2016-17 Blaze King Performance Thread (Everything BK)

  • Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.

    We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.

    We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
Status
Not open for further replies.
I would think that any time the cat is lit, it's using life. When you burn on high, how brightly is the cat glowing, compared to when you burn on a medium or low setting? What about cat probe readings at the different air settings?
What I'm wondering is will the life of the cat be shortened if its operated (within the proper limits of the stove with the acceptable fuel/moisture content) on high (100%) indefinitely vs one that is operated in the same manner but at a lower heat output (say 75%?).

The questions really has to do with reactivity of the cat and is its life shortened by running the stove harder but within the limits specified by the manufacture.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, you got it. ==c I think they are saying that because it will minimize smoke roll-out into the room in setups where the draft is weaker. With my stove and stack, I can open the door anytime and get no smoke....might have to open it more slowly in certain situations, though.
Is the smoke roll out a common thing? I have about 17' of pipe/chimney. If I wait toward the end of the burn I get no smoke. If I do a hot reload (which I usually do to keep a 12 hour cycle) I get some roll out. After I open the thermostat I wait a few minutes while I get wood ready, then bypass for awhile. Even then I still get some. If i open the door VERY slowly it reduces it. Maybe with 2/45s in my system I'm just at the edge of poor draft? Burns fine otherwise?
 
I can avoid any smoke into the room if I open door just a crack, and then wait a few seconds before opening the rest of the way. It's the negative pull of the door that disturbs draft, and allows momentary smoke escape.

If the problem is more than momentary, I'd say your draft is too low to support that fireplace opening (i.e. the cross section of the door of the stove). Normal problem to have, back in fireplace days, and the only solution is normally a bigger chimney... or just not opening the stove in the middle of a burn.
 
What I'm wondering is will the life of the cat be shortened if its operated on high (100%) indefinitely vs one that is operated in the same manner but at a lower heat output (say 75%?)
I'm not sure. It's possible that the cat might actually not burn as brightly when you have the air wide open, as the smoke may to have the "residence time" to burn...the smoke might just blow right through the combustor un-burned. That's why I asked how brightly the cat was glowing at the various air settings...because I believe that the brighter it is glowing, the faster it will be worn out, over time. Have you looked at the stack when you are running with the air wide open? How much smoke are you seeing?
Is the smoke roll out a common thing? I have about 17' of pipe/chimney. If I wait toward the end of the burn I get no smoke. If I do a hot reload (which I usually do to keep a 12 hour cycle) I get some roll out.....Maybe with 2/45s in my system I'm just at the edge of poor draft
The BKs seem to require more draft to operate than some other stoves, but I would not think that applies with the bypass open. Front-loading stoves generally have less space between the top of the door opening and the top of the stove and have a larger opening, so are more prone to smoke escaping.
My stove is a side-loader, rear-vented into a tee, then 16' of insulated flex liner. The top of the chimney is above the top of the roof ridge. I can open the door when it's 55* out, no smoke roll-out. Even though your chimney is higher, it may not draw as well due to a number of factors. Can you describe your chimney setup, from stove top to the top of the chimney? Does it extend above the top of the roof? Yes, the two 45s are cutting some draft. And did you say earlier that you were at elevation? That will affect draft as well.
 
I would think that any time the cat is lit, it's using life. When you burn on high, how brightly is the cat glowing, compared to when you burn on a medium or low setting? What about cat probe readings at the different air settings?

You've got to remember, burning a bk on high does not mean a high air setting. Sometimes the air is closed, sometimes open.
 
I'm not sure. It's possible that the cat might actually not burn as brightly when you have the air wide open, as the smoke may to have the "residence time" to burn...the smoke might just blow right through the combustor un-burned. That's why I asked how brightly the cat was glowing at the various air settings...because I believe that the brighter it is glowing, the faster it will be worn out, over time. Have you looked at the stack when you are running with the air wide open? How much smoke are you seeing?
It glows bright, just like you would expect when operating on High. It doesn't smoke at all, just some vapor right after reload. No offense but I was asking BKVP because Im sure he has been intimately involved with the testing and life cycle of the cats. It seems like an assumption that their life would be shorter if they are run at the high end of their operating limit when in fact it might be better for it. I don't know that but would be interested in know the facts so that way I'm not disappointed that my cat has been exhausted at year 4 vs year 8 because I operate the stove (within the limits) on high.
 
I've almost 19' of stack from top of stove to termination cap and i have no smoke roll out into room at all. when i am reloading including i can see the smoke from the front area finding its way up thru the bypass. When i open the door with lots of chunks inside i have to be careful cause sparks wants to go all over.lol. i beverly open the door when there is fuel in there unless to rake it to the front but i have to be careful.
 
OK, I looked at a couple of your other threads...looks like you go to Class A at the ceiling, and the Class A may exit close to, and be above, the roof ridge, correct?
8' dvl to 45 to 24"dvl to 45 to support box. So around 104" of rise.
8' of class a triple wall.
Chimney exits the roof for about 50" and is above the ridge line.

I'm thinking that even though I'm above the 15' recommended, with the 2 (45s) I'm right on the edge. Like maybe a 12" section would help me? I'd have to measure the roof exit to be sure of the 50" as it maybe a bit less. If I could add a foot and stay under needing to brace it. I'm close enough to the ridge line that bracing would take some finagling.
 
Condar's instructions still say to run a pipe cleaner brush through each cell. Not a lot of guys smoke pipes but I've got a couple of ruger 22s and brass barrel brushes. Instead of using them I bought a special 2" paint brush to sweep the face of my cat softly.
They're in the market to sell what?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Highbeam
Assuming no deficiencies and a proper operating stove, does it shorten the life of a combustor to run the stove on high >90% of the time?
Not in our units. And remember please, cats can much hotter on low than on high.
 
Not in our units. And remember please, cats can much hotter on low than on high.

This is something that i noticed before, when on high with flames looks like flames are burning most of the smoke in the firebox and is more heat what the cat receive than anything else. takes longer to get the stove up to temperature and chimney hotter.
Finding a high setting without flames, temp rises quicker, high stove temp plus fuel last way more and flue temp is lower giving me better efficiency. AT least that is what i think and my experience.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Woody Stover
Not in our units. And remember please, cats can much hotter on low than on high.
Very interesting! Why is there a higher emissions output on high then? Is it because higher velocity of gas through the cat cause less combustion or just more ash particulate being carried through the unit?

Thanks for the input.

If I assume 5 months of constant heating and use an average life span of 12,000 hrs for the cat then that works out to be about 3.3 years.
 
This is something that i noticed before, when on high with flames looks like flames are burning most of the smoke in the firebox and is more heat what the cat receive than anything else. takes longer to get the stove up to temperature and chimney hotter.
Finding a high setting without flames, temp rises quicker, high stove temp plus fuel last way more and flue temp is lower giving me better efficiency. AT least that is what i think and my experience.
Hmm? I always thought it was maybe drafting past the cat to fast to activate. IDK, but it certainly does get more active as the air is reduced.
 
Is the smoke roll out a common thing? I have about 17' of pipe/chimney. If I wait toward the end of the burn I get no smoke. If I do a hot reload (which I usually do to keep a 12 hour cycle) I get some roll out. After I open the thermostat I wait a few minutes while I get wood ready, then bypass for awhile. Even then I still get some. If i open the door VERY slowly it reduces it. Maybe with 2/45s in my system I'm just at the edge of poor draft? Burns fine otherwise?
17',2 45's? Ya, some roll out is gonnna happen on occasion. I find it's much less when it's real cold outside.
 
17',2 45's? Ya, some roll out is gonnna happen on occasion. I find it's much less when it's real cold outside.
Kinda what I figured. I'm going to get up on the roof when I get a chance to see how much I can add without bracing. It's anything over 5' correct?

As it's not per manual I haven't tried it, but anyone ever open the door and leave the cat engaged?
 
Kinda what I figured. I'm going to get up on the roof when I get a chance to see how much I can add without bracing. It's anything over 5' correct?

As it's not per manual I haven't tried it, but anyone ever open the door and leave the cat engaged?
If you screw the pipe to the flashing with short sheet metal screws I'd be ok with 6', but technically ya, every 5' needs a brace.
 
Hmm? I always thought it was maybe drafting past the cat to fast to activate. IDK, but it certainly does get more active as the air is reduced.

It can be possible is the way you said. the reason i have that impression is cause i can see secondary flames on the upper part of the firebox like tube stoves. (OK NOT THE SAME LIKE TUBES BEFORE SOMEBODY JUMP IN. lol. ) what is letting me know is burning smoke. But maybe i wrong .that is why this forums are for, to learn and corrects the mistakes.
 
...
As it's not per manual I haven't tried it, but anyone ever open the door and leave the cat engaged?
:eek:
I'm going to tell @Highbeam on you!
Seems like a good way to ruin the cat if your not careful. You're basically bypassing the air control that regulated the fire and keeps it from over firing the cat. Besides, I'd be a little concerned about thermal shock to the cat also.

It can be possible is the way you said. the reason i have that impression is cause i can see secondary flames on the upper part of the firebox like tube stoves. (OK NOT THE SAME LIKE TUBES BEFORE SOMEBODY JUMP IN. lol. ) what is letting me know is burning smoke. But maybe i wrong .that is why this forums are for, to learn and corrects the mistakes.
The air wash on the window basically can cause that secondary type burn up at the top before it goes into the cat. At least that's what I see happening but that is strictly opinion.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Highbeam
Kinda what I figured. I'm going to get up on the roof when I get a chance to see how much I can add without bracing. It's anything over 5' correct?

As it's not per manual I haven't tried it, but anyone ever open the door and leave the cat engaged?
I have no idea why anyone would do this? First smoke would pour out, but my fear is cold air being sucked directly into the catalyst if your draft was real good.
 
that way I'm not disappointed that my cat has been exhausted at year 4 vs year 8
12k hours is roughly 4 years for me. I'll be interested to see how long the combustor actually lasts.
I think I'm going to notice performance start to drop off after year 3, and by year 5 it's going require higher temps to light off, and won't stay lit nearly as long, so I'm going to want to replace it. Since I got 'dry-wood religion' six years ago, and a few new stoves and different cats to try here and there, I've only seen about three years max on any single cat. So the jury is still out for me on longevity in my main stove, with my yearly use. Even though I have no backup heat, I'm probably not burning as continuously hard and for as long as it sounds like you will be doing.
when I get a chance to see how much I can add without bracing. It's anything over 5' correct?
As it's not per manual I haven't tried it, but anyone ever open the door and leave the cat engaged?
Yeah, 5'. You can get some cheap vent pipe and try it out first to see if it's worth it to buy Class A and add it.
The way BKVP stresses that having a small door gasket air leak will ruin the cat, I don't think you want to run with the door open. _g Besides, it's harder to pull air through the cat than through an open bypass, and smoke in the box will also be routed forward, so you will get more smoke roll-out.
 
rwhite
Another thing to take into the account is that smoldering is what produce smoke, when flames there is not that much smoke and the cat is starving plus losing temp. regardless how strong is draft, so is the volume of smoke if the fuel continues smoldering. Now if smoke rush so quick because of an strong draft, you see smoke out the stack but the cat will be fire red cause of the high volume of smoke. Is just that the cat is no able to burn all that smoke and emission will be higher.
 
I'd be willing to bet the stove drafts fine with the cat engaged and the door cracked as long as the stove is up to temp. I cannot confirm or deny this has or has not happened for a brief time. ::P
 
  • Like
Reactions: Highbeam
see how much I can add
Forgot to ask...it looks like it is, but is the connector pipe double-wall to the ceiling?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.