to brag about how their stove performs, great. If 50 want to brag great. Brag about your stoves' performance if you like. Don't be spiteful at those that like their products and want to share their success and happiness in stove selection.

There are many, many wonderful stoves to choose from. Buy the one that you think will best address your needs. If you are a first time follower of this forum and this thread, the "regulars" here are exactly that...here. Here for you if you want information, experiences and advice. But in the end, it's your investment and your decision.

And in case I forgot to mention it...you guys crack me up! Happy, Merry, Sober Holidays to all.

Chris
BKVP

Merry Christmas to Chris @ BKVP and to all your employees Thanks to all hearth .com for all of your quality advice! My Bk socks arrived just in time for colder weather again thank you BKVP for being here!

 

[jetsam]

As long as the cat meter reads “zero” when cold I believe it to be functional. I replaced my oem cat meter with the condar equivalent that has numbers. Numbers are fun.

 

[BKVP]

So has anyone called in the 10-yr warranty in year 4, 5, or 6? The wording implies that replacement is still pro-rated after 3 yrs, and the the 10-yr warranty only applies to "defects in manufacturing or materials."
I think I asked about it previously but can't recall if this was addressed in a reply..
1. The original warranty on the combustor, as stated in the owner’s manual, is still in effect.
2. The 10 Year Extended Warranty covers only the original combustor for 10 years against defects in manufacturing or materials.

Well, it would be the bypass gasket, not the cat gasket. But yeah, I think the gasket may be compressed and when you adjust the cam-down, it might be damn near bottoming out, so it takes more pressure than you're comfortable with. Same thing just happened to me, adjusting cam-down on my BIL's Fireview. I happen to have the gasket in stock, so I'll swap it soon. It shouldn't be as tight as it feels now. Plus, flame is still pulling back toward the bypass door, even when the bypass is closed, and the cat isn't heating up as fast as I think it should, even though the cat is only a couple years old..

I have posted this before...

As of March 16, 2015, Owners and Operators manuals became a Federally regulated document. Mfg manuals must adhere to the law.

So we began a promotional campaign with a 10 year, 100% warranty. If your stove came with the sequentially numbered certificate and you mailed it to us, you have an "promotional" upgrade on the original combustor to 10 full years.

The claim the warranty is simple. Call your dealer and tell them your combustor has failed. The warranty is not for diminished effectiveness but for thermal degradation.

The dealer will call us and a replacement combustor is sent to the dealer. You will get a call from the dealer when it arrives and take your failed combustor....or what is left of it including the stainless metal band that holds it together, to the dealer.

That simple.

If your combustor does suffer degradation we suggest all gaskets and tensions be adjusted.

 

[BKVP]

Merry Christmas to Chris @ BKVP and to all your employees Thanks to all hearth .com for all of your quality advice! My Bk socks arrived just in time for colder weather again thank you BKVP for being here!

You are welcome, just don't start a "mine have been on for 72 hours contest". Merry Christmas

 

[BKVP]

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Great, here come the phone calls! Just like the Swoosh!

 

[jetsam]

Great, here come the phone calls! Just like the Swoosh!

Let the record show that I did not bring up The Swoosh That Shall Not Be Mentioned.

(Also for the record, I was pointing out that you don't need the numbers printed on there to know what it is saying, not encouraging everyone to head on down to BKVP's office with torches and pitchforks...)

 

[lsucet]

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I don't know if the one that came with the stove is calibrated to read accurate after the active/inactive point. I can get the BK probe all the way around 6 o'clock if I want. The same type of burn with the condar probe with numbers stays around 1400.

 

[jetsam]

I don't know if the one that came with the stove is calibrated to read accurate after the active/inactive point. I can get the BK probe all the way around 6 o'clock if I want. The same type of burn with the condar probe with numbers stays around 1400.

Do they appear to have the same mechanism running the needle?

I do notice that my BK one needs calibration every so often, but I don't have a Condar to compare it to. I assumed they were the same thing with a different paint job.

 

[lsucet]

Do they appear to have the same mechanism running the needle?

I do notice that my BK one needs calibration every so often, but I don't have a Condar to compare it to. I assumed they were the same thing with a different paint job.

It is the same mechanism but I think the coil spring should be calibrated different. Not sure though.

 

[Highbeam]

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This might be correct or it might be total garbage. You don’t know how the springs are wound for the two different meters. There are construction differences with the probe diameter and length that indicate the two meters are not replicas.

After using both I find the numbered meter much less likely to go up past the max.

A thermocouple would be the logical way to go. If you need the actual temperature.

 

[Woody Stover]

I just did a cat at year 5 and decided it wasn't worth it to try the warranty....4+ years was easily over 14k hours...That cat and BK didn't owe me anything in my mind!

I've never called in the warranty either, even though I replace 'em when they are three years old or so. I, too, feel that I've gotten my money's worth out of them. I'll save the cat maker a little money, and hope they put it into R&D.

How well does a cat gasket work?...thought it was a good visualization of what it actually does. I know some folks (including myself) have wondered how much difference it would really make. I'm a believer!

Yep, they expand with heat, and really conform to the housing to seal nicely.

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Looks about right..

I have posted this before...

I might have read it, and spaced it out. Damned bourbon has fried most of the few brain cells I had left.

The warranty is not for diminished effectiveness but for thermal degradation.

So if you've got 10K+ hours on the cat, it may have "diminished effectiveness" and not be eligible for the warranty, correct?

 

[Woody Stover]

A thermocouple would be the logical way to go. If you need the actual temperature.

I guess that would vary also, depending on how far away from the cat it was mounted..

 

[Highbeam]

Bypass door tension--how much is too much?

Finally had the right (warm out) time to adjust my bypass on my Ashford 30. I haven't done it in the 5 years I've had the stove.

It was loose.....at the point where I knew it was camming over, but I couldn't really feel it at all.

I adjusted and now I'm concerned I went a little too tight?

For the last cam-over bit to lock it in, it now takes a solid downward 'push' on the level. I don't have to lean on it, but it takes maybe ~5-6 lbs of pressure on the handle to lock it in. And it takes a bit of a pull too on the unlock.

I don't feel like i'm over-stressing anything, but am i at risk of hurting anything if its a little too tight? I think i'm just not used to any tension on the bypass and this is just taking some getting used to.

Any insight? worth another cat gasket (which I have spares on hand) to loosen it a bit?

I don’t like it that tight. It obviously reduces the effective life of your bypass gasket which is a pita to replace. Next time, or do future readers, you can test the tension by engaging and disengaging a few times before putting the stove back together. I find the tension gets looser as the stove warms up.

Don’t forget to lube the contact surfaces of the bypass mechanism.

 

[Highbeam]

I guess that would vary also, depending on how far away from the cat it was mounted..

Why? This is a bk thread and mimicking the bk cat probe length should yield consistent results.

 

[Ryan723]

I don’t like it that tight. It obviously reduces the effective life of your bypass gasket which is a pita to replace. Next time, or do future readers, you can test the tension by engaging and disengaging a few times before putting the stove back together. I find the tension gets looser as the stove warms up.

Don’t forget to lube the contact surfaces of the bypass mechanism.

Thank you. This is a good call. I did test, adjust, test again, loose it...tighten it...and convinced myself it was where I wanted it. Just having second thoughts on it now.

As Woody Stover had pointed out, as my bypass gasket is already fairly compressed, the difference between loose and as tight as it is now was a fraction of a turn....a fraction of a quarter turn even.

I did lube it well with high-temp copper anitseize, which I had read was the right stuff.

In hindsight, I think I should have taken the time to smooth the bypass surface where the connection rod engages it with a little Brillo or something similar. Even lubed, it feels a little rougher than I would have liked. I’m thinking there’s probably some surface oxidation/junk on those surface contributing friction to what I feel as bypass tightness.

I am happy I cleaned out the corners where the bypass door hinge rods rotate. I had some well packed in fine ash in there that I think might have kept the forward edge of my bypass from sealing as well as it should have.