2018-19 Blaze King Performance Thread Part 1 (Everything BK)

[kennyp2339]

Think so?

yes, I was once a kid, we had a ultra high damper on the fisher , a hot stove wouldn't stop me from playing wheel of fortune with the draft caps.

 

[webby3650]

Ok. Then they had no choice than playing with the stoves.

I simply told my kids no. But, mine knew there would be consequences... they may grow up to be honest, respectable Blaze King owners!

 

[Ashful]

Ok. Then they had no choice than playing with the stoves.

I think it was Redd Fox who said, “we was so poor that if I wasn’t a boy, I’d have had nothing to play with.”

 

[Highbeam]

So with the damper so low, how do you take a draft measurement?

 

[lsucet]

I think is the same cause everything get to a balance regardless. Less gasses going up, less draft for sure. The thing is that looks like different manufactures has different way to test draft. In the past with other stoves I was told to measure draft as closes to the stove as possible to see what the stove was seeing draft wise. I think Bk want the reading up to a couple of feet up.

 

[Highbeam]

I think is the same cause everything get to a balance regardless. Less gasses going up, less draft for sure. The thing is that looks like different manufactures has different way to test draft. In the past with other stoves I was told to measure draft as closes to the stove as possible to see what the stove was seeing draft wise. I think Bk want the reading up to a couple of feet up.

Yes but always below the damper right? I’d there is one. I would expect there to be a much stronger vacuum above a closed damper.

 

[lsucet]

Yes but always below the damper right? I’d there is one. I would expect there to be a much stronger vacuum above a closed damper.

Make sense what you are saying cause that's the way I did it before but I dont know with BK if that applies.

 

[allan5oh]

You guys may remember about a month ago we were dealing with creosote/moisture issues up the flue. Turns out the flue wasn't properly cleaned out before installing the new BK. Whoops. Also we took the rain cap off and that made a tremendous difference. The stove operates better now. We had a smoke spillage issue while reloading and that is gone. Training the other 2 people who load it is a bit of a struggle. One can't comprehend that you want to put a full load of wood into it. You regulate heat with the t-stat and fan, not with the amount of wood that goes in.

I'm unable to get a good MC reading on the wood due to species. I do suspect some of it is a bit wet so I want to be more picky as to what goes into the stove and what gets put aside for next year.

 

[kennyp2339]

So with the damper so low, how do you take a draft measurement?

I didn't know there was a difference, maybe my .08" reading is false?
Either way this morning when I went down stairs the stove burnt through only half of its load (12hrs) glass was pitch black with the exception of the top 1" across the door and thinner black V in the middle. Cat probe needle was showing 10 o'clock. I reloaded at 6am - full fire box load, just turned the t-stat down and closed the damper, hopefully this fire wont need tending till 10-11pm tonight.

 

[kf6hap]

How to take a reading. Remove cat thermometer. Insert a piece of 1/4" copper pipe. Make it long enough to be cool at the end. Attach whatever meter you have. The pressure drop across the cat is nil. I checked it. You now are measuring the true firebox vacuum.

 

[Ashful]

How to take a reading. Remove cat thermometer. Insert a piece of 1/4" copper pipe. Make it long enough to be cool at the end. Attach whatever meter you have. The pressure drop across the cat is nil. I checked it. You now are measuring the true firebox vacuum.

Probably close enough, but to be clear, BK spec's chimney draft, not firebox draft. I've never done any comparison myself, but given the volumes and flow rates involved, I suspect they're pretty much the same when you have that damper mostly closed.

But to answer Highbeam's question, how are you measuring draft, Kenny?

 

[kennyp2339]

I took the readings from the orginal hole I put into the double wall, the hole sits approx. 16" above the damper, it was windy yesterday but I had a .18 reading with the damper open and a .08 with it closed, when I get home later today i'll do another full blast test and check the draft using both the cat probe hole and the hole above the damper to see if theres a major difference.

 

[jetsam]

You guys may remember about a month ago we were dealing with creosote/moisture issues up the flue. Turns out the flue wasn't properly cleaned out before installing the new BK. Whoops. Also we took the rain cap off and that made a tremendous difference. The stove operates better now. We had a smoke spillage issue while reloading and that is gone.

Add a couple feet of stack on top, and put a rain cap back on. You don't want it raining into your stove, and the extra height will help with the spillage.

Training the other 2 people who load it is a bit of a struggle. One can't comprehend that you want to put a full load of wood into it. You regulate heat with the t-stat and fan, not with the amount of wood that goes in.

You're free to do partial reloads, though. If they're home all day and want to throw in a stick every couple hours, the BK doesn't mind. You're not risking overfire like you would be with a novice operator adding fuel to a half load in a tube stove.

 

[moresnow]

I'm unable to get a good MC reading on the wood due to species

Um?

 

[Highbeam]

I took the readings from the orginal hole I put into the double wall, the hole sits approx. 16" above the damper, it was windy yesterday but I had a .18 reading with the damper open and a .08 with it closed, when I get home later today i'll do another full blast test and check the draft using both the cat probe hole and the hole above the damper to see if theres a major difference.

This is like trying to suck a chunk of strawberry up the straw when you’re enjoying a strawberry milkshake. The chunk of berry is your damper. You can suck so hard that the straw collapses but below the chunk of berry there is no suction.

If you got down to 0.08” above the restriction then I’m guessing you are very low beneath the restriction.

 

[allan5oh]

Add a couple feet of stack on top, and put a rain cap back on. You don't want it raining into your stove, and the extra height will help with the spillage.

It's really not much of an issue up here in Winnipeg.

You're free to do partial reloads, though. If they're home all day and want to throw in a stick every couple hours, the BK doesn't mind. You're not risking overfire like you would be with a novice operator adding fuel to a half load in a tube stove.

What I'm describing is more along the lines of putting a 1/4 of a load with a wee bit of coals and expecting it to take off. Personally I would treat it as a cold hearth, rake the coals to the BACK, and start over. Also they seem to have a tendency of reloading quite often, which increases the time that the cat is not active. They're stuck on operating it like a non-cat stove. Not using the thermostat/fan settings properly. It will come around.

Um?

American Elm, according to the data I read it is hard to get a good resistance reading on it. I will try again, or maybe come up with a new test.

 

[chazcarr]

A lot of talk here about how a BK wont run away on you, yet I have had mine do it twice already.

Here this morning, I have a fresh load in, stat and fan both set at 50%. My kid was crying in the other room. Cat temp went from just active to absolutely pegged, and the Thermometer on top went from ~300 to ~ 900.

This was all in under 13 minutes.


Slam the stat closed, turn the fan to high, and all was well within 1 minutes time.
However the fact remains that these stoves are only overfire proof if everything is perfect.
I would have thought that the stat would have closed and prevented this from happening, but twice now I have seen that it will not do so.

It did warm up the room quickly:


Also a positive here, the cat was glowing plasma red, but the crack in it does not seem to have grown at all. Also all the fly ash on the cat is GONE. I can see nice and clearly through the glass too.

Now I am wondering, is this still a high draft issue, or is there something off about my stat? Any ideas? Does anyone else's stove go off like this at 50% settings?

 

[lsucet]

This is like trying to suck a chunk of strawberry up the straw when you’re enjoying a strawberry milkshake. The chunk of berry is your damper. You can suck so hard that the straw collapses but below the chunk of berry there is no suction.

If you got down to 0.08” above the restriction then I’m guessing you are very low beneath the restriction.

I think it will read the same either way. Lets see it this way. A partial clogged cat ( the damper) will allows just certain amount of air/gasses flow going to the chimney, your draft will be low at this point. If we measure draft in the firebox or after the cat the readings will be the same due to it is a passive system. With a wide open intake. If we induce pressure at the intake then we are creating pressure/back pressure condition in the firebox. The flow rate of the intake depends of how the flue is drawing. At some point there is an equilibrium before and after the damper.

 

[lsucet]

A lot of talk here about how a BK wont run away on you, yet I have had mine do it twice already.

Here this morning, I have a fresh load in, stat and fan both set at 50%. My kid was crying in the other room. Cat temp went from just active to absolutely pegged, and the Thermometer on top went from ~300 to ~ 900.

This was all in under 13 minutes.
View attachment 236969

Slam the stat closed, turn the fan to high, and all was well within 1 minutes time.
However the fact remains that these stoves are only overfire proof if everything is perfect.
I would have thought that the stat would have closed and prevented this from happening, but twice now I have seen that it will not do so.

It did warm up the room quickly:
View attachment 236970

Also a positive here, the cat was glowing plasma red, but the crack in it does not seem to have grown at all. Also all the fly ash on the cat is GONE. I can see nice and clearly through the glass too.

Now I am wondering, is this still a high draft issue, or is there something off about my stat? Any ideas? Does anyone else's stove go off like this at 50% settings?

Well if you have overdraft issue of course can be overfire, including the manual talk about it. But I don't think I am seeing anything wrong there except the possiblity your other Temp gauge is not right. Possibly. I pegg my cat probe like that all the time. I did bought a condar with numbers and compared them the one with numbers is saying that I am in range, and the BK one is pegg all the time on reloads. Now for surr you should take care your overdraft issue if you are having it.

 

[Highbeam]

A lot of talk here about how a BK wont run away on you, yet I have had mine do it twice already.

Here this morning, I have a fresh load in, stat and fan both set at 50%. My kid was crying in the other room. Cat temp went from just active to absolutely pegged, and the Thermometer on top went from ~300 to ~ 900.

This was all in under 13 minutes.
View attachment 236969

Slam the stat closed, turn the fan to high, and all was well within 1 minutes time.
However the fact remains that these stoves are only overfire proof if everything is perfect.
I would have thought that the stat would have closed and prevented this from happening, but twice now I have seen that it will not do so.

It did warm up the room quickly:
View attachment 236970

Also a positive here, the cat was glowing plasma red, but the crack in it does not seem to have grown at all. Also all the fly ash on the cat is GONE. I can see nice and clearly through the glass too.

Now I am wondering, is this still a high draft issue, or is there something off about my stat? Any ideas? Does anyone else's stove go off like this at 50% settings?

Your stove did not overfire based on those meters. Your mistake is reading the stove top right on top of a 1500 degree catalyst and expecting a particular temperature. There is no value in reading stove top temperature of your stove. Your next mistake is “reading” the cat meter and trying to assume the reading is valid for anything other than when to engage the cat. More current models simply have an active/inactive idiot light. Finally, your fans didn’t fix the problem but just blew on the springs of those thermometers which artificially lowers the readings. The readings that are worthless in the first place.

It is possible to overfire a bk if your draft is out of spec, gaskets failed, equipment failure, or even a chimney fire but you’ll never know with those two gauges.

 

[Highbeam]

I think it will read the same either way. Lets see it this way. A partial clogged cat ( the damper) will allows just certain amount of air/gasses flow going to the chimney, your draft will be low at this point. If we measure draft in the firebox or after the cat the readings will be the same due to it is a passive system. With a wide open intake. If we induce pressure at the intake then we are creating pressure/back pressure condition in the firebox. The flow rate of the intake depends of how the flue is drawing. At some point there is an equilibrium before and after the damper.

Draft gauges are pressure gauges. They do not measure flow. I am curious if the reading changes based on if you measure before or after the damper. Seems obvious that draft pressure would be higher above the restriction but I can’t say for certain.

 

[lsucet]

Draft gauges are pressure gauges. They do not measure flow. I am curious if the reading changes based on if you measure before or after the damper. Seems obvious that draft pressure would be higher above the restriction but I can’t say for certain.

But less flow, less pressure in this situation. The same concept doesn't apply to everything. I assume the changes will affect momentarily but it will balance. Here is cold and I don't have a chance of swapping the telescopic section with a key damper I have from my previous setup. But I will do it and see what is the results. I also have a manometer.

 

[Marshy]

But less flow, less pressure in this situation. The same concept doesn't apply to everything. I assume the changes will affect momentarily but it will balance. Here is cold and I don't have a chance of swapping the telescopic section with a key damper I have from my previous setup. But I will do it and see what is the results. I also have a manometer.

More flow = less pressure when reading a draft (vacuum) gauge.

 

[Highbeam]

Your stove did not overfire based on those meters. Your mistake is reading the stove top right on top of a 1500 degree catalyst and expecting a particular temperature. There is no value in reading stove top temperature of your stove. Your next mistake is “reading” the cat meter and trying to assume the reading is valid for anything other than when to engage the cat. More current models simply have an active/inactive idiot light. Finally, your fans didn’t fix the problem but just blew on the springs of those thermometers which artificially lowers the readings. The readings that are worthless in the first place.

It is possible to overfire a bk if your draft is out of spec, gaskets failed, equipment failure, or even a chimney fire but you’ll never know with those two gauges.

@chazcarr i apologize for the words I chose above and also the tone. “Mistake” is rude. I’m not always very good at wordsmithing but please believe that I was trying to offer positive guidance.

 

[lsucet]

More flow = less pressure when reading a draft (vacuum) gauge.

Then, when we close the damper, are we creating more flow after the damper? Creating less pressure after the damper?