New Stove: leak smokes

[bholler]

It’s like 2.5 feet away from the brick wall

Ok what is the roof overhang above it made of? Is the brick wall solid brick or brick over framing?

Regardless of the severe safety issues the setup simply won't work. There is not enough height there to create enough draft to make the system work

 

[Kayrand]

Yes. Temperature differential between inside and outside of chimney is what makes the hotter, lighter than air gasses rise in chimney. This allows higher atmospheric air pressure to PUSH air into stove making it go. The colder outside, the faster gasses rise in chimney. Without a chimney, air won’t go into the box to make it burn.

Rising exhaust in the chimney is measured as draft. That is the engine that makes a stove go. You don't have a chimney, like a car with no engine, so it won't go.

A chimney needs to stay hot inside and cold outside so the gasses rise inside. Chimney pipe is an inner flue pipe with insulation around it to keep it hot, with an outside pipe to hold insulation round inner pipe and keep it dry. It needs to go above the roof, and then some depending on what is close by.

Do you mean I need to build a chiminey around the stove pipe ? Now I have hearth and stove is on it then it’s connected to pipes inside then outside pipe . Do I build brick chiminey around these pipes ?

 

[bholler]

Do you mean I need to build a chiminey around the stove pipe ? Now I have hearth and stove is on it then it’s connected to pipes inside then outside pipe . Do I build brick chiminey around these pipes ?

No you don't need a masonry chimney. You could do that or just use a prefab chimney. But you need some sort of a chimney extending up to 2 feet above anything within 10 feet.

 

[bholler]

Do you mean I need to build a chiminey around the stove pipe ? Now I have hearth and stove is on it then it’s connected to pipes inside then outside pipe . Do I build brick chiminey around these pipes ?

What type of pipe are you using?

 

[Kayrand]

What type of pipe are you using?

I’m using the ones duravent double pipe and duravent double stainless for chiminey. Okay I’ll extend it 3 feet up. I ordered 3 ft and 2 feet in case I need it both. I’ll go do it tomorrow and send you guys picture of set up. Extending the chimibey from 6” to 3 feet 6 “ with cap might better the draft

 

[Kayrand]

What type of pipe are you using?

And thank you all so much for helping me out. This is my first stove and I’m doing it by myself. That’s why I need some help from you guys who know how you do it.

 

[coaly]

And thank you all so much for helping me out. This is my first stove and I’m doing it by myself. That’s why I need some help from you guys who know how you do it.

Sounds like you're going in the right direction. One thing not good is going from a 4 inch outlet stove to a much larger chimney. Where does the 4 inch expand to 6 for chimney pipe?
It needs to be all insulated outside. So the through the wall, or thimble should go directly into double wall insulated outside. They usually have a clean out on the bottom. Always make sure that is closed tight so no cold air can leak into chimney.

When the hot gasses inside flue or pipe are allowed to expand, they cool. The object is keeping the internal flue gas temp above 250* to the top. Otherwise you have condensing of water vapor in the flue, it gets wet, and allows smoke particles to stick forming creosote. 4 inch round to 6 inch round is over twice the square inch diameter increase. This drops temp by more than 1/2. With a small stove it gets more critical since you then need to leave so much heat out to keep it clean, the stove no longer has the capacity to heat the area it's in. Keeping it 4 inch diameter all the way is highly recommended. Probably into making your own insulated pipe at that size.

 

[begreen]

This is definitely a case where a picture or two is worth a thousand words.

 

[Kayrand]

Sounds like you're going in the right direction. One thing not good is going from a 4 inch outlet stove to a much larger chimney. Where does the 4 inch expand to 6 for chimney pipe?
It needs to be all insulated outside. So the through the wall, or thimble should go directly into double wall insulated outside. They usually have a clean out on the bottom. Always make sure that is closed tight so no cold air can leak into chimney.

When the hot gasses inside flue or pipe are allowed to expand, they cool. The object is keeping the internal flue gas temp above 250* to the top. Otherwise you have condensing of water vapor in the flue, it gets wet, and allows smoke particles to stick forming creosote. 4 inch round to 6 inch round is over twice the square inch diameter increase. This drops temp by more than 1/2. With a small stove it gets more critical since you then need to leave so much heat out to keep it clean, the stove no longer has the capacity to heat the area it's in. Keeping it 4 inch diameter all the way is highly recommended. Probably into making your own insulated pipe at that size.

No the inside stove and all pipes and the outside pipes are all 6” wide. There’s no 4” Pipe. I write 4 feet pipe , it’s the length not the width. The width is all 6”.

 

[Kayrand]

And the outside chiminey pipes are all insulated steel pipes. What is the right length for chimney pipe ? I have now all together 3 feet plus 2 feet and 1 feet tee so 6 feet total. Is it enough to rise the hot air up ?

 

[brenndatomu]

Many/most stoves require a 15' chimney, minimum...so it will still leak smoke and not burn very well with 6' IMO.
That's the total height, from the stove, to the top of the chimney...so the height of the indoor stove pipe is included...but, the (2) 90* turns cancel out 2-3' worth of height, each...so in effect, at 6' you are just now at somewhere between net zero a nd +2 ft. in height.
But once you get the chimney right, it still needs to be down to, or below, 40-50* (60* at the most) outside for the chimney to work right.
The chimney makes the draft the runs the stove...the stove is worthless without it...so the chimney has to be right.

 

[coaly]

In your case, 2 feet above anything within 10 feet measured horizontal. If roof is pitched upward, simply measure from outlet, 10 feet sideways. It needs to be 2 feet over that height. When you can measure 10 feet in all directions sideways without hitting anything you're fine.

So a flat roof would be ok to be 2 feet above roof edge. A pitched roof, measure horizontal towards roof, depending on how steep, where the 10 foot horizontal (level) measurement hits roof, it needs to go higher. If the chimney would be on a porch roof, with taller building wall (or another building) within 10 feet, it needs to go 2 feet above that obstruction that is 10 feet to the outlet.

When going through a roof, it also has to be 3 feet above the roof at penetration point (for sparks falling onto roof) which doesn't pertain to your install.

I ask about diameter because this is a 4 inch outlet stove. Somewhere the pipe is going from 4 to 6. That is where the expansion takes place and exhaust gasses cool as they expand into the larger area. Whatever the stove is built with for flue outlet, is the "size" of the stove. The connector pipe and chimney should be this size. Never decrease, that is not allowed by code. An increase of 3 times the size is legal, but not recommended for efficiency and being able to keep clean causing a fire hazard from creosote formation.

 

[brenndatomu]

I ask about diameter because this is a 4 inch outlet stove. Somewhere the pipe is going from 4 to 6.

Ah hah! I missed the fact that this is a mini stove.
If the pipe is 4" ID and class A insulated then it would be 6" OD...maybe that's the confusion?

 

[Kayrand]

In your case, 2 feet above anything within 10 feet measured horizontal. If roof is pitched upward, simply measure from outlet, 10 feet sideways. It needs to be 2 feet over that height. When you can measure 10 feet in all directions sideways without hitting anything you're fine.

So a flat roof would be ok to be 2 feet above roof edge. A pitched roof, measure horizontal towards roof, depending on how steep, where the 10 foot horizontal (level) measurement hits roof, it needs to go higher. If the chimney would be on a porch roof, with taller building wall (or another building) within 10 feet, it needs to go 2 feet above that obstruction that is 10 feet to the outlet.

When going through a roof, it also has to be 3 feet above the roof at penetration point (for sparks falling onto roof) which doesn't pertain to your install.

I ask about diameter because this is a 4 inch outlet stove. Somewhere the pipe is going from 4 to 6. That is where the expansion takes place and exhaust gasses cool as they expand into the larger area. Whatever the stove is built with for flue outlet, is the "size" of the stove. The connector pipe and chimney should be this size. Never decrease, that is not allowed by code. An increase of 3 times the size is legal, but not recommended for efficiency and being able to keep clean causing a fire hazard from creosote formation.

These are my stove picture and current set up. I have to work tomorrow so I’m going to extend the chimney next weekend. It’ll be 15 feet from that tee outside.

Because I have to wait for that roof bracket from homedepot. They don’t have it in stock so it will come like in oct 6. So this weekend I’ll put up half like 7 feet the. Next weekend I’ll do the over the roof next half . Hope this will draw the draft out.

In your case, 2 feet above anything within 10 feet measured horizontal. If roof is pitched upward, simply measure from outlet, 10 feet sideways. It needs to be 2 feet over that height. When you can measure 10 feet in all directions sideways without hitting anything you're fine.

So a flat roof would be ok to be 2 feet above roof edge. A pitched roof, measure horizontal towards roof, depending on how steep, where the 10 foot horizontal (level) measurement hits roof, it needs to go higher. If the chimney would be on a porch roof, with taller building wall (or another building) within 10 feet, it needs to go 2 feet above that obstruction that is 10 feet to the outlet.

When going through a roof, it also has to be 3 feet above the roof at penetration point (for sparks falling onto roof) which doesn't pertain to your install.

I ask about diameter because this is a 4 inch outlet stove. Somewhere the pipe is going from 4 to 6. That is where the expansion takes place and exhaust gasses cool as they expand into the larger area. Whatever the stove is built with for flue outlet, is the "size" of the stove. The connector pipe and chimney should be this size. Never decrease, that is not allowed by code. An increase of 3 times the size is legal, but not recommended for efficiency and being able to keep clean causing a fire hazard from creosote formation.

My stuff at the moment .

 

[Kayrand]

Because I have to wait for that roof bracket from homedepot. They don’t have it in stock so it will come like in oct 6. So this weekend I’ll put up half like 7 feet the. Next weekend I’ll do the over the roof next half . Hope this will draw the draft out.

The stove outlet is 6” wide. It’s not 4” outlet at all.

 

[bholler]

Because I have to wait for that roof bracket from homedepot. They don’t have it in stock so it will come like in oct 6. So this weekend I’ll put up half like 7 feet the. Next weekend I’ll do the over the roof next half . Hope this will draw the draft out.

7' may be enough to make that stove work fine. It should be enough to safely get you above the roof

 

[Kayrand]

In your case, 2 feet above anything within 10 feet measured horizontal. If roof is pitched upward, simply measure from outlet, 10 feet sideways. It needs to be 2 feet over that height. When you can measure 10 feet in all directions sideways without hitting anything you're fine.

So a flat roof would be ok to be 2 feet above roof edge. A pitched roof, measure horizontal towards roof, depending on how steep, where the 10 foot horizontal (level) measurement hits roof, it needs to go higher. If the chimney would be on a porch roof, with taller building wall (or another building) within 10 feet, it needs to go 2 feet above that obstruction that is 10 feet to the outlet.

When going through a roof, it also has to be 3 feet above the roof at penetration point (for sparks falling onto roof) which doesn't pertain to your install.

I ask about diameter because this is a 4 inch outlet stove. Somewhere the pipe is going from 4 to 6. That is where the expansion takes place and exhaust gasses cool as they expand into the larger area. Whatever the stove is built with for flue outlet, is the "size" of the stove. The connector pipe and chimney should be this size. Never decrease, that is not allowed by code. An increase of 3 times the size is legal, but not recommended for efficiency and being able to keep clean causing a fire hazard from creosote formation.

In your case, 2 feet above anything within 10 feet measured horizontal. If roof is pitched upward, simply measure from outlet, 10 feet sideways. It needs to be 2 feet over that height. When you can measure 10 feet in all directions sideways without hitting anything you're fine.

So a flat roof would be ok to be 2 feet above roof edge. A pitched roof, measure horizontal towards roof, depending on how steep, where the 10 foot horizontal (level) measurement hits roof, it needs to go higher. If the chimney would be on a porch roof, with taller building wall (or another building) within 10 feet, it needs to go 2 feet above that obstruction that is 10 feet to the outlet.

When going through a roof, it also has to be 3 feet above the roof at penetration point (for sparks falling onto roof) which doesn't pertain to your install.

I ask about diameter because this is a 4 inch outlet stove. Somewhere the pipe is going from 4 to 6. That is where the expansion takes place and exhaust gasses cool as they expand into the larger area. Whatever the stove is built with for flue outlet, is the "size" of the stove. The connector pipe and chimney should be this size. Never decrease, that is not allowed by code. An increase of 3 times the size is legal, but not recommended for efficiency and being able to keep clean causing a fire hazard from creosote formation.

My stuff at the moment . View attachment 263859 the stove outlet is not 4”. It’s mini stove with 6” outlet.

 

[begreen]

Remove all the metal tape. The adhesive is not rated for flue temps. This is not like a pellet stove, it is not necessary. Once you have a proper chimney you will see a very big difference in stove performance.
15 ft outside sounds excessive for this stove. It has no secondary combustion channel to draw air through. I agree with bholler that 7' should be sufficient. Is 15' the minimum necessary to satisfy the 10-3-2 rule?

 

[coaly]

The stove outlet is 6” wide. It’s not 4” outlet at all.

Your post #3 said it was a 4 inch. I feel better about that.

 

[Kayrand]

Your post #3 said it was a 4 inch. I feel better about that.

No I didn’t say that. It is 6” stove outlet and 6” all the way.

 

[coaly]

I have woodman stove. This one: (broken link removed to https://www.northwoodsfab.com/product-page/copy-of-the-mini-woodsman-stove-with-collar-free-us-shipping)

The only stove in that link is a 4 inch outlet stove.
It is not vented the same as a 6 inch model.
That is the stove I was commenting on.

 

[kennyp2339]

The chimney is one concern, and it seems to be covered, the other concern I have is the hearth the stove is sitting on, I'm not sure what type of stove that is, but no firebrick on the floor of the stove leads me to believe that the bottom side of the stove is uninsulated and may need a thicker hearth to keep heat from transferring through. I'm def not poking an fun at the install or anything, I just want to see a safe install because wood burning is suppose to be fun, relaxing and an enjoyable experience.

 

[bholler]

No I didn’t say that. It is 6” stove outlet and 6” all the way.

At this point it doesn't really matter. You have a 6" stove and are installing a 6" chimney that should be ok. Now just confirm that all clearances and hearth requirements are met and you should be safe once you get the rest of your chimney installed

 

[Kayrand]

At this point it doesn't really matter. You have a 6" stove and are installing a 6" chimney that should be ok. Now just confirm that all clearances and hearth requirements are met and you should be safe once you get the rest of your chimney installed

Okay so I can just go with 11 feet outside , right? Because I think 15 feet is like too tall over the roof and I’m afraid it will shake up with the wind in Montana. We are windy here and cold.

 

[Kayrand]

The chimney is one concern, and it seems to be covered, the other concern I have is the hearth the stove is sitting on, I'm not sure what type of stove that is, but no firebrick on the floor of the stove leads me to believe that the bottom side of the stove is uninsulated and may need a thicker hearth to keep heat from transferring through. I'm def not poking an fun at the install or anything, I just want to see a safe install because wood burning is suppose to be fun, relaxing and an enjoyable experience.

Yes I have stove brick for the inside of the stove coming in next week. Home Depot takes a week To get the order. This is woodland stove from menesota. Hearth is brick that I built it by sticking together.