When is small too small? Morso 1410

[rjustice4]

Not sure which dealer you've been using (some of these dealers sell stuff in spite of themselves...!), but there is a dealer in Arnold that sells both Morso and Jotul. I'm sure they're familiar with the requirements for the install in Calaveras County. Here is their contact info:

High Country Spa & Stove Ctr
2720 Highway 4, Arnold, CA 95223
(209) 795-3593

I ended up using a dealer in Modesto because I got a great deal on a floor model. He also did the install, and did a great job. You're welcome to stop by and take a look, I'm just around the corner....

Bob

 

[rjustice4]

...by the way, as I recall, you've got an issue with needing short rounds and splits for your stove. I've still got a few logs that haven't been cut into rounds, and would be willing to trade some green splits (cut to your size) for some of your dry, longer splits. Wouldn't have to move the wood too far, just around the corner. Not sure if the green wood would be ready for this season, though....

Let me know.....

Bob

 

[Gooserider]

My install guy noticed that the back plate had instructions on it which stated a 16" clearance from combustibles from the back wall. The paper literature that came with it states that stove should be 16" from combustibles at rear (in my case the wall). The paper literature that comes with it states 8" from combustibles at rear. So, I called the dealer and they clarified that 8" can be used if you install double wall pipe connector.

At this point I don't really trust the dealer on anything. Has anyone installed these European stoves here in the US with this little clearance?

kb

For information purposes, I have attached the clearance specifications for the Morso 1410. Maybe this would make it easier for others to comment.

I'm assuming the clearances are taken from the manual or other "official" source? If so, good, if not they don't count....

Assuming they are - my reading is that you can have the stove 6" away from a combustible wall IFF you are using the optional rear and bottom shields on the stove itself, AND are using either double wall connector pipe, or single wall with a shield on it.

However remember also that your local inspection authority has the final say.

Gooserider

 

[Gooserider]

No problem, just covering myself in that if I say something I want to be sure it is based on correct info as best I can... Presumably when you get the install inspected, you will need to hand the inspector a copy of the manual or equivalent to prove you did right - the inspector will insist on an official source of some sort, and it has to be from the correct stove, etc. It doesn't help to reference some other manual for a different company or stove model...

Gooserider

 

[jdeuel]

How's the Morso working out?

I installed one at my place in the Santa Cruz mountains back in June. We put a Lopi Answer in the living room/kitchen, and the Squirrel in the bedroom. The bedroom is 10X15 with a ceiling that peaks at 14-15'. The cabin is single-wall construction, all redwood, with single-pane windows. We cut a bunch of splits at a time with the chainsaw, and usually start it with half a wax log and an 8-incher. Right before bed, we toss in 2 more 8's, and that thing is hot to the touch when we get up in the morning.

~jd

 

[stathouse]

How timely! My install was completed last week and I just lit my first fire this weekend! Luckily the weather was temperate so I could open all the windows as it off-gassed like crazy setting off all the smoke detectors.

My second, real burn later that night was very pleasant. Obviously I'm still getting used to how it works, but it is easy to light once I realized you really need to use a ton of kindling just like the manual states, so you have a good bed of coals to start. It was not really that cold out this weekend, so the jury is still out on the capabilities of the stove. I will post my experince after I get some colder nights and longer burns.

Attached are some pics of the stove and the install. I sill have some questions about the install, though. My professional installer had told me when he initially gave me the install quote, that the cap needs to be higher than your roof peak; it is currently about a foot lower. Is this important? Also, should there be some kind of braces or arms that add support? (In looking around my neighborhood at other peoples stacks, it seems this is what is done.) Is this my responsibility?

As always, feedback is appreciated.

BTW I am burning a mix of hard and soft wood, the hard being oak that has been "seasoning" for 10 years! It burns great, still hard and dense as ever. I guess I had it stored properly because there is not a rotten piece in the pile.

Cheers.

kb

 

[jdeuel]

I know what you mean about the off-gassing! Our stove stunk to high heaven during the first few fires. As far as your pipe goes, it sure looks like you could use some braces to the roof. We've got braces on ours, and it looks shorter than what you have...then again, we're in earthquake country!

My pipe is 2 feet above the peak of the roof, which is what my installer said was correct.

~jd

 

[Gooserider]

Attached are some pics of the stove and the install. I sill have some questions about the install, though. My professional installer had told me when he initially gave me the install quote, that the cap needs to be higher than your roof peak; it is currently about a foot lower. Is this important? Also, should there be some kind of braces or arms that add support? (In looking around my neighborhood at other peoples stacks, it seems this is what is done.) Is this my responsibility?

As always, feedback is appreciated.

The minimum chimney height rule is at least 3' higher than where you come through the roof, and 2' higher than anything within a 10 foot radius. This does NOT necessarily mean higher than the peak of the house, though it often does. Hard to tell from pictures, but it looks like you are OK in terms of the minimum. That said, under some conditions, being lower than the peak can cause draft problems - depends on the situation. Certainly one of the common fixes for problem drafts is to increase the chimney height.

You probably also need some support - If you had the chimney installed professionally, they really should have put them in (probably w/ a charge for parts) but if not your stove dealer should have the appropriate hardware. I believe the spec if taller than three feet, is to have one set of support legs at the three foot mark, and for every 3 feet of exposed chimney above that, but don't quote me. If you don't have them, there is a risk of heavy snow and or high winds knocking it over - bad news since those are the conditions when you REALLY don't want to go on the roof to make repairs... :gulp: Another thing that I've seen some folks do that have steep pitch roofs is to add "crickets" or little diverter walls above the pipe exit in order to keep a "roof avalanche" from coming down and cleaning the chimney off - depends on what you get for snow falls and how your roof handles them.

Gooserider

 

[stathouse]

if wall is too hot to hold hand on....time to consider heatshield

Enord,

This model comes with a rear and bottom heat sheild. It is barely warm on the back wall, and that is behind the double wall pipe, behind the stove it stays at room temp. And no heat out the bottom either. The heat shields are doing what they are designed to!

kb

 

[begreen]

I'm probably missing something in Coaster's pictures, but what does the side clearance measure for the stove? The table says 24" and it looks shy, but that may just be the angle of the photo.

 

[begreen]

stathouse, your installer should be following the 3/2 rule. The NFPA Standard #211 states: “Chimneys shall
extend at least three feet above the highest point where it passes through the roof
of a building, and at least two feet higher than any portion of a building within ten feet."

 

[elkimmeg]

Judging from the picture the pitch of the roof is a 10 pitch meaning at 10' height of the chimney he would still need 2 more feet to make the minimum 10 /2 rule

His chimney would need to be 12' high currently he show 2 3' sections it would require 2 braces and even the current setup needs a brace

Where was the inspector that miss that chimney height or the installers that are supposed to know what is required?

 

[stathouse]

An update on the insatall; brace has been added and pipe now extends above the roof peak. I will post pics after I climb back up there again take them.

Question on surface temps (note: I sent an email to Morso asking for specific stove top maximum temps and will post their response, if any is given. The manual only states that you should never "over fire" the stove and if any part of the stove glows red, you are "over firing." Well, duh). But a question to the forum; I am using a Rutland stove top thermometer and a Condar pipe probe. The high-end of the "burn zone" on the Rutland is at 575°F. Seems like I can acheive this really fast and have to start cutting the air back...and the nights have not dropped below 30°F yet. I know the Rutland is just generic, so could the 575° be somewhat conservative? BTW the flue temps are fairly modest, around 400°F, just on the low edge of that guages "burn zone."

KB

 

[jdeuel]

I had my 1410 going on Sunday night-temps outside were in the high 30's, but with NO insulation (except the floors) and single-wall construction, you can feel the cold...

I think I had been running it a little cool (thermometer ordered) in the past, as shutting down the upper air intake more than 3 turns from closed usually resulted in the fire beginning to smother. I was able to run it 1 turn from closed with flames coming from all the upper secondary holes. Sure slowed down my wood consumption, as well. On the subject of wood, I came across some oak in the pile, which burns SO much better in the Morso than the eucalyptus I've been using. I don't think I'll be getting any more of the eucalyptus...

All in all, I'm really happy with the little Morso. It's definitely more finicky than the Lopi Answer in the family room/kitchen, but it sure keeps the bedroom toasty!

~jd

 

[elkimmeg]

Just wondering id the moroso is listed for bedroom installations. All the wood stoves I have inspected none are listed for bedroom installations Code wise one cannot have a solid fuel burning appliance in a bedroom . That is listed as one of the prohibited locations Even many gas stoves require them to be tested and listed for bedroom installations and almost all are required for a separate outside air feed many require oxygen depletion shut off devices Code also governs the room area and air vollume required for heating appliances and that combustion air cannot come from a bedroom

 

[Bill]

575 stove top and 400 stack temp sounds like a nice clean burn. I wouldn't go over 650 stove top. You can call Morso @1-866-883-9619 and ask about your specific model stove. My understanding is you can burn coal in that unit also.

 

[jdeuel]

Just wondering id the moroso is listed for bedroom installations. All the wood stoves I have inspected none are listed for bedroom installations Code wise one cannot have a solid fuel burning appliance in a bedroom . That is listed as one of the prohibited locations Even many gas stoves require them to be tested and listed for bedroom installations and almost all are required for a separate outside air feed many require oxygen depletion shut off devices Code also governs the room area and air vollume required for heating appliances and that combustion air cannot come from a bedroom

I couldn't find anything in the manual prohibiting bedroom installations, but the county might have an issue with it.

I'm pretty comfortable having it there for a couple of reasons, though:

1. I feel this stove is infinitely safer than the ancient potbelly that was in there for 61 years,
2. We have multiple CO/smoke detectors in the room,
3. Regarding combustion air, there are a few spots in the bedroom where you can literally see daylight, either through gaps or knotholes!

~jd

 

[stathouse]

Follow-up post regarding stove-top temps direct from Morso. They do not give stove top temps but did tell me the following about stack temps for the 1410 model; the stack should read between 350°-650°F. This is their stated "burn zone" using a Morso thermometer installed 8" above the stove top on the pipe.

kb

 

[Bill]

Maybe for your model Morso, but I got stove top temperatures from them when I called, stay under 650*

 

[KeithO]

Elk: How does the law deal with a 1 room cottage ? There are many huts, shacks and cabins that would fit this description with 200-400 sq ft that would need heating in winter. Many hunting cabins in the UP would also fit the description and which would need a solid fuel device due to uncertainty of power suplies in winter.
Keith

Just wondering id the moroso is listed for bedroom installations. All the wood stoves I have inspected none are listed for bedroom installations Code wise one cannot have a solid fuel burning appliance in a bedroom . That is listed as one of the prohibited locations Even many gas stoves require them to be tested and listed for bedroom installations and almost all are required for a separate outside air feed many require oxygen depletion shut off devices Code also governs the room area and air vollume required for heating appliances and that combustion air cannot come from a bedroom

 

[jdeuel]

Follow-up post regarding stove-top temps direct from Morso. They do not give stove top temps but did tell me the following about stack temps for the 1410 model; the stack should read between 350°-650°F. This is their stated "burn zone" using a Morso thermometer installed 8" above the stove top on the pipe.

kb

Thanks for this info-I stuck the thermometer on the stove top right next to the stack, and 550-650 is where the stove seems to be burning the best. My Lopi seems to be 'happiest' around 550-600. As an aside, I've started loading the Morso North-South, and it's made things much easier, especially when I add wood at the up-at-4am-to-pee routine...

~jd