2017-18 Blaze King Performance Thread PART 2 (Everything BK)

[kf6hap]

BKVP told me to check the draft in hi/medium burn
, that's where I am seeing -.15. If I close down my thermostat control it goes emediately to -.20/-.21, even with key damper closed as much as possible !!

Pressure will drop across a resistance with flow. No flow=no pressure drop. Low flow=low pressure drop. At high fire, a lot of pressure drop will exist. Because the damper has excessive leakage at full closure the ability to cause pressure drop is lost. For those of you who know electrical, this is Ohm's law: E=I X R.

The vacuum (draw) numbers given the manuals do not make any sense to me as draw= temperature differential X height. Draw is given by physics. In the real world the R value has a profound effect on draw but the physics remain, they are inalterable. This being said, normal chimney heights will put your stove draw out of range. With proper chimney materials, every time. No exceptions, unless the chimney is extremely tall and sucks all the heat out of the flue gasses.

I could be wrong, but with all my studies, the above appears to be the case." Over tall" chimneys don't seem to have any ill effects save somewhat shortened burn times. Stove "runaway" is eliminated by the thermostatic control. Others might chime in about very tall bad chimney effects.

 

[Dieselhead]

With these cold temps I have noticed my stove acting differently, for the best. Longer burns, better draft etc...

I have noticed more more heat output which is great however the stove is getting so warm the heat shield glows. Thanks happens even @ 3pm. When this happens I then the t star down and fan on high to lower the box temp and it cools.

Is this normal? The heat shield is the only part that glows (and the cat)

Model : AF25 insert

Thanks guys!

As long as it’s the heat shield in front of the cat you are talking about that is fine.

 

[aaronk25]

So here is a data point on my set up. 2000sq ft 1990 split level. Last night we had -15f and enough wind to get us to -25f wind chills. With 60llbs of oak 3 big splits and the princess on high the House was at 66f this am up stairs on the opposite side of the house. Stove is in basement other end.

I run the furnace fans to circulate the air. I’d say pretty darn good, for the mid sized princess to allow its owner to get a whole night sleep (single load of wood) maintain inside temp within 4 degrees for 8 hours of the burn all on a single load!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[dh1989]

I’d be grateful for input from both 20 series users and those with larger fire boxes about when it gets too hot to burn your stoves. We don’t like being chilly and have missed having a place to bask. We’d also like a good source of heat if power goes out for days at a time as neighbors have reported. One concern we do have, though, is overheating our space, and thus we are trying to discern whether Blaze King’s low and slow would be right for us.

Thanks.

In coastal RI our winter overnight lows can reach 0-5F. With a ~900 sqft upstairs, at these temperatures I can get by with a dedicated 12 hr reload cycle as long as I pack the stove full. During most of the heating season I run one large load every night and a smaller load (or not) depending on how cold it is. Shoulder seasons it's throw a few logs in at night and let it burn out, repeat 24 hrs later.

I went with the 20 due to limited space in front of a stair landing. If I could fit a 30, I would have. There is no reason not to as both stoves can be dialed down to the same output. The 30 can also fit slightly longer logs, whereas the 20 will have 16" logs protruding over the front inside metal lip. This means 15" logs will keep their ashes inside the ash belly of the stove, while 16" logs will leave some ash on that lip which can fall out onto the outside lip when you open the door to reload.

 

[WhitePlatinum]

I want to win! I decided to go with the princess insert, and it's going to take the large shroud and black door or satin door. Is there anything else I am missing? What does it mean when people say princess ultra? Also does anyone know when and if prices for this setup is under 3K for the stove in the Mid-Atlantic?

 

[Highbeam]

I want to win! I decided to go with the princess insert, and it's going to take the large shroud and black door or satin door. Is there anything else I am missing? What does it mean when people say princess ultra? Also does anyone know when and if prices for this setup is under 3K for the stove in the Mid-Atlantic?

The ultra is a freestanding trim level not available for the princess insert. Not a choice you’ll have to make.

 

[MissMac]

should the screws that hold the sections of stove pipe together be penetrating the inner wall of double wall stove pipe?

 

[shoot-straight]

I want to win! I decided to go with the princess insert, and it's going to take the large shroud and black door or satin door. Is there anything else I am missing? What does it mean when people say princess ultra? Also does anyone know when and if prices for this setup is under 3K for the stove in the Mid-Atlantic?

There is a princess insert in the classifieds in PA. There is also a 25 size insert too on the lower shore.

I would check them out. You could likely save 1000 or more.

 

[edyit]

I want to win!

doesn't matter what stove you buy if you plan on burning wet wood in it, all the great results these guys talk about in this thread will probably not happen for you if you still plan on running green wood in it. bk's are great stoves by all accounts, but they are not miracle machines.

 

[lsucet]

should the screws that hold the sections of stove pipe together be penetrating the inner wall of double wall stove pipe?

In my experience no. It should attach just to the outside wall of the DVL.

 

[WhitePlatinum]

Are you guys covering those woodpiles with tarps?

 

[MissMac]

In my experience no. It should attach just to the outside wall of the DVL.

I'm trying to figure out what the guys who installed my stove did, and whether i've found the remaining "smell" issue i've been having. They put 2 holes through my stove collar, well below the manufactured holes. one has a screw snapped off in it, the other was just empty. and, there were 2 holes going through the inner and outer walls of the adapter, one of which had a screw in it and one that didn't. so a clear pathway for the smell to come out. also wondering if the weld needs to be taken down some. here's some pics.

 

[lsucet]

I'm trying to figure out what the guys who installed my stove did, and whether i've found the remaining "smell" issue i've been having. They put 2 holes through my stove collar, well below the manufactured holes. one has a screw snapped off in it, the other was just empty. and, there were 2 holes going through the inner and outer walls of the adapter, one of which had a screw in it and one that didn't. so a clear pathway for the smell to come out. also wondering if the weld needs to be taken down some. here's some pics.

I don't know what to say, but I think they weren't supposed to open/drill any hole on your stove collar. My stovetop adapters sits on the collar. The inside corrugated part inside is supposed to make a tight fit ones you do a hot fire cause it expands. That is the way I have them and I think I have no smoke smell. Then the telescoping pipe is the one screwed to the adapter. Take into account that my installations have been done by me and if not to code, well, looks everything is ok till now

 

[rdust]

I'm trying to figure out what the guys who installed my stove did, and whether i've found the remaining "smell" issue i've been having. They put 2 holes through my stove collar, well below the manufactured holes. one has a screw snapped off in it, the other was just empty. and, there were 2 holes going through the inner and outer walls of the adapter, one of which had a screw in it and one that didn't. so a clear pathway for the smell to come out. also wondering if the weld needs to be taken down some. here's some pics.

No way they should have drilled through the stove collar or the adapter!

They have really improved the collar welds compared to my princess which was made in 2006.

 

[AlbergSteve]

This statement and the ensuing responses have really caught my attention. I’d be interested in folks’ thoughts on our particular situation about whether a BK20 or 30 or no BK at all would suit our space and climate.

Our family has recently moved to South or South Central Texas, about 1,400 feet elevation. Winters are typically cool, cloudy, and windy. Historic records show the temperatures average in the low 60’s for highs in December, January, and February. The average lows are in the mid 30’s.

We’ve been surprised this winter at feeling chilly in our home even when we don’t consider it all that cold outside. It tends to be on gray, windy, damp days. We’ve definitely missed the little woodstove insert we had in our old home. We’re taking this winter to research stoves, assess our home’s heating situation, and gather wood (it needs to be cut whether we get a stove or not, so we’re processing it anyway).

One option we’ve talked about is installing a freestanding stove in part of the house that is approaching 900 sq ft (open living room and entry way with twelve foot ceilings, big door to area where kids have play space (10 foot ceilings), and doorways to kids’ rooms with nine foot ceilings). We had thought the 20 series would be a better fit for us as we thought the low output would serve well if we wanted to burn from sundown to early afternoon. We also thought that it was good for the stove to burn on high periodically, and we assumed that might also be an argument in favor of the 20 series.

It does get down to the 20’s overnight up here on our hill, and there are days where it hasn’t climbed out of the thirties (we’re expecting that kind of weather coming up in our version of the country’s cold snap), but it also gets up to the fifties and sixties frequently only dropping into the 40’s overnight. Our winters might be most people’s shoulder seasons.

I’d be grateful for input from both 20 series users and those with larger fire boxes about when it gets too hot to burn your stoves. We don’t like being chilly and have missed having a place to bask. We’d also like a good source of heat if power goes out for days at a time as neighbors have reported. One concern we do have, though, isd overheating our space, and thus we are trying to discern whether Blaze King’s low and slow would be right for us.

Thanks.

Not sure if this applies to you @DuaeGuttae , but in my last house my stove was in and alcove so finding a stove that would fit tight clearances was and issue. My Ashford 30 is currently in a corner and it gives me a bit more space in front over the A20, even though it's a bigger stove. Look closely at the clearances required - you'll find all the 20 boxes have larger required clearances than the 30's and will in effect, take up about the same space.

 

[Highbeam]

Not sure if this applies to you @DuaeGuttae , but in my last house my stove was in and alcove so finding a stove that would fit tight clearances was and issue. My Ashford 30 is currently in a corner and it gives me a bit more space in front over the A20, even though it's a bigger stove. Look closely at the clearances required - you'll find all the 20 boxes have larger required clearances than the 30's and will in effect, take up about the same space.

Take up the same space plus offer superior performance. Lower output, higher output, longer burn time, etc. Fit real 16” wood.

 

[Highbeam]

should the screws that hold the sections of stove pipe together be penetrating the inner wall of double wall stove pipe?

Attaching pieces of double wall pipe together or when locking the telescopic section the screws won’t pierce the inner wall. Attaching something to the stove collar you must pierce the inner wall.

Many of us don’t use screws at the stove connection at all!

 

[kf6hap]

The unfortunate holes can be plugged easily with a stainless pop-rivet, drill and tap to run a screw in, etc. If it won't interfere with the stack a simple nut and bolt might work. Grind the weld any way you can. A half round file will work. All very fixable.

The upper hole might be obscured with the flue pipe and not be a problem.

 

[Dieselhead]

Are you guys covering those woodpiles with tarps?

Top cover keep debris and moisture out, maximize airflow to help dry.

 

[rdust]

Top cover keep debris and moisture out, maximize airflow to help dry.

X2

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Thanks to all who responded to my questions. I appreciate it.

Bk's excel in Cool-cold regions like yours because unlike non cat stoves you can dial it way back to just put out the heat you need. Some in ultra cold regions love them too, but their homes must be much better sealed and insulated than mine.

It's in the high 20's here now during the day, and the teens at night with a breeze so I'm running my ashford is running hard. 2000sq ft home.

The ability to dial the stove back is one reason why we’re looking at it. We just moved from Virginia and actually had planned to replace our stove with a Princess Insert to be able to make better use of it during the shoulder seasons. I’m assuming your Ashford is a 30 series. Do you have a guess at what outside temperatures you would find it too warm to run?

@DuaeGuttae , you won't be disappointed with a 30 stove. You can build a small fire in a big box, but you can't build a big fire in a small box when you need it! My last house was 1200 square feet on the main floor with 17 foot vaulted ceilings and we could barely keep the open area with the high ceilings under 27C, we were always in our underwear! Even a small fire in a medium sized Regency would cook us out.
Our current setup is an Ashford 30 on one level of 2400 square feet with 8 foot ceilings. The fire hasn't gone out since we installed the stove a few weeks ago and the room(350sq ft) the stove is in stays around 23C while the rest of the house is a comfy 20-21C. It's a huge bonus to be able to turn these stoves down and let convection do the rest.

Would a smaller fire in a bigger box run on high count for the necessary running on high that needs to be done periodically? I’m really not sure how much we would need the higher output. I guess I’ll get to see what it’s like when unusual cold hits down here as the weather service has put out a warning that temperatures may stay below freezing for more than 36 hours. (Go ahead, laugh!)

I went with the 20 due to limited space in front of a stair landing. If I could fit a 30, I would have. There is no reason not to as both stoves can be dialed down to the same output. The 30 can also fit slightly longer logs, whereas the 20 will have 16" logs protruding over the front inside metal lip. This means 15" logs will keep their ashes inside the ash belly of the stove, while 16" logs will leave some ash on that lip which can fall out onto the outside lip when you open the door to reload.

Wow! I had read the 16 inch maximum, but I never guessed that meant protruding over the lip. Thank you for that information. That gives us something more to factor in, especially because we’re realizing that we’re not going to pack a firebox full of nice straight splits. Our oak grows in twists and waves and gnarls. It’s great for climbing, not great for filling a stove.

Not sure if this applies to you @DuaeGuttae , but in my last house my stove was in and alcove so finding a stove that would fit tight clearances was and issue. My Ashford 30 is currently in a corner and it gives me a bit more space in front over the A20, even though it's a bigger stove. Look closely at the clearances required - you'll find all the 20 boxes have larger required clearances than the 30's and will in effect, take up about the same space.

We have enough space for a King if we wanted (not even a possibility). I’ve seen the admonition about clearances so knew to pay attention to that, but I appreciate your pointing it out. Really, my thinking was that I wasn’t sure I’d want the higher end output at all or really even a 30 hour burn time. Then the whole discussion a week or so ago about people buying too big a stove and trying to run it at the “ragged edge” of its parameters made me nervous.

Take up the same space plus offer superior performance. Lower output, higher output, longer burn time, etc. Fit real 16” wood.

I know you’re in a pretty mild climate, but I think I’ve also read posts about even the low setting on your Princess overheating your home, so you switch to the pump and glide method? Did the weather I mentioned make you hesitant at all about a BK being a good fit?

 

[Tar12]

DuaeGuttae....I noticed your winter temps where you are currently located and I have to wonder why? Your need for heat seems to be very low to me...would a propane appliance not suffice for your needs? I understand that you moved from a environment where wood heat was a necessity and that you enjoyed that experience as do I but I have to question a real need for your current situation as I feel that even a BK dialed all the way back would be a bit much on most days for you....your winter temps are my shoulder season here and there are days that I have my Princess Ultra dialed down as far as she will go with out stalling out and I have to open doors...this doesn't happen very often but it does happen.This can be combatted some what by building small fires one time a day and letting them burn out....

 

[Highbeam]

Thanks to all who responded to my questions. I appreciate it.



The ability to dial the stove back is one reason why we’re looking at it. We just moved from Virginia and actually had planned to replace our stove with a Princess Insert to be able to make better use of it during the shoulder seasons. I’m assuming your Ashford is a 30 series. Do you have a guess at what outside temperatures you would find it too warm to run?




Would a smaller fire in a bigger box run on high count for the necessary running on high that needs to be done periodically? I’m really not sure how much we would need the higher output. I guess I’ll get to see what it’s like when unusual cold hits down here as the weather service has put out a warning that temperatures may stay below freezing for more than 36 hours. (Go ahead, laugh!)



Wow! I had read the 16 inch maximum, but I never guessed that meant protruding over the lip. Thank you for that information. That gives us something more to factor in, especially because we’re realizing that we’re not going to pack a firebox full of nice straight splits. Our oak grows in twists and waves and gnarls. It’s great for climbing, not great for filling a stove.




We have enough space for a King if we wanted (not even a possibility). I’ve seen the admonition about clearances so knew to pay attention to that, but I appreciate your pointing it out. Really, my thinking was that I wasn’t sure I’d want the higher end output at all or really even a 30 hour burn time. Then the whole discussion a week or so ago about people buying too big a stove and trying to run it at the “ragged edge” of its parameters made me nervous.



I know you’re in a pretty mild climate, but I think I’ve also read posts about even the low setting on your Princess overheating your home, so you switch to the pump and glide method? Did the weather I mentioned make you hesitant at all about a BK being a good fit?

Multi quotes!

So for my question. I burn when the house is cold inside. It was 53 outside last night, 69 inside and I started a fire. On low, the 20 hour fire only had the house up to mid 70s inside.

I have no other source of heat, well not really, just a bunch of little electric resistance heaters. So a wide range of available outputs is important. Also, I will burn wood when most of the population will just turn on their furnace.

 

[AlbergSteve]

Thanks to all who responded to my questions. I appreciate it.



The ability to dial the stove back is one reason why we’re looking at it. We just moved from Virginia and actually had planned to replace our stove with a Princess Insert to be able to make better use of it during the shoulder seasons. I’m assuming your Ashford is a 30 series. Do you have a guess at what outside temperatures you would find it too warm to run?




Would a smaller fire in a bigger box run on high count for the necessary running on high that needs to be done periodically? I’m really not sure how much we would need the higher output. I guess I’ll get to see what it’s like when unusual cold hits down here as the weather service has put out a warning that temperatures may stay below freezing for more than 36 hours. (Go ahead, laugh!)



Wow! I had read the 16 inch maximum, but I never guessed that meant protruding over the lip. Thank you for that information. That gives us something more to factor in, especially because we’re realizing that we’re not going to pack a firebox full of nice straight splits. Our oak grows in twists and waves and gnarls. It’s great for climbing, not great for filling a stove.




We have enough space for a King if we wanted (not even a possibility). I’ve seen the admonition about clearances so knew to pay attention to that, but I appreciate your pointing it out. Really, my thinking was that I wasn’t sure I’d want the higher end output at all or really even a 30 hour burn time. Then the whole discussion a week or so ago about people buying too big a stove and trying to run it at the “ragged edge” of its parameters made me nervous.



I know you’re in a pretty mild climate, but I think I’ve also read posts about even the low setting on your Princess overheating your home, so you switch to the pump and glide method? Did the weather I mentioned make you hesitant at all about a BK being a good fit?

You'll appreciate the convenience of the bigger box and bigger opening if you're not burning nice straight splits! I burn whatever hits the ground, including all the twisted dfir and cedar branches and some of the bigger stuff I can't split because it's too gnarly. We almost bought the Alderlea T6 because of the large firebox and opening.

 

[kennyp2339]

Would a smaller fire in a bigger box run on high count for the necessary running on high that needs to be done periodically? I’m really not sure how much we would need the higher output. I guess I’ll get to see what it’s like when unusual cold hits down here as the weather service has put out a warning that temperatures may stay below freezing for more than 36 hours

When looking at the BK line up, loose the idea of small fire vs big fire, running a half load, running a full load. look at the website at the range of btu per hour output, take for instance the princess, running on low it will let out approx. 13,600 btu's per hour (unsure if that's with the blower or not) with a 88% efficiency and you can get a burn time of up to 24hrs, or if a severe cold snap comes in you can run the stove on high and get upwards of 41,000 btu's per hour for nearly 10hrs at the same 88% efficiency.
EPA tube stoves and other cat stoves you need to watch how you load, or you will be chasing the heat curve. These not so much