2013-2014 Blaze King Performance Thread(everything BK)

[Stump shot]

If the cat is working right, you should get no smoke out of the stack. It will need to be in the active range to do this, which it is. If you are getting smoke out of the stack, you probably have a bypass door problem. I believe on the Ashford when you take the stack off the stove you can see the bypass door and should be able to see what is going on with it.

 

[alforit]

First round of kiln dried wood made no difference.
Set it to the end of the normal zone at 2 1/4.
I did not take the top off. I do not think that is proper use of the stove.

It's cold in here.

Zanimal,

Thanks for trying out the kiln dried wood. That's one thing that can be ruled out......Ok so Its not the wood .

That helps a lot with trying to figure this out. The fact that you are getting stove pipe temps of 250 on dbl wall 20 inches above the stove shows that you are pulling gases good and getting an adequate draft like highbeam said. And if your flames went out after a time like you said at 2 1/4 stat setting and your pipe temps were holding 250 ? ,then your cat is working somewhat.

The fact that you can turn your stat down below 2 and the flames go out says to me that your bypass damper is closed..........Otherwise you would still be getting a lot of flame action....

And I saw the flames in your stove on post #548. Sorry I missed seeing that post. Cause it also shows to me that your draft is just fine. Cause you were able to reignite your stalled half load in a couple of minutes. Its not the stack draft.

So I don't think its the Wood , the stack draft , or the bypass damper.

( Although I would check or have the damper checked first , just to make sure its closing right....Its an easy thing to check .)

That leaves two things........The T-stat and the Cat.

The fact that you can turn the T-stat down and it snuffs the fire tell me that yeah its working....But maybe only manually ......When you turn it down it does decrease the air but it is also supposed to open up to add air in the box to keep the wood burning which releases the gases from the wood and activates the Cat.

I Don't think this is happening right.. Something in the T-Stat is malfunctioning and or the air valve that lets air in the box to ignite the wood....Without this process the wood cannot get air and gas off to the cat.

This is the next thing I would do is have the T-stat checked and the air port that lets air into the stove. Actually I would ask the dealer to have BK replace it to rule out this possibility.

Highbeam mentioned that the Cat could be dead.........I think its possible but not until the T-stat is ruled out ....Cause a defective T-stat can make the Cat not function properly.

Highbeam , Yes the cat in the Ashford is stainless steel....It was also that way in my Chinook 30 . I have a theory on this about the cat thing. And that is that it might be possible that these stainless steel cats are not giving off as much heat as the ceramic cats that the princess and king models have.........I am assuming that rdust and Highbeam both have ceramic cats ?
I also have read by other members that the ceramic cats give off a lot more heat than the stainless steel cats.

Something to think about


P.S. I discovered that after removing my top cast plate from the stove, my house temp increased by 3 degrees In an hour and held that temp.......not sure why........well I do have a theory......heh



Allan

 

[shoot-straight]

my ashford is acting squirrely as well. not quite as acute as zanimals problems, but its not doing what it should be doing. more specifically (and more importantly), its not doing what i bought it for. the burns are short, and are quite similar to my non-cat burn. lots of heat for a few hours, then a decline begins. sure its still "burning" 7 hours later, but there is no appriciable heat coming out. my non-cat had plenty of coals after 7 hours too, and had a much smaller firebox!

i loaded up 40#'s wood bricks the last two nights. both nights i have had to get up in the middle of the night to turn the stat up to get the heat i needed. both nights after just 4 hours the cat temps were only just above active zone. stat was intially set on 1.5 the first night, then 2 the second. a load of my oak acts pretty much the same way. dont think its the cat, mine glows really red at times.

my dealer thinks my problem is too much draft. but he is pretty stumped. supposed to be talking with BK about it.

am i expecting too much? the main reason i bought a blaze king was the stat. you are supposed to set it, and walk away- for long periods. its the main selling point. its in all their literature and videos. i hated getting up in the middle of the night to feed and adjust my non-cat stove on cold nights. i hated that enough to spend over almost 4k in a new stove and install and sell a perfectly good heater in the middle of the coldest winter ive experienced. foolish? maybe, but i dont give up easily.

 

[Highbeam]

If the cat is working right, you should get no smoke out of the stack. It will need to be in the active range to do this, which it is.

This is unfortunately false. The BKs are not a clean burning stove. I usually have no visible smoke but I certainly get a significant portion of burn time with smoke even though the cat is very active and glowing.

And if your flames went out after a time like you said at 2 1/4 stat setting and your pipe temps were holding 250 ? ,then your cat is working somewhat.

Good point. If the stove pipe stays at 250 (on the outer shell of double wall 20" up) for say an hour after the flames go out then the cat is eating. That is a great way to verify operation. I wish he had a probe meter for more accuracy but the surface temp is so high that it works. I would expect the cat to be glowing if the flue temps are that high and the flame is out.

Whether Zanimal has a bypass problem, a stat problem, or a cat problem this is all on BK and the dealer needs to be motivated. Given the current information, the stove is defective. We beat the heck out of the wood, the chimney (a full pic would still be nice), and his operational technique. These stoves are easy to use when everything is right, and if the hearth.com collective can't get this going right then either information is being withheld or the stove is defective.

Yes, my princess has a ceramic cat and it has a very dependable function. I only have a 14 foot total height chimney.

am i expecting too much? the main reason i bought a blaze king was the stat. you are supposed to set it, and walk away- for long periods. its the main selling point. its in all their literature and videos. i hated getting up in the middle of the night to feed and adjust my non-cat stove on cold nights.

No, that's how they are supposed to work. That's how mine works. There is a little bit of technique though that you learn as you go, such as setting the stat setting high enough that it makes enough heat during the entire cycle to keep you warm. It's not a room temp stat, and as the night goes on you need more heat usually. So if you had to wake up because it was too cold then bump it up a little higher next time.

 

[webby3650]

Yes, bkvp even said it would likely be able to handle the draft.

Also. I measured my stove is about 5" from the back wall. Manual wants 6". Again, everything is not really hot back there.

Just threw a bunch of nice dry oak in it. We'll see how things go tonight.

I'm sure it's been touched on, I havent read every post.
I really think that alcove is messing with the T stat. I'm not sure if that is covered in the Ashford manual or not, but it is in the other models. It can have a substantial impact on performance.

 

[webby3650]

my ashford is acting squirrely as well. not quite as acute as zanimals problems, but its not doing what it should be doing. more specifically (and more importantly), its not doing what i bought it for. the burns are short, and are quite similar to my non-cat burn. lots of heat for a few hours, then a decline begins. sure its still "burning" 7 hours later, but there is no appriciable heat coming out. my non-cat had plenty of coals after 7 hours too, and had a much smaller firebox!

i loaded up 40#'s wood bricks the last two nights. both nights i have had to get up in the middle of the night to turn the stat up to get the heat i needed. both nights after just 4 hours the cat temps were only just above active zone. stat was intially set on 1.5 the first night, then 2 the second. a load of my oak acts pretty much the same way. dont think its the cat, mine glows really red at times.

my dealer thinks my problem is too much draft. but he is pretty stumped. supposed to be talking with BK about it.

am i expecting too much? the main reason i bought a blaze king was the stat. you are supposed to set it, and walk away- for long periods. its the main selling point. its in all their literature and videos. i hated getting up in the middle of the night to feed and adjust my non-cat stove on cold nights. i hated that enough to spend over almost 4k in a new stove and install and sell a perfectly good heater in the middle of the coldest winter ive experienced. foolish? maybe, but i dont give up easily.

I don't get up in the night for any of the stoves I've ever had in here. Something is way off here! I just don't get it. I didn't even add wood this morning after all night. I'm heating around 2,000 square feet. I do run the Oslo when its in the teens and below, but I don't have to.

 

[alforit]

my ashford is acting squirrely as well. not quite as acute as zanimals problems, but its not doing what it should be doing. more specifically (and more importantly), its not doing what i bought it for. the burns are short, and are quite similar to my non-cat burn. lots of heat for a few hours, then a decline begins. sure its still "burning" 7 hours later, but there is no appriciable heat coming out. my non-cat had plenty of coals after 7 hours too, and had a much smaller firebox!

i loaded up 40#'s wood bricks the last two nights. both nights i have had to get up in the middle of the night to turn the stat up to get the heat i needed. both nights after just 4 hours the cat temps were only just above active zone. stat was intially set on 1.5 the first night, then 2 the second. a load of my oak acts pretty much the same way. dont think its the cat, mine glows really red at times.

my dealer thinks my problem is too much draft. but he is pretty stumped. supposed to be talking with BK about it.

am i expecting too much? the main reason i bought a blaze king was the stat. you are supposed to set it, and walk away- for long periods. its the main selling point. its in all their literature and videos. i hated getting up in the middle of the night to feed and adjust my non-cat stove on cold nights. i hated that enough to spend over almost 4k in a new stove and install and sell a perfectly good heater in the middle of the coldest winter ive experienced. foolish? maybe, but i dont give up easily.

shoot-straight ,

Thanks for that info. That helps a lot with the total picture here.

You should be staying well into the active zone on your meter throughout your burn.
Especially burning those bricks.....cuz they burn hot.

I have burned Just 4 bricks in my stove and got 8 hours of good heat and the meter has stayed well into the active zone until the end of the burn.

The fact that your cat glows red tells me that its doing fine.

There is a similarity here between you and Zanimal.....The main thing that concerns me is both of you are dropping out , or getting close to dropping out of the active zone in the middle up your burns.

I think this is a T stat problem......We had another member recently with a similar problem that ended up just swapping out her stove so we never found out what it really was. She also felt that it was her T-stat.

Glad you're hanging in there......This will get resolved.
.

 

[webby3650]

shoot-straight ,

Thanks for that info. That helps a lot with the total picture here.

You should be staying well into the active zone on your meter throughout your burn.
Especially burning those bricks.....cuz they burn hot.

I have burned Just 4 bricks in my stove and got 8 hours of good heat and the meter has stayed well into the active zone until the end of the burn.

The fact that your cat glows red tells me that its doing fine.

There is a similarity here between you and Zanimal.....The main thing that concerns me is both of you are dropping out , or getting close to dropping out of the active zone in the middle up your burns.

I think this is a T stat problem......We had another member recently with a similar problem that ended up just swapping out her stove so we never found out what it really was. She also felt that it was her T-stat.

Glad you're hanging in there......This will get resolved.
.

The ashfords have the steel cat. They do not stay active as long as the cerimac cats, and the blowers seem to make mine fall out even sooner. But still get nice long burns with no smoke!

 

[alforit]

The ashfords have the steel cat. They do not stay active as long as the cerimac cats, and the blowers seem to make mine fall out even sooner. But still get nice long burns with no smoke!

I'm not using a blower and I stay well active for the whole burn.....

I mentioned in my post last night that I think the stainless steel cats are not burning as hot as the ceramic ones........I ordered a ceramic cat a few days ago because I want to see if it works better In the stove like some members have been discussing......I will update on what I find out......Might very well be a solution to what's going on with these new BK owners.

 

[shoot-straight]

had to run home at lunchtime. filled her up and opened her up to 2.5 or so. of course, lots of smoke. shut damper, less smoke, but still lots. began dialing it back to 2. little to no smoke.

im guessing the smoke at higher settings means the cat is unable to keep up with all the gases?

 

[weatherguy]

my ashford is acting squirrely as well. not quite as acute as zanimals problems, but its not doing what it should be doing. more specifically (and more importantly), its not doing what i bought it for. the burns are short, and are quite similar to my non-cat burn. lots of heat for a few hours, then a decline begins. sure its still "burning" 7 hours later, but there is no appriciable heat coming out. my non-cat had plenty of coals after 7 hours too, and had a much smaller firebox!

i loaded up 40#'s wood bricks the last two nights. both nights i have had to get up in the middle of the night to turn the stat up to get the heat i needed. both nights after just 4 hours the cat temps were only just above active zone. stat was intially set on 1.5 the first night, then 2 the second. a load of my oak acts pretty much the same way. dont think its the cat, mine glows really red at times.

my dealer thinks my problem is too much draft. but he is pretty stumped. supposed to be talking with BK about it.

am i expecting too much? the main reason i bought a blaze king was the stat. you are supposed to set it, and walk away- for long periods. its the main selling point. its in all their literature and videos. i hated getting up in the middle of the night to feed and adjust my non-cat stove on cold nights. i hated that enough to spend over almost 4k in a new stove and install and sell a perfectly good heater in the middle of the coldest winter ive experienced. foolish? maybe, but i dont give up easily.

Mine will do this sometimes too and the cause is me turning the stat too low before bed, I just did it Tues night and when I got up Weds morn the house was cold, box was half full so I turned it up and got it going again. If your draft is a bit weaker your spot may be a tad more open than someone else's. In my case one dot (10%) can mean the difference between waking up to a cold house or a warm house with the box 80% gone.

 

[shoot-straight]

I'm sure it's been touched on, I havent read every post.
I really think that alcove is messing with the T stat. I'm not sure if that is covered in the Ashford manual or not, but it is in the other models. It can have a substantial impact on performance.

it was a very good thought and it makes sense. waiting on dealer-BK interaction and see what they say on that issue as well.

it is not specifically mentioned in the manual, it just says that blowers are required for alcove installation. i and my dealer assumed the clearance was to combustables, not solid bricks.

 

[Highbeam]

had to run home at lunchtime. filled her up and opened her up to 2.5 or so. of course, lots of smoke. shut damper, less smoke, but still lots. began dialing it back to 2. little to no smoke.

im guessing the smoke at higher settings means the cat is unable to keep up with all the gases?

Mine is an intermittent smoker too but I am homing in on the reasons.

You are right that if the flow of fuel through the cat is too fast then the cat can't eat it fast enough and it smokes. I have found that this isn't the same thing as a high stat setting because if you leave the stat setting high for long enough, the stove gets hot and the stat will be satisfied and will throttle back the intake air which allows the stove to burn clean again. So it is high "acceleration" rates that cause smoke, at cruise the stat is more closed and the cat is able to keep up by eating up the smoke.

 

[rdust]

I'm sure it's been touched on, I havent read every post.
I really think that alcove is messing with the T stat. I'm not sure if that is covered in the Ashford manual or not, but it is in the other models. It can have a substantial impact on performance.

I suggested that early in the posts regarding the performance.

 

[webby3650]

it was a very good thought and it makes sense. waiting on dealer-BK interaction and see what they say on that issue as well.

it is not specifically mentioned in the manual, it just says that blowers are required for alcove installation. i and my dealer assumed the clearance was to combustables, not solid bricks.

I have discussed this with BKVP, it is an issue in an alcove. The clearances need to be met.

 

[shoot-straight]

I have discussed this with BKVP, it is an issue in an alcove. The clearances need to be met.

Thanks I will discuss with my dealer and give it a try. I have some wiggle room with the pipe.

 

[RustyShackleford]

I think this is a T stat problem......
.

I haven't been following this closely, but I assume the reverse-wound thermostat issue has been discussed ?

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/blaze-king-thermostat-faulty.48603/

 

[Zanimal]

I also get no smoke when the bypass is closed.

Draft seem to be the major suspect right now. Got to find a bigger ladder to get on the roof easier.

 

[Rickb]

I have discussed this with BKVP, it is an issue in an alcove. The clearances need to be met.

Mine is in a small alcove. Runs just fine with or with out the fan running. I will say I do not get a lot of heat from it with out the fan but with the fan it heats most of my house just fine.

 

[Zanimal]

The cat has just dropped into the inactive range and the flapper on my Ashford is still closed.
Dial is set at the low edge of the normal range at 1 3/4.

Temperature has gone up a good 20 degrees but I still need to keep the dial between 2 1/4 and 2 1/2 to keep my 600 sq ft a constant temperature. And of course I'm still not getting anywhere near 10 hours of consistent heat output on high.

 

[webby3650]

The cat has just dropped into the inactive range and the flapper on my Ashford is still closed.
Dial is set at the low edge of the normal range at 1 3/4.

Temperature has gone up a good 20 degrees but I still need to keep the dial between 2 1/4 and 2 1/2 to keep my 600 sq ft a constant temperature. And of course I'm still not getting anywhere near 10 hours of consistent heat output on high.

It's barely broke freezing here in the past 24 hours, coming out of a deep freeze. Just reloaded. My wife added 1 log at lunchtime, that's the first time it's been touched in 24 hours. I will often turn the therm up for a time in the mornings, but unless its below freezing I don't reload until the evening.

 

[webby3650]

For the record, 2200 square feet. 1971 ranch with poor windows and doors.

 

[Zanimal]

2200 square feet. 1971 ranch with poor windows and doors.

That makes me sad. I also have a ranch. But with all new fancy windows.

How do you add a log when it is full without having the stove spew ash and coal on your floor?

 

[weatherguy]

The cat has just dropped into the inactive range and the flapper on my Ashford is still closed.
Dial is set at the low edge of the normal range at 1 3/4.

Temperature has gone up a good 20 degrees but I still need to keep the dial between 2 1/4 and 2 1/2 to keep my 600 sq ft a constant temperature. And of course I'm still not getting anywhere near 10 hours of consistent heat output on high.

It just may be a T-stat issue like alforit stated, or draft, one or the other is my guess and that's all we can do at this point. Rusty brought up a good point, there were some issues with the t-stats installed incorrectly, maybe that.
Hope you get it figured out soon or they give you another stove that works.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Rusty brought up a good point, there were some issues with the t-stats installed incorrectly

Not to nitpick, but the problem is thermostats manufactured incorrectly (not installed incorrectly). Specifically, the coil wound incorrectly with respect to the sandwich of two metals making up the bi-metallic coil:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bimetallic_strip