I was going to buy the exact stove you have with the legs. I worried about service as there is no one in my area that would service them. The nearest dealer is a few hours away. But I figured oh well I can figure it out. I had everything ready to buy it via efireplace store. Their payment processing was weird and very flawed so I couldnt provide them payment in a secure manner and backed out. Then I started doing more research and landed on a cast iron stove and then it was a toss up between the jotul and the VC. I made a bad decision.
Yet another hair raising moment with my new stove. Plastic smell and tinging inside the pipe.
- Thread starter GrumpyDad
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EbS-P
Minister of Fire
Woodsplitter67
Minister of Fire
You could get that. I really dont think that the low temp is necessary once the cat is going.. its going.. Very rarely will a cat stall unless its at the end of its life.. the cat is supposed to go out after the off gassing and your at the end of the burn so an alarm set to a low temperature going off multiple tims a day when the burn gets to the end of its cycle .. thats a no go for me..
EbS-P
Minister of Fire
ok understood. I figured if my problems were stalling more so than overheats, then my alarm should be at the low end. But I get what you are saying. Get it to that temp and then dont touch the air adjustment unless my goal is to heat the room more, but not less. My cat is my goal, my minimum goal, nothing else really matters nearly as much.
OK had my first burn ever last night and I am taking notes; Think I may have slowed down the fire a bit too soon after the first re-load. Have some black on the glass. Will be a bit more careful tonight. Learned a lot reading this thread.. I have a cat with a probe. Probe temp did get up to 1300 at one point, but then started dropping. I disengaged the cat when it got to 570. Only doing small loads for the break in process and it was warm last night so I didn't want to make the room to hot to be in.
It just seemed strange. Probe was at around 400 for a while after a reload. It wan't until I turned down the air that it started to rise. Once it got over 600 I engaged the cat. It went up to a little over 1300 in the span of about 20 min but only stayed there for 5 to 10 minutes. then started to drop. Was back down to 600 in about 15 min. The only thing I can think of is I was doing small loads with pieces a little bigger than my forearm and between getting that going and the high temps it burned it out faster than I expected. Got some bigger pieces for tonight's burn.
Seems oddly similar to my experiences without the cat. Yes, probably should be a separate discussion point, or maybe getting 'clean burns' and less temp swings should be a thread. With comparisons over wood used, wood qty loaded, cat or no cat, outside temps, house conditions (drafty/tight/OAK installed). People listing what works, what didnt, in a single thread.
I suppose this is a long shot, but if your stove has a baffle, I may be able to shed some light on your problem of the smoldering well seasoned wood. I have been running the same stove for 18 years. It's a Hearthstone Heritage non-cat and works off tubes, a baffle and secondary burn for it's efficiency. My wood has always been mostly well seasoned with a few duds thrown in here and there. I've tried to burn hot to offset any wetter wood and the result has been very little creosote to sweep out when I clean my chimney. I've never had more than a cup of accumulation the entire 18" of chimney.
Last year, my stove seemed to be putting out less heat while over-firing a bit. I assumed it was the baffle getting old. I tried to save a few bucks and ordered an after market baffle instead of one specifically for Hearthstone. It was the same overall dimensions but 1/8" to 1/4" thicker. I put the new baffle in and suddenly my over-firing stove turned into one that couldn't keep a match lit. Wood that was put onto hot coals would not stay ignited if I closed the door. Suddenly I had back draft smoke coming into the room, even with a window cracked open. The part of this that makes me think it might be related to your problem is, I have never seen so much cottage cheese consistency black creosote build up the glass as fast as it did in one week of using the stove with that new baffle. Just that little extra thickness in baffle threw everything out of whack in how the stove functioned. As soon as I put the old baffle back it, things went immediately back to normal.
Just this morning, I swept my chimney and got probably 4X the buildup I've ever had before come out of that stack, again those larger black flakes like the stove glass. Even if you don't have a baffle in that stove, maybe something is just out of alignment coming out of the stove into the single wall pipe? Just a thought.
Last year, my stove seemed to be putting out less heat while over-firing a bit. I assumed it was the baffle getting old. I tried to save a few bucks and ordered an after market baffle instead of one specifically for Hearthstone. It was the same overall dimensions but 1/8" to 1/4" thicker. I put the new baffle in and suddenly my over-firing stove turned into one that couldn't keep a match lit. Wood that was put onto hot coals would not stay ignited if I closed the door. Suddenly I had back draft smoke coming into the room, even with a window cracked open. The part of this that makes me think it might be related to your problem is, I have never seen so much cottage cheese consistency black creosote build up the glass as fast as it did in one week of using the stove with that new baffle. Just that little extra thickness in baffle threw everything out of whack in how the stove functioned. As soon as I put the old baffle back it, things went immediately back to normal.
Just this morning, I swept my chimney and got probably 4X the buildup I've ever had before come out of that stack, again those larger black flakes like the stove glass. Even if you don't have a baffle in that stove, maybe something is just out of alignment coming out of the stove into the single wall pipe? Just a thought.
Chill in Northern VT
New Member
As I suspected I would, I sorta gave up on the stove and moved on to other adventures. It has been very warm lately as well so that is a contributing factor. I imagine as I need to, I will use the stove again however I'm still not sure if I'm going to get the cat or not. Regardless of what folks say here, I think a cat only masks poor design. So I'll burn hotter and avoid overnight burns for now possibly or throw more money at the problem and be more salty about the money I spent to get a mediocre stove when I should have gotten the jotul. If that happens I'll just buy the jotul, install it, then sell this thing likely for a mega loss.
I know nothing, but as I understand it, the cat is used primarily (or its primary advantage) to allow long, cool-ish burns while not building excessive creosote in a cool-ish chimney.
obviously your stove needs to burn hotter as it stands and air cannot be shut down until your fuel is burning with cherry-red edges everywere.
newbie tho, so I know nothing...
obviously your stove needs to burn hotter as it stands and air cannot be shut down until your fuel is burning with cherry-red edges everywere.
newbie tho, so I know nothing...
I feel like should give my opinion, as I have been burning my Dauntless without a cat for a couple weeks now, about a dozen burns so far. My stove is a hearth install, 15' oval insulated liner in a masonry chimney, in a room that is almost identical to OP. I've only loaded the firebox a little more than half full, with wood that is 14-18% MC on fresh splits, mainly ash and cherry. Keep in mind, this isn't for heating the whole house, and I will be getting a cat in the near future.
Based on my observations with my set up, this stove likes to be run with the air wide open or close to it with the bypass closed and no cat. I don't actually close the bypass until the STT is at least 550 degrees. Once it's closed, I can cruise at 450-550 with the air wide open for about 3 hours, with single wall pipe temps above 300 before STT start to drop. This produces little smoke out of the chimney, and the glass stays mostly clean, even burning most of the day. I do have to load more frequently, but I rest easy knowing I'm not producing a ton of creosote.
One thing I've learned with this stove that is important, and may help OP, is how and what STT temperature I reload as well as the size of splits. If I try to do a hot reload, with glowing coals, and STT at 500 or higher, there will be a lot of smoke coming out of the chimney once the bypass is closed, especially if I put too much wood in, or too big of splits and don't let it catch and burn a bit before I closed the bypass. If I open the bypass to get the load going, the temps spike pretty quickly and could easily run away if not paying attention. Closing the bypass will get STT under control, but again, things start to smolder until the air regulates. This could take up to 15 minutes or longer before the smoke lessens and the load catches. I can't really turn the primary air down until the load has burned for a good amount of time, even then, there is noticeably more smoke out of the chimney with a hot reload. What I do now is wait until the STT has dropped to under 400, then I'll load the stove, have the primary wide open with the bypass open until STT get to at least 550, ideally a little higher, then I'll close the bypass, keeping the primary wide open for the whole burn or at least an hour before closing it down a little. I cannot imagine closing the air all the way down without a cat, especially after loading the stove completely full with questionable wood MC. Things will just smolder and smolder. I'm looking forward to getting a cat.
Based on my observations with my set up, this stove likes to be run with the air wide open or close to it with the bypass closed and no cat. I don't actually close the bypass until the STT is at least 550 degrees. Once it's closed, I can cruise at 450-550 with the air wide open for about 3 hours, with single wall pipe temps above 300 before STT start to drop. This produces little smoke out of the chimney, and the glass stays mostly clean, even burning most of the day. I do have to load more frequently, but I rest easy knowing I'm not producing a ton of creosote.
One thing I've learned with this stove that is important, and may help OP, is how and what STT temperature I reload as well as the size of splits. If I try to do a hot reload, with glowing coals, and STT at 500 or higher, there will be a lot of smoke coming out of the chimney once the bypass is closed, especially if I put too much wood in, or too big of splits and don't let it catch and burn a bit before I closed the bypass. If I open the bypass to get the load going, the temps spike pretty quickly and could easily run away if not paying attention. Closing the bypass will get STT under control, but again, things start to smolder until the air regulates. This could take up to 15 minutes or longer before the smoke lessens and the load catches. I can't really turn the primary air down until the load has burned for a good amount of time, even then, there is noticeably more smoke out of the chimney with a hot reload. What I do now is wait until the STT has dropped to under 400, then I'll load the stove, have the primary wide open with the bypass open until STT get to at least 550, ideally a little higher, then I'll close the bypass, keeping the primary wide open for the whole burn or at least an hour before closing it down a little. I cannot imagine closing the air all the way down without a cat, especially after loading the stove completely full with questionable wood MC. Things will just smolder and smolder. I'm looking forward to getting a cat.
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