Plate steel vs cast iron vs stone

[BrotherBart]

BB hit on another good point. You can also get some thermal mass from a nearby brick or stone hearth and fireplace.

I still want something like a cat Equinox. Imagine a six hundred pound soapstone cat stove. Good grief! Of course I would have to rent it out as a spare room in the summer. Or use it as a dining table.

 

[begreen]

I've burned all three, and my experience agrees with this chart from Hearthstone:

It is my understanding that plate steel and cast iron are both about 86% heat transfer efficent. The difference in heating qualities between those two materials seem to be mostly about weight and thickness (cast iron stoves tend to be thicker and heavier than plate steel stoves, and the difference is due to the resulting extra thermal mass).

Looks like Hearthstone didn't test the 585# T6 Alderlea. ;-) This seems more of a marketing chart. It would mean a lot more with the specific stoves named that generated these graphs.

 

[Todd]

BB hit on another good point. You can also get some thermal mass from a nearby brick or stone hearth and fireplace.

I still want something like a cat Equinox. Imagine a six hundred pound soapstone cat stove. Good grief! Of course I would have to rent it out as a spare room in the summer. Or use it as a dining table.

I'm with you man.

 

[BJ64]

I've burned all three, and my experience agrees with this chart from Hearthstone:

It is my understanding that plate steel and cast iron are both about 86% heat transfer efficent. The difference in heating qualities between those two materials seem to be mostly about weight and thickness (cast iron stoves tend to be thicker and heavier than plate steel stoves, and the difference is due to the resulting extra thermal mass).

Looks like Hearthstone didn't test the 585# T6 Alderlea. ;-) This seems more of a marketing chart. It would mean a lot more with the specific stoves named that generated these graphs.

So do you think that one graph came from my 44 pound barrel stove?

 

[Heat Miser]

Also, has anyone owned all three, or owned both a metal and stone stove, and, if so, did you notice any major difference in heat retention or transmission between the different materials?

I've owned a cast iron stove and now own a soapstone stove. My cast iron stove was 480lbs. according to the manufacturer specs (Vermont Castings Defiant). My soapstone Mansfield is 550lbs. according to the manufacturer. Both say they have the same size firebox (3.2 cu. ft.).

I agree with the general idea posted in the chart from Hearthstone. The cast iron stove put out heat a little faster (but not much), and was much more intense but also cooled off faster once the fire died down. My soapstone stove puts out a lower intensity heat, but holds heat much longer than my cast iron stove.

For instance, I can put a load of wood in the soapstone stove and come back 20 or so hours later and the stove is still warm to the touch with some embers remaining in the stove ashes. My cast iron stove would be ice cold at that point.

Personally, I don't think I would purchase a steel stove. I've always been fond of the look and feel of cast iron, and employ it in my decor as well as cooking. I am, however, very interested in the soapstone stoves, as they seem to me like they would have the best heat retention of all, and therefore continue to stay warm for quite some time after the stove has burned down to coals. Any insight or discussion on this would be great.

I like the look of the Pacific Energy Alderlea model stoves which are steel. They take the steel construction but wrap it in a nice cast iron exterior. They are supposed to be powerful heaters.

The biggest difference between a soapstone and steel stove is that soapstone stoves tend towards being radiant heaters and steel stoves tend towards being convection heaters. Depending on your house layout or heating needs a convection or radiant style heater may be best.

I will say though that our house is three levels with the stove in the basement (which is our living room). It is also designed with open stairs to allow for wood heat. Even though the soapstone is primarily radiant heat, it does a great job of getting heat up the stairs and heating the rest of our house. The cast iron stove would spike in heat and the cycles of heating/cooling were not as well balanced. It also would cook us out of the living room, sometimes reaching close to 90 degrees but still having the upstairs portion of the house in the low 60's. For whatever reason (slower more controlled heat output?), the soapstone stove allows us to keep the basement and upstairs part of the house within 10 degrees of each other in temperature.

 

[johnnywarm]

whats better to heat the unfinished cellar that will heat the rooms upstairs in a very wide ranch----Soapstone or cast????

 

[VTSR5]

Rick - quit confusing me using sensible logic.

Edit: The OP can't really know what she wants yet, we haven't told her yet :lol:

Is it because I used the word "decor"? 23/M/CT here.

Oh, man, that's beautiful! My first good belly laugh of the day. Your knowledge of frying pans may have something to do with it also.

 

[bokehman]

Something is fishy here. Note that the areas under the curves are not really equal. The soapstone stove seems to have "magically" created energy somehow. Hey, wait a second...somebody get me the White House. I think I have solved the energy crisis!

They don't need to be equal areas; they are just showing temperature. There is not a linear relationship between temperature and radiated energy. At 500ºF radiance of a body with an emissivity of 1 (black body) is 10.2 BTU per square inch. At 900ºF it is 41 BTU per square inch. Stefan–Boltzmann law.

 

[karri0n]

Something is fishy here. Note that the areas under the curves are not really equal. The soapstone stove seems to have "magically" created energy somehow. Hey, wait a second...somebody get me the White House. I think I have solved the energy crisis!

They don't need to be equal areas; they are just showing temperature. There is not a linear relationship between temperature and radiated energy. At 500ºF radiance of a body with an emissivity of 1 (black body) is 10.2 BTU per square inch. At 900ºF it is 41 BTU per square inch. Stefan–Boltzmann law.

OWNED!

 

[VTSR5]

OWNED!

Used to it. *sigh*

 

[struggle]

Also the soapstone never cools off, just runs at 200 forever. I can tell you that the stove can take hours to get from 200 to zero. Tough to eyeball but I agree that the areas should be the same under the curves.

Let's just call it a qualitative graph.

I loaded my Mansfield last night before going to bed and at 10AM today it still had a surface temp of 200 degrees.

As for knocking the soapstone stoves/poking fun at try as hard as you may we have them and you do not :lol:

 

[struggle]

OK OK let me put this in simple terms for those that do not get this how a soapstone stove works.

It is like sex. Steel and Cast Iron stoves are good for about 5 minutes on a good day and a soapstone is good for an hour.

Get it now :ahhh:

 

[fossil]

...As for knocking the soapstone stoves/poking fun at try as hard as you may we have them and you do not :lol:

Highbeam burns a soapstone. I don't think anyone's knocking or poking fun at anyone else's stove, though we are having a bit of fun trying to decipher the Hearthstone graph. Rick

 

[johnnywarm]

As for knocking the soapstone stoves/poking fun at try as hard as you may we have them and you do not :lol:[/quote]


I can buy any stove at any price.i will look into a soapstone stove for my basement, but i'm worried about the reports on here about them cracking.


Have you heard about this??

 

[karri0n]

I'd be worried about the soapstone turning to lava if they made a soapstone cat stove. I saw Dantes' Peak; lava sucks Chances are, I'd also buy it. Lava is cool.

 

[struggle]

It is possible that they will crack and it is likely you can have multiple problems with the cast stoves as well with warping and the sensitive emission parts in the cast stove break as well.

I went from a cast iron VC Vigilant to my current Mansfield and I will never own anything else but a soapstone stove. If it would have a been a good fit I would have bought a Woodstock but the Mansfield was a better fit and it was only a two hour drive away from home to get it.

Hearthstone has available stones for replacement so they are serviceable. I hope to not have worry about it but there comes a time where all stove need to be rebuilt.

There are advantages to models but if you plan on going 24/7 burning the soapstone stoves always seem to come out on top.

 

[johnnywarm]

It is possible that they will crack and it is likely you can have multiple problems with the cast stoves as well with warping and the sensitive emission parts in the cast stove break as well.

I went from a cast iron VC Vigilant to my current Mansfield and I will never own anything else but a soapstone stove. If it would have a been a good fit I would have bought a Woodstock but the Mansfield was a better fit and it was only a two hour drive away from home to get it.

Hearthstone has available stones for replacement so they are serviceable. I hope to not have worry about it but there comes a time where all stove need to be rebuilt.

There are advantages to models but if you plan on going 24/7 burning the soapstone stoves always seem to come out on top.

The mansfield is the one i'm looking at. it looks like a nice stove.the soapstone stoves to me seem as if they are fragile in away.i think once there fired they like to stay put.

If i can ask??? what did you pay for yours?? when did you get it.My dealer is like yours 2 hours away.

Thank you

 

[VTSR5]

...As for knocking the soapstone stoves/poking fun at try as hard as you may we have them and you do not :lol:

Definitely NOT knocking or poking fun at soapstone stoves. My sister runs a Mansfield, so I know it works as advertised. Only having a bit of fun with the Hearthstone Heatlife graph. No egos were harmed in the making of this joke, except mine when I got schooled on thermodynamics! :lol:

 

[struggle]

I bought it 1/12/2007 and it is matt finish grey stones and it was $2,599.14 with tax out the door. I have no idea what they are going for now.

 

[johnnywarm]

I bought it 1/12/2007 and it is matt finish grey stones and it was $2,599.14 with tax out the door. I have no idea what they are going for now.

I would think they are less then they where two months ago.That price is in line with the jotul f600.

I will look into it some more.

Thanks John

 

[Bill]

While digesting the graph, who is exactly running there steel stove at 875*, or cast stove at 725*? If you damper it down, you get a longer more controlled burn, with even heat. My cast stove is humming at 500* and it's 300* in the morning when I get up. Sure I can let it drop to 200* for a lot longer, but why. It's not putting out any real heat. I keep my stove loaded with wood all the time, so it's putting out useful heat around the clock.

 

[johnnywarm]

While digesting the graph, who is exactly running there steel stove at 875*, or cast stove at 725*? If you damper it down, you get a longer more controlled burn, with even heat. My cast stove is humming at 500* and it's 300* in the morning when I get up. Sure I can let it drop to 200* for a lot longer, but why. It's not putting out any real heat. I keep my stove loaded with wood all the time, so it's putting out useful heat around the clock.

I do the same thing.i feel the cast stove is very good at what it does.its not as fragile either.i'm still looking but i love my f400 and i'm sure i will not be disappointed in a f600 in the cellar.I do really like how the soapstones look.

 

[InTheRockies]

I'd be worried about the soapstone turning to lava if they made a soapstone cat stove. I saw Dantes' Peak; lava sucks Chances are, I'd also buy it. Lava is cool.

Hmmmmmmm, aren't the Woodstock soapstone stoves catalytics? I wish Woodstock didn't limit the placement of their side-loading doors to the right-side only. I might consider getting one at some point in the future since catalytic stoves are so much more efficient.

 

[begreen]

I don't know if this will help, but here is a graph of the temps for our PE from last week's readings. The time scale is off, I didn't take readings at exact intervals, but it gives a rough idea of the burn cycles we got that day burning douglas fir.

 

[thebeatlesrgood]

While digesting the graph, who is exactly running there steel stove at 875*, or cast stove at 725*? If you damper it down, you get a longer more controlled burn, with even heat. My cast stove is humming at 500* and it's 300* in the morning when I get up. Sure I can let it drop to 200* for a lot longer, but why. It's not putting out any real heat. I keep my stove loaded with wood all the time, so it's putting out useful heat around the clock.

well said. unless your air control is busted open, nobody is going to shoot their steel stove to 900 and then watch it quickly die down. i have a feeling that the graph has more to do with marketing and less to do with accurately interpreting a real world scenario.

BeGreen has the right idea. i guess the best way to avoid the marketing crap is to test it yourslf. im gunna have to test my englander 30-nc too, that is if it ever gets installed :shut: