Whole House Plumbing Shut Off

[mirabelorion]

I have a 1” PE line coming off the old well into the house through the stone wall. After it comes through the stone wall, a 90* fitting (plastic) connected the PE lines and from there it was buried under the dirt floor and travels to the house plumbing. I cut the PE line about 20” after the 90* fitting and put an adapter at the end to transition to PVC and then to the house plumbing. One night I came home from work at 2AM and there was no water pressure. I went into the basement to find water all over the floor (dirt plus water equals mud) and shelving. The 90* fitting had blown out of the horizontal line coming into the house and had blown water across the basement. THANKFULLY, I had used a pressure switch with a low-pressure cutoff, so the pump shut off. The contents of the two water tanks were pushed out against the stone wall and then flooded the floor. This could have been catastrophic, but we were lucky.

I want to make sure that this doesn’t happen again. If the fitting had only leaked, and not blown out, the pump would have continuously pumped water in the basement, and this would have been catastrophic. I have seen products that shut a valve if a sensor detects water, but my thought is that they would burn the pump up. I want a system that will kill the electrical supply to the pump if a sensor detects water.

Do you have any recommendations for me? The only option that I have found is this Lifera Plumbing

As always, I appreciate any help.

Bob

I have a 50+ year old ranch house with a 3/4" copper main supply coming out the slab. It has a sweated gate valve about 5" above slab and then a sweated pressure regulator in-line with 3/4" main line for the rest of the house. The gate valve does not fully shut off (steady dribble) when closed and city water shut-off *almost* complete shuts off when turn if off at the meter. It has very slow drip (~1 drip every 2-3 seconds) matter how tight I close the value at the street. Normally this has not been a issue, since I can open a tap in the basement and away from where I'm working and have no drip to contend with.

Since this is the main supply line, with the slow drip from the street, I'm concerned that I may not be able to get enough of the water out of the supply pipe to sweat on a new connector before it fills up again. I sweated a bunch of 1/2" copper over years and with no issue... but always with a supply line I could complete shut off.

So I'm thinking of just cutting out the gate valve and pressure reg, clean up the Cu pipe and install the 3/4" FIP compression fitting on the supply coming out of the floor, being careful on tightening to not mess up the supply piping. Once that's done, just add the ball valve and new pressure reg call it done.

That said, I've used 3/8" and 1/2" compression fittings a bunch but never a 3/4". So any wisdom and advice is appreciated.

 

[Highbeam]

Just stick a sharkbite on there!

 

[bigealta]

1st are you sure it's a gate valve and not a globe valve?
If it is a globe valve the easiest thing to do is rebuild it. (new washer and maybe new or additional packing)

If it is a globe valve then i would probably leave it in place and put a new ball valve in a convenient place after the pressure reducer. That would be the least risky thing to do. If you don't get it right the 1st time you can keep trying till you do.


Or if you do want to replace the gate valve after cutting out the pressure reducing valve:

1. You could try to freeze the supply but not sure if 5" is enough space to do that.

2. Try to suck out as much water as possible with a clear tube, Then unsoldier the valve.
Clean the 3/4 copper and new valve.
Flux 1 side of the new ball valve.
Pre soldier a length of 3/4 On the house side of the ball valve.
Clean the other side of the ball valve again and flux it.
Stick tube down the 3/4 feed and again suck out as much as possible, the more the merrier. (an old trick is to stuff white bread down the pipe to absorb the water but this may not help in your situation.)
(Instead of sucking use your thumb over the end of the tube to trap the water in the tube. Remove tube, dump water and repeat..)
Now when the water is at it's lowest you can get flux the cleaned dry copper and soldier on your new ball valve.

The above will save the 5" of the 3/4 supply line without cutting anything.

If you go with the soldier valve have a compression one there for back up just in case you can't get the soldier to flow.

If you want to use the compression you will have to cut the 5" shorter to clear any soldier from the existing valve. That starts getting into a bit of a dangerous game where if you run into problems you'll have to call in a plumber.

If it was my house i'd go for a soldiered or compression ball valve after the existing valve then the pressure reducer (which you have to cut out anyway) then back to you main house line.

Post a pic if you can it may help.

 

[bigealta]

Yeah or sharkbite, but not in my house.

 

[John Galt]

Cut the pipe, stick the end of a hand held transfer pump ($8 Harbor freight) pump out the water, solder away.

 

[bigealta]

Cut the pipe, stick the end of a hand held transfer pump ($8 Harbor freight) pump out the water, solder away.

Yes this for sure, or even a drill pump with your cordless drill / driver.

 

[Duds13]

I've been interested in adding a shut off in my home as well. Anyone familiar with Flo by Moen?

Meet Flo Smart Water Shut Off | Smart Water Monitor | Moen

Learn more about Flo, a smart water device by Moen. Get leak protection for your entire home with smart water solutions from Moen. Shop now!

www.moen.com

 

[GG Woody]

I have a 50+ year old ranch house with a 3/4" copper main supply coming out the slab. It has a sweated gate valve about 5" above slab and then a sweated pressure regulator in-line with 3/4" main line for the rest of the house. The gate valve does not fully shut off (steady dribble) when closed and city water shut-off *almost* complete shuts off when turn if off at the meter. It has very slow drip (~1 drip every 2-3 seconds) matter how tight I close the value at the street. Normally this has not been a issue, since I can open a tap in the basement and away from where I'm working and have no drip to contend with.

Since this is the main supply line, with the slow drip from the street, I'm concerned that I may not be able to get enough of the water out of the supply pipe to sweat on a new connector before it fills up again. I sweated a bunch of 1/2" copper over years and with no issue... but always with a supply line I could complete shut off.

So I'm thinking of just cutting out the gate valve and pressure reg, clean up the Cu pipe and install the 3/4" FIP compression fitting on the supply coming out of the floor, being careful on tightening to not mess up the supply piping. Once that's done, just add the ball valve and new pressure reg call it done.

That said, I've used 3/8" and 1/2" compression fittings a bunch but never a 3/4". So any wisdom and advice is appreciated.

I work at a commercial mechanical outfit, I'm not quite a plumber but our plumbers use a copper crimp system called Pro Press by Rigid. They rarely solder any more. I'm not sure I love the Pro Press but I would definitely use it for one fitting to get you a positive shut off. Our wholesaler has a Pro Press gun that people can rent for a reasonable fee.
I hope maybe this helps someone!