2017-18 Blaze King Performance Thread (Everything BK)

[redktmrider]

Couple questions about the ashford that I forgot to get while I was at the dealer.

With the fan kit the brochure says it is 31 1/8” deep. How far are the front legs from the front lip?

View attachment 200849


Clearance from the back of the stove is supposed to be 6”. Is that from the fan kit or from the stove body itself?


Lopi Rockport

I measured the front leg to lip distance, it is close to 2 3/4 inches.

 

[webby3650]

It makes no sense to me either but you were the one who said you couldn't handle the weight. The way you might solve that problem for yourself is to not fill it to the top. I can carry way more ash so I would fill it up and be happy to get it done in one trip.

I use the ashpan and I think others do too. The reason is that it is cleaner, less ash flies away.

I like that it’s easy to handle like it is. It works just fine Is my point. It’s not that I “can’t handle it” I promise you, handling ash is the lightest work I ever do..

 

[jetsam]

Heya BK'ers!

With temps (and leaves) dropping here in the CO Rockies...it was time to give Princess #1 her annual exam again today to prep for yet another season of warmth.... (2nd full season of use last year...Oct-May).

Upon inspection, I found a super clean stovepipe (12 ft) and was able to leave the chimney brush in the box and put it back in the closet in the garage. Maybe next year...but probably not from the looks of it. (I never take anything for granted but am always super pleased when sh*t "doesn't happen) "If it ain't broke don't fix it" heeeheeeheee.....

Looking inside...I found only a small pile of soot below the pipe in the stove. Again, very good/very pleased. Gasket looks almost new/seals well.

The only thing I did notice was a soot buildup between the inner wall shields and the stove wall. I remember some talk here about this....and weekly "hot" fires....but with only 800 sq ft...it's not that easy to pull off without all the windows and doors open (which could happen....but often...doesn't).
While I'll certainly try to burn a hotter fire here/there this season to minimize these deposits.......I dealt with it this year by fashioning a crude tool out of twisted/bent safety wire and scraped it off the walls....then dug/removed what fell into the the lower channel until I felt it was "clean". While it did take a bit of time....it actually worked very well.

And finally...I pulled out the unused ash pan and it actually slid back and forth easily. Now i'm wondering if it gets hot enough in there to warm Cinnamon rolls or make grilled cheese. While I caught some flak here last season for not using it.... I find using my big metal bucket with a lid to be easier 'cus I can clean the entire stove out in one fell swoop rather than making multiple trips with the much smaller ash pan. I 'do" like the way it looks though...LOL. Live and learn. (or try)

Now to repeat the process with Princess #2 in the shop/garage..... and get on with installing Princess #3 in the plenum shed in an attempt to heat the greenhouse next door. (will likely be an interesting project)

We're overdue for a big/cold Winter here. Time will tell how it actually plays out.... but we'll be warm either way thanks to BK.

have a good season folks......

@Ashful .... we have a THREE BK situation here.... your move!


MtnBurn, I'd suggest adding a couple feet of flue to that Princess with the 12' stack... it really helped my princess insert with low burns.

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

I drove to my cabin tonight for a little mountain recreation, it was 52F outside when I arrived as it was starting to get dark but the inside was only 51F throughout since it had been abandoned with no heat and some colder weather (the cabin is shaded almost all day this time of year). I loaded the Chinook 30.1 to the top (N-S) with a bunch of uglies and shorties that don't make for nice wood stacks. This only filled the firebox 1/2 to 2/3 full since they were all pretty short (about 12" long) and irregular. Maple, Alder and Doug-Fir. I lit a single fire-starter square and slid it into the middle bottom of the load at 6:20pm with the door cracked and proceeded to unload my car. I walk by the stove with each load so the fire is never unattended for more than a minute. At 8 minutes I started smelling new paint smell so took a look. It was starting off nicely but no where near a roar so I closed the door a bit more, leaving just a crack on the right side with the handle partially latched. At 9 minutes one of my smoke alarms went off so I opened a window and unplugged the smoke alarm. At 10 minutes my other smoke alarm went off so I disabled it and opened an upstairs window and two more downstairs windows. This stove has had about 30 hours of burning (including about 8 hours pretty hot) and thought the paint smell was finished. I'm guessing it was the black double wall stove pipe since it's also new but couldn't see any smoke coming off either so I'm not sure.

At 16 minutes from light-off I closed the door. At 23 minutes I turned the thermostat to about 1/2-3/4 throttle. At 27 minutes I engaged the cat even though the cat thermometer was only 3/4 through the inactive zone and the cat started glowing almost immediately. At 33 minutes I turned the fans on 75% power and hot air was really moving. The fire was burning at a nice lazy speed with plenty of secondary flames. At 40 minutes the smoke had cleared out so I closed the windows and, realizing I was pretty warm I turned the thermostat down to about 1/4-1/3 open.

At 7:20, exactly one hour from light-off all the rooms open to the living room (kitchen, living room hall way and stairwell) felt room temperature (I was in shorts/Hawaiian shirt) so I turned the fans to just above idle. The walls were 65 degrees on the far side of the living room but the air felt 72! Those dual fans are amazing for warming up a cold 51 degree house! Especially considering the temperature outside was dropping after sunset and I had upstairs and downstairs windows open until I was 40 minutes into the burn.

Two hours into the burn I have the thermostat barely cracked open with some flames in the far back of the firebox and the cat thermo in the center of the active range. The cat has a dull glow and the living area is still perfect temperature. I'll have to see how it does in the depths of a winter storm but, from what I've seen so far, it will be amazing. It is a HUGE benefit to be able to control the rate of burn and heat output over such a wide range. My old stove was quite efficient at putting out heat but there was no way to shut it down without creating a smoldering mess. So I would be sitting here overheated with the wood nearly gone. And I would have to reload in the morning. This stove is going to save a LOT of wood, primarily because my cabin will not be overly hot so much (if at all).

 

[Poindexter]

@WoodyIsGoody , now that my combustor is no longer quite so new i get to engaged cat most quickly by setting the tstat to the top of the swoosh, closing the loading door and latching it as soon as i have a box full of flames.

Otherwise happy for you, just saying once your cat is broken in and settled down the method above will not work as well.

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

@WoodyIsGoody , now that my combustor is no longer quite so new i get to engaged cat most quickly by setting the tstat to the top of the swoosh, closing the loading door and latching it as soon as i have a box full of flames.

I'm always open to helpful tips as this is my first cat stove. By "top of the swoosh" I think you mean full open (thick end of swoosh). Or do you mean the skinny end? Because on my Chinook the skinny end is at the top.

 

[MtnBURN]

@Ashful .... we have a THREE BK situation here.... your move!


MtnBurn, I'd suggest adding a couple feet of flue to that Princess with the 12' stack... it really helped my princess insert with low burns.

Thanks jetsam. I'm not sure I'm having a problem that warrants extra piping but I appreciate the suggestion. I hesitate on making such an addition because adding pipe would mean having to add wire supports/etc. (aka...screwing into the metal roofing/etc.) It would also require me getting up there! ;-). I truly think the stove burns really well as it is. Surprisingly >better< than the Princess in the garage/shop with 16+' of pipe. (it's slower to cat up/won't burn as long as the stove in the house will) I'll be checking that stove today to compare the buildup and that, IMO, may reveal if the extra pipe truly would make a difference.

I personally think the soot buildup is by way of design more than anything else. It's such a handy place for soot to build up. Lotsa crevices/etc in there.

Sure was nice to wake up to a warm house though.....

 

[Marshy]

Fair enough. However, if it was larger, there would be an increased likelihood someone would leave it full and not empty the pan. Good point for us to review. Thank you.
BKVP

I'm not sure how you correlate size of ash pan to increased chance of forgetting to empty it. Interesting perspective IMO. I also didn't understand why the pan had the foldable cover on it but I guess that's a convenience if you are carrying it through a living space.

I don't recall the exact dimensions of the ash pan. It was something like a 10" cube. Compared to the volume of the coal/ash bed (about 8x16x22) the ratio is approximately 2.8:1. After burning a full week in the stove I generally took 2.5 pans of ash out and left a small layer of ash over the bricks.

I believe there was available space in the pedestal to make the ash pan deeper without widening the opening of the pedestal. If you could deepen the pan 2-3" and add 1-2" on each side of the pan you could gain as much as 0.3 cuft on a pan that's only about 0.6 cuft. 50% increase in size! Thanks for the consideration.

I like that it’s easy to handle like it is. It works just fine Is my point. It’s not that I “can’t handle it” I promise you, handling ash is the lightest work I ever do..

I found the paint was wearing off the face of the ash pan rather quickly. When handling the pan with large leather gloves the tips of the gloves rubbed that pain right off half way through the season. Probably because the pan doesn't cure like the rest of the stove? I was thankful the pan had a ledge on the back to carry with both hands. A handle would be awesome, even if it was a tool that you clip on/off the pan just for carrying. I suppose if you're one of those people who let the stove burn down frequently and empty the ash regularly it's not big deal. You probably wouldn't fill the pan much but some of us that are running the stove hard 24/6 for main source of heat can't afford the time to let the stove burn down just to empty the ash. Run it until it's full then service the stove.

 

[Marshy]

I find the ashpan to be appropriately sized. For one reason, I can hold it with 1 hand while I open the door. If it was much larger it would be difficult to handle while it’s full I think.

See, I can tell you are not filling the pan all the way. There's no way you would carry the pan one handed if it was completely full like I was. I would always go crack the door so I could open it with my foot when I was ready to carry out the pan.

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

I'm not sure how you correlate size of ash pan to increased chance of forgetting to empty it. Interesting perspective IMO.

That had me scratching my head too!

 

[tarzan]

Everyone else, for $50 I'll come over and write some numbers on your swoosh with a sharpie.

Deal! And there's an extra Hamilton in it for ya if you'll take the ashes out while you're at it!

 

[webby3650]

I'm not sure how you correlate size of ash pan to increased chance of forgetting to empty it. Interesting perspective IMO. I also didn't understand why the pan had the foldable cover on it but I guess that's a convenience if you are carrying it through a living space.

I don't recall the exact dimensions of the ash pan. It was something like a 10" cube. Compared to the volume of the coal/ash bed (about 8x16x22) the ratio is approximately 2.8:1. After burning a full week in the stove I generally took 2.5 pans of ash out and left a small layer of ash over the bricks.

I believe there was available space in the pedestal to make the ash pan deeper without widening the opening of the pedestal. If you could deepen the pan 2-3" and add 1-2" on each side of the pan you could gain as much as 0.3 cuft on a pan that's only about 0.6 cuft. 50% increase in size! Thanks for the consideration.


I found the paint was wearing off the face of the ash pan rather quickly. When handling the pan with large leather gloves the tips of the gloves rubbed that pain right off half way through the season. Probably because the pan doesn't cure like the rest of the stove? I was thankful the pan had a ledge on the back to carry with both hands. A handle would be awesome, even if it was a tool that you clip on/off the pan just for carrying. I suppose if you're one of those people who let the stove burn down frequently and empty the ash regularly it's not big deal. You probably wouldn't fill the pan much but some of us that are running the stove hard 24/6 for main source of heat can't afford the time to let the stove burn down just to empty the ash. Run it until it's full then service the stove.

If you knew anything about me at all, you’d know I’m a serious round the clock burner. I’m not sure how you got the impression I’m a part timer?
Why would anyone bother to take a partially full pan out to dump?

 

[webby3650]

See, I can tell you are not filling the pan all the way. There's no way you would carry the pan one handed if it was completely full like I was. I would always go crack the door so I could open it with my foot when I was ready to carry out the pan.

You wanna bet?

 

[jetsam]

Deal! And there's an extra Hamilton in it for ya if you'll take the ashes out while you're at it!

You, sir, are just trying to drag me into the Ash Pan Debate... I don't think that's worth the $50.

 

[Poindexter]

@WoodyIsGoody , once the kindling has the main fuel burning good so i can close the loading door i like having the tstat at the wide open throttle setting, top (thickest) part of the swoosh.

At yous guys with the ashpans, i found a sweet spot on my ashford 30.0 where i can run it untik the ashbed is getting kinda thick, then put a panful of ash through the hole in the floor during a hot reload, finish the reload, then deal with the full ashpan.

I am not sure if it is a BK approved technique, but i can run my stove for weeks without having to shut down for ash removal. Usually in deep winter i take a pan of ashes out every 5 days or so.

 

[Highbeam]

Lately I've been following a new technique for timing cat engagement. I have two meters, the cat meter on the stove and a probe flue temp meter. Depending on how the fuel is arranged the flue sometimes gets really hot before the cat meter indicates active. Well, I'm not wanting to melt the bypass gasket retainers so my new method is to engage the bypass when EITHER the flue temps pass 500 or when the cat meter says active. Haven't stalled it yet!

I also want to engage ASAP to reduce wood waste, pollution, and to get the heat cranking. So far so good.

Oh, BTW, I am using a steelcat that is supposed to be active if exhaust temps pass 400.

 

[Highbeam]

I find the ashpan to be appropriately sized. For one reason, I can hold it with 1 hand while I open the door. If it was much larger it would be difficult to handle while it’s full I think.

Do you remember writing this? I'm sure you do but it is the entire reason that I even suggested partially filling the ash pan if you, for any reason, would prefer not to fill it all the way.

Nobody loses with a larger ash pan. It's okay to seek improvements in stove design.

Also, @Marshy has a king and I think you have a smaller stove. Not sure if the ash pans are similar in size.

I'm a convert. Didn't use to use the ash pan but now I do. The ash plume is the reason. Otherwise a bucket and shovel are more efficient.

 

[webby3650]

Do you remember writing this? I'm sure you do but it is the entire reason that I even suggested partially filling the ash pan if you, for any reason, would prefer not to fill it all the way.

Nobody loses with a larger ash pan. It's okay to seek improvements in stove design.

Also, @Marshy has a king and I think you have a smaller stove. Not sure if the ash pans are similar in size.

I'm a convert. Didn't use to use the ash pan but now I do. The ash plume is the reason. Otherwise a bucket and shovel are more efficient.

Hopefully I had something to with your being converted. I hate the ash plume as well, using the pan nearly eliminates the mess.
I’m all for improvements, except that means I have to buy another stove...

Our ashpans are the same size

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

@WoodyIsGoody , once the kindling has the main fuel burning good so i can close the loading door i like having the tstat at the wide open throttle setting, top (thickest) part of the swoosh.

OK, that's how I did it. I closed the door and left the thermostat wide open for 7 minutes. 4 minutes later I engaged the cat.

It sounds like the thermostat on my Chinook is in a different orientation than an Ashford. Because the top of the swoosh on a Chinook is the skinny part. And it turns clockwise to increase the thermostat setting. This puts the "swoosh" behind the knob. It would make more sense to paint the swoosh on the front side of the knob so the knob (and your hand) didn't partially obscure the swoosh (more noticeable on a corner install).

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

I hate the ash plume as well, using the pan nearly eliminates the mess.

Emptying ashes manually (without built-in ashpan) only causes a plume if done improperly. There's an easy way to do it with no plume (but it doesn't work with a bucket (too deep).

 

[webby3650]

OK, that's how I did it. I closed the door and left the thermostat wide open for 7 minutes. 4 minutes later I engaged the cat.

It sounds like the thermostat on my Chinook is in a different orientation than an Ashford. Because the top of the swoosh on a Chinook is the skinny part. And it turns clockwise to increase the thermostat setting. This puts the "swoosh" behind the knob. It would make more sense to paint the swoosh on the front side of the knob so the knob (and your hand) didn't partially obscure the swoosh (more noticeable on a corner install).

The primary air control “swoosh” (I can’t believe I said that) is the same between freestanding stoves, the insert is the one that’s different.

 

[webby3650]

Emptying ashes manually (without built-in ashpan) only causes a plume if done improperly. There's an easy way to do it with no plume (but it doesn't work with a bucket (too deep).

Believe me, I get experience with ash removal daily, all day....

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

Believe me, I get experience with ash removal daily, all day....

I guess I don't understand why you said manual removal involved a "plume".

 

[webby3650]

I guess I don't understand why you said manual removal involved a "plume".

There is an art to it. If you have an ashpan there’s no reason to do it any other way. Well, except some ashpans suck.
I use a vacuum just off to the side of the bucket, it collects all the airborn dust. Most people don’t have a rovac handy though.. although a shop vac with a filter and bag will do just fine. Anytime you are shoveling ash out of a stove or Fireplace there is ash airborn, if you don’t think so, dim the lights and shine a flashlight above you your work. A vacuum will eliminate that.

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

There is an art to it. If you have an ashpan there’s no reason to do it any other way. Well, except some ashpans suck.
I use a vacuum just off to the side of the bucket, it collects all the airborn dust. Most people don’t have a rovac handy though.. although a shop vac with a filter and bag will do just fine. Anytime you are shoveling ash out of a stove or Fireplace there is ash airborn, if you don’t think so, dim the lights and shine a flashlight above you your work. A vacuum will eliminate that.

I've done it with direct sunlight streaming in an otherwise dark room. You can see every particle in the air. If you use a traditional bucket, you are going to get an ash plume. Here's the method that's been working for me for over 2 decades without ANY ash entering the living space.

You need a metal baking pan that is deep enough to be wedged under the bottom knife edge (the part that presses into the door gasket when the door closes on it) and wide enough to match the firebox opening. If the pan is the right depth for your stove it will be securely locked in place under it's own weight and tilt at a slight angle back towards the firebox.

Before you begin, make sure the flue has a positive draft. If it's warm in the house and cold outside it probably will but it never hurts to crack a window before you begin.

Wedge the wide rectangular pan in place under the knife edge. Take a scoop of ash and pull the loaded shovel back and place it flat in the bottom of the baking pan. Lift the shovel handle so the ashes want to start sliding and simultaneously draw the handle backwards neatly sliding the ashes onto the bottom of the pan without any vertical drop and no ash plume. If you don't do it smoothly you will see a little dust but watch as it is "magically" drawn back into the firebox and up the flue. Repeat until you have removed enough ash. Carry the baking pan outside without jostling it.

This method keeps the house dust free. I can't count on both hands the number of people that told me they converted from wood heat to propane because wood heat was too "dusty". Little did they know it was all because of un-refined ash removal technique. I agree there is an art to it. If a vacuum works for you, more power to you. I want to achieve the same thing without the additional equipment and hassle.