Thinking about an insert

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

This is a tough call, your fireplace is on the wrong level.....I vote for option C...... If you did that you would never pay for heat again, if you got your wood for free....

 

[8686]

I agree with the wrong level thing. It's also pushed against the wall. It makes tv placement a real problem What about the bedrooms? I can't expect the heat to travel that far through the house can I?

 

[8686]

Wood for free? Yes please, where do I sign up?

 

[mol1jb]

Looking at your pictures, if it was my house and I had to make the decision, I would almost certainly go downstairs. I'll tell you why. With the downstairs room being quite small, it shouldn't be hard to get a lot of the heat upstairs through that amazingly open staircase. It will take the assistance of a fan or 2 but the downstairs install looks easier and its a great looking finished room. Downside, your bedrooms would not be as warm with a downstairs install. What is the total square footage of the upstairs?

 

[jatoxico]

Wood for free? Yes please, where do I sign up?

As far as I'm concerned LI is a wood burners dream. Plenty of wood with nice variety of hard and soft woods. Easy scrounging and relatively few serious burners. Oh and cords go for as low as $100 but $150 even in season is common.

Looks like heat from the downstairs fireplace has an easy path up to the kitchen area. Get an insert that extends onto the hearth and it will put out good heat even w/o fans.

Only downsides I see would be:
1) Do you have access to the lower level from outside for wood hauling?
2) If you don't spend time down there it's out of sight and out of mind so careful of over fires if you forget the air is wide open.

 

[8686]

What is the total square footage of the upstairs?

ooo, I'm not sure. I think 2000 sq ft. So I would assume each level is 1000 sq ft. Does that sound right? There are 3 bedrooms upstairs. (We just moved in, in August).

If the insert is cooking enough to heat up the upstairs won't it be baking us in the room down there?

Yes, I have easy access to wood from the downstairs.

Can an insert/wood stove be left unattended? Is there any risk at all? Do you guys leave them going when you go to sleep/leave the room?

good ideas here, keep em coming.

 

[jatoxico]

If the insert is cooking enough to heat up the upstairs won't it be baking us in the room down there?

Can an insert/wood stove be left unattended? Is there any risk at all? Do you guys leave them going when you go to sleep/leave the room?

My insert is in a lower section of the house and one of best things about the layout is the heat rolls right outta there because there are no doorways or transoms to block it from going up. That room gets warm but never over heats. The house I grew up in had an old air tight in a converted garage and the heat could not get out. It was miserable, 85 F and dry in that room but not much heat anywhere else and there was no Hearth.com for advice.

You have the perfect opportunity to test before you do anything. I assume the lower section is on it's own zone? Let the house cool some then crank the heat down there and leave the thermostat on 55 upstairs and see what happens.

Yes you can leave the insert to burn on it's own overnight. I wouldn't do it day one but once you get a few burns under your belt its fine. You could use kitchen timers or get fancy and buy a temp monitor w/ alarm, plenty of ways to keep tabs on it.

 

[smokedragon]

My insert is downstairs, and I get about 8 degrees hotter in the family room down stairs than I get in the rooms directly up the stairs from the stove. It is noticeably warmer, but not so hot that it is unbearable.

Also, carrying wood upstairs will get old VERY quick if you burn much. Also, as many on here can attest, the further into your house you bring the wood, the more you spread the mess.

I would go with the basement, especially since you are looking to supplement your heat and not eliminate it. You could light the stove and settle in downstairs for the night. A stove with a glass door is probably as good as a fireplace, and a heck of a lot safer.

 

[Excavator]

The pic of the inside of chimney looks like mine did and I cut out hole in damper fram and notched few fire brick and installed 8 in ss insulated liner for my old Vermont Castings encore. You should only need a 6 inch liner today.

 

[8686]

As far as I'm concerned LI is a wood burners dream. Plenty of wood with nice variety of hard and soft woods. Easy scrounging and relatively few serious burners. Oh and cords go for as low as $100 but $150 even in season is common.

Help me please. A lot of places are sold out and the rest are selling green wood they advertize as "seasoned". I have a guy coming over to deliver a half-pickup truck (he says about a facecord worth) for $80. Go on Craigslist and its full of ads from people being scammed. It seems no one knows how big a "cord" of wood is, and people don't want to let their wood fully season before selling it. I resorted to those $5 bundles from Ronkonkoma lumber and all this stuff did was smoke. Badly.

 

[jatoxico]

Help me please. A lot of places are sold out and the rest are selling green wood they advertize as "seasoned". I have a guy coming over to deliver a half-pickup truck (he says about a facecord worth) for $80. Go on Craigslist and its full of ads from people being scammed. It seems no one knows how big a "cord" of wood is, and people don't want to let their wood fully season before selling it. I resorted to those $5 bundles from Ronkonkoma lumber and all this stuff did was smoke. Badly.

Hey hey... who said anything about seasoned? The seasoning is on you. At this point wait a couple weeks and then look for the best deal you can get on a couple cords to get a start but you're going to have to assume it will be green. Stack it so the wind can get to it, get maple, ash if you can and you'll be ok.

There is a kiln dried dealer that you can get a 1/4 cord (or more if you want) to use as mix in with the wetter stuff but it's pricey. Quarter cord is as much as a full cord. Better than oil but pricey. PM if you want.

First year is often tough. Start your scrounging and splitting now. Every little bit helps. Read up here on the 3 year plan a good idea for which I take no credit.

 

[8686]

I can't find anything about the 3 year plan...

 

[8686]

found it

 

[smokedragon]

It seems no one knows how big a "cord" of wood is

128 cubic feet of split and stacked wood is a cord.

a 4ft wide x 4ft tall x 8 ft long stack of wood.

My grandpa used to cut his firewood 24", so two rows wide, 4 ft high, 8 ft long was a cord.

I cut my firewood 16" long (when I am get to do the felling and bucking), and so three rows of wood is 4 ft wide.

Another way to estimate a cord (if it is split and neatly stacked):

I used to stack my wood on pallets, two pallets stacked 4 feet high, roughly make a cord (slightly less, but close since pallets are 40" x 48", you are losing 8")

A long bed pickup is a 4ft x 8 ft bed, stacked level full it is about 2 feet deep (half a cord). Anyone who tells you a standard pickup bed can hold a cord (unless they have extended the sides upward) is blowing some serious smoke up your (_|_)

The term face cord is VERY AMBIGUOUS, but when I was growing up, a face cord was 1 row of wood (cut 16"). This equated to 1/3 of a cord.

Anywho.......I hope that helps with the idea of a cord.

 

[billb3]

That's somewhat similar to my sister's house setup except the ( not quite as open) staircase is in the middle of the house rather than on the end.
She has a 3.xx cu ft stove in the basement and it will be 80- 85º downstairs and 70-75º upstairs. Downstairs and upstairs have hallways to the other end of the house (upstairs: 3 bedrooms one bath, downstairs: one bedroom that used to be a garage under, a utility room, a bathroom and a laundry ) and those rooms can all get quite cool if doors are closed and about 65º if left open. She doesn't mess around with fans yet which should and might help. They only use the wood stove from 4 or so in the afternoon to 6 or so in the morning. There's no one to feed it during the day.

I'd be tempted to build out the hearth a little bit downstairs and put free standing stove there that could be brought upstairs if downstairs just doesn't work.
A insert with a fan might likely be perfect.

 

[mstoelton]

I would start with a nice insert in the basement. Make sure it has a fan included and a larger firebox (at least 2.1 cubic feet). Make sure the installer includes an insulated block-off plate, and insulated liner and a sealed and insulated top plate.

It may not completely eliminate your heating bill, but it will reduce it for sure if you run the insert all of the time.

 

[8686]

128 cubic feet of split and stacked wood is a cord.

a 4ft wide x 4ft tall x 8 ft long stack of wood.

My grandpa used to cut his firewood 24", so two rows wide, 4 ft high, 8 ft long was a cord.

I cut my firewood 16" long (when I am get to do the felling and bucking), and so three rows of wood is 4 ft wide.

Another way to estimate a cord (if it is split and neatly stacked):

I used to stack my wood on pallets, two pallets stacked 4 feet high, roughly make a cord (slightly less, but close since pallets are 40" x 48", you are losing 8")

A long bed pickup is a 4ft x 8 ft bed, stacked level full it is about 2 feet deep (half a cord). Anyone who tells you a standard pickup bed can hold a cord (unless they have extended the sides upward) is blowing some serious smoke up your (_|_)

The term face cord is VERY AMBIGUOUS, but when I was growing up, a face cord was 1 row of wood (cut 16"). This equated to 1/3 of a cord.

Anywho.......I hope that helps with the idea of a cord.

So then my delivery of half pickup truck (facecord) for $80 would be on the high side. To be expected tho this time of year i guess. Sorry, i should have said "everyones interpretation of a cord is different", with a cynical tone.

So, how can you tell if it is a true cord when it is being delivered? It doesn't come off the truck stacked in a 4x4x8 pile.

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

When I scrounge and get rounds a full pick up truck is equal to 1/3 cord...... I am sending you what a full 1/3 cord looks like when split and stacked, each split should be 16 in long...

 

[Dix]

I'd go with the insert down stairs. Easy access to outside will make it easy to restock. As said above, schlepping wood upstairs is a PITA.

That open stairway in that split ranch will make a pretty nice convection loop to get the heat moving through the house, a small fan or two should spread it around.

That firewood you are getting at this time of year is primo stuff ( as I know from where it's coming from ). You might want to save it, if you decide to get the insert.

The first year will be rough firewood wise, but once you get going, it'll get easier.If you start now, alot of it should be good to burn next winter (except for denser hardwoods)

As for units and cost, you say you have natural gas? That's a fairly inexpensive heat around here, wayyyy cheaper than oil here on Long Island. If you want to supplement the NG, a smaller insert can do that, but remember that gas furnace is going to kick on during cold nights and days if no one is home to feed it, or you are sleeping.

Just keep working on that wood supply, you wont regret it.

Welcome to the forums !!

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

If your going to get into this you might want to buy like 3 cords and get a better deal on the price.......

 

[BrotherBart]

I merged these two thread on the same subject.

 

[BrotherBart]

A couple of questions I see unanswered scrolling through the thread. May have missed something. Most insert blowers use less than a hundred watts on high. And are worth their weight in gold.

As to burning overnight or when away, most of us light'em in late October and shut'em down in April or May. Run'em around the clock. Takes awhile to get comfortable with it.

But once you realize that an oil furnace combustion chamber can get to 2,600 degrees and you will run your wood stove around five or six hundred degrees it gets easier. Or gets harder to sleep when the furnace is running...

 

[8686]

I have a basic ranch. In the upstairs pics, I'm standing in the entrance to the hallway which leads to the bath room, and three bedrooms. With a stove in the upstairs would the heat extend all the way down there?

So if I get an insert (with a blower) for the FP downstairs, many of you said with a fan I can get the heat up the staircase and into the living room. Are you talking about a regular house fan? Like an oscillating fan? I still see this as a "light it when we are down there" with an added benefit of heat going upstairs.

It doesn't seem practical if we are not going downstairs. It doesn't make sense to get home from work, go downstairs and throw a couple logs in and then spend the rest of the night upstairs. (Leaving it unattended) I guess I have to get over that. The downstairs will be nice and warm while raising the temp upstairs slightly. Am I thinking straight?

 

[8686]

When I scrounge and get rounds a full pick up truck is equal to 1/3 cord...... I am sending you what a full 1/3 cord looks like when split and stacked, each split should be 16 in longView attachment 129081...

Where did you get that rack?

I asked this question in another thread but it wasen't well received. If you stack the wood like a log cabin, leaving space all around each log, do you think it "wood" dry quicker than the way you have it stacked? I'm thinking no since I have been reading that wood dries from the ends of which it was cut. I'm wondering since I have seen many pics with wood stacked like the log cabin, like (broken link removed).

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

I have a basic ranch. In the upstairs pics, I'm standing in the entrance to the hallway which leads to the bath room, and three bedrooms. With a stove in the upstairs would the heat extend all the way down there?

So if I get an insert (with a blower) for the FP downstairs, many of you said with a fan I can get the heat up the staircase and into the living room. Are you talking about a regular house fan? Like an oscillating fan? I still see this as a "light it when we are down there" with an added benefit of heat going upstairs.

It doesn't seem practical if we are not going downstairs. It doesn't make sense to get home from work, go downstairs and throw a couple logs in and then spend the rest of the night upstairs. (Leaving it unattended) I guess I have to get over that. The downstairs will be nice and warm while raising the temp upstairs slightly. Am I thinking straight?

How much heat that will go up there is unknown, there are too many variables that you can't answer yet. So I say don't count on it and if heat goes up there it is bonus..... It sound like you will be running the insert a few hours each time you actually stay downstairs. So in other words I think you are thinking straight