New Ashford is here & first burn underway

[charger4406]

Charger, you're still using the Jotuls? You've had almost as many stoves as webby

Lol, I have had a few stove's but I started in 1983, the last couple of years
I have sampled a few more than usual.
Me and the wife really like the F600, it's simple and has a beautiful view of the fire,
and it is really radiant, which we like to sit by.
Not sure what I will do with the F100, it is a great little heater.

Thanks for the pictures and info on your new stove!

You are welcome!
My dealer got the stove and fans for just under $3000.

 

[Cynnergy]

Why did you swap out the f100? Just needed more burn time?

 

[alforit]

Pricey bastards...

BBar, .......Let me help you out ....GET THE ASHFORD !!

Your house deserves nice stylish looking stoves. Not Boxy looking ones ............Yeah its a little more money , but you get what you pay for. As my father used to say to me about big purchases, ...."It only hurts once".
Blaze King has been doing cat stoves for a LONG time and they have been refining and perfecting the same technology for decades...............These stoves are tried and true and each new model has more of the technology refined in them........Why do you think so many Alaskan's own one of these.........Huh ? ... Its not because they cant put out the heat and get long burn times.....They can do both. And they do it well.

You are not going to get the burn times from the PH that you are looking for.... ...Especially in your climate and house situation.............Keep in mind the PH and the Cod or any HYBRID for that matter are primarily non-cat burning stoves........I had the PH and I live in Western Washington which is a temperate climate that doesn't get too cold or too hot........My PH gave me 9 hours of burn ...10 tops........And the residual 3 hours of heat from the soapstone is great....BUT , unless your house is highly insulated and its warmer outside you are NOT going to get useable heat from that extra 3 hours of stored heat in the stone...........Don't get me wrong , the PH is an awesome heater but its not a True CAT burning stove.........Again , it burns like a Non-Cat stove.........If I had to break it down in percentages I would say its 80% non-cat and 20% cat.


Allan

 

[webbie]

..My PH gave me 9 hours of burn ...10 tops........And the residual 3 hours of heat from the soapstone is great....BUT , unless your house is highly insulated and its warmer outside you are NOT going to get useable heat from that extra 3 hours of stored heat in the stone...........Don't get me wrong , the PH is an awesome heater but its not a True CAT burning stove.........Again , it burns like a Non-Cat stove.........If I had to break it down in percentages I would say its 80% non-cat and 20% cat.


Allan

I really need something explained to me and perhaps you are just the dude to do it!

OK, so we have two or three stoves - each which we know operate in the real world at a certain efficiency and have a 3 cf usable firebox.
Using our handy calculator, I come up with the following....


So, for this discussion, let's use medium wood and say that all three stoves can produce about 22K BTU's per hour, or about the output of 4 electric plug-in heaters, for 10 hours.

Is your point simply that some stoves are proven (in EPA tests, etc.) to be able to burn longer at a much lower output? In other words, are you saying Stove A may be able to burn 16 hours at 14K per hour, while Stove B simply can't turn down that low? Isn't some of that solvable by balancing the chimney (damper, baro damper, etc.)?

This would be the only possible explanation I see for what seems to be stated above.

 

[alforit]

Is your point simply that some stoves are proven (in EPA tests, etc.) to be able to burn longer at a much lower output? In other words, are you saying Stove A may be able to burn 16 hours at 14K per hour, while Stove B simply can't turn down that low?

Yes...................And the reason for that is that cat stoves in general can burn at a lower temp because the cat lights off at a lower temp than the tubes do in a non-cat.
And the cat eats smoke for food so the wood can smolder like a huge burning cigarette ......That alone slows the burn.

The non-cat , because it requires a high temp to light the tubes , combusts the wood much faster and gives a shorter but hotter burn..............now the interesting part....

With Blaze King you gotta kinda throw out the numbers and stats because they are able to, with the technology they have perfected, to somehow smolder the wood which is regulated by a bi-metallic coil to keep that huge cigarette burning which feeds the cat that heats the exchanger that extracts every ounce of heat and delivers it into the room. I DONT KNOW HOW THEY DO IT......Hah ! But I can tell you that you can put your hand over the flue when the fire is burning and it wont burn your hand..........I have done it......(Don't do this at home...I did it at the dealer ).................Also if you have had any experience with one you will notice that the heat is centered in the cat area of the stove. While the rest of the stove is substantially cooler. Along with the bi-metallic coil that regulates the burn, sets it apart from any other stove ........Including cat stoves.

These are things I have noticed from direct experience..............But Blaze King is the one with the secret to how it is accomplished scientifically.

Direct experience and real world results are the real proof in the pudding.............without that, numbers and figures and stats are just that.



You can't take a non-cat stove and try and slow the burn down by tweaking the chimney or putting damper or baro damper in .......If you do you will just choke the fire out or create a monster that will eventually combust all at once and huff and puff on ya.......The tubes light off at a high temp using FLAMES, which naturally combust the wood faster. If you have a flame show you get a shorter burn....heh...... Only by smoldering the wood can you slow the burn....... Because the cat on a cat stove lights off at a lower temp , you can smolder it TO A POINT............... The BK is able to regulate that smoldering burn like a HUGE CIGARETTE that burns down slowly just like one, using the bi-metallic coil..


The problem with the non-cat stove is that it combusts the wood faster and hotter thus losing ALOT OF HEAT UP THE CHIMNEY. While the cat stove can capture more heat and exchange it in a possibly more efficient way over a longer period of time. So because of this variable alone, it throws all those numbers and stats out the window......And that's just the beginning......You get what I mean ?



Hope that makes sense.........heh


Allan

 

[BrowningBAR]

BBar, .......Let me help you out ....GET THE ASHFORD !!

Your house deserves nice stylish looking stoves. Not Boxy looking ones ............Yeah its a little more money , but you get what you pay for. As my father used to say to me about big purchases, ...."It only hurts once".

Unless you are purchasing two or three stoves, in which case it hurts multiple times.

Let's say the Woodstock steel stove gives me 15-20 hours of usable heat. Seems possible and reasonable based on the fact that it is suppose to be more controlable than the Progress.

Now, let's say the Woodstock steel stove is $2,000. Which seems to be the high end theory on price right now. The Ashford is about $3,400 out the door at this point. For two stoves, the extra cost is $2,800 dollars. That is more than the cost of an additional stove. I could buy THREE Woodstock Steel stoves with $800 left over. Or, I could buy two Woodstock stoves and have $2,800 left over to put towards a pellet add-on boiler.

Blaze King has been doing cat stoves for a LONG time and they have been refining and perfecting the same technology for decades...............These stoves are tried and true and each new model has more of the technology refined in them........Why do you think so many Alaskan's own one of these.........Huh ? ... Its not because they cant put out the heat and get long burn times.....They can do both. And they do it well.

I know what the Blaze King stoves can do. Never doubted them. But, I am not your average stove buyer. One stove will never heat this place. The layout does not allow for it. So, cost is a factor.

You are not going to get the burn times from the PH that you are looking for.... ...Especially in your climate and house situation.............Keep in mind the PH and the Cod or any HYBRID for that matter are primarily non-cat burning stoves........I had the PH and I live in Western Washington which is a temperate climate that doesn't get too cold or too hot........My PH gave me 9 hours of burn ...10 tops........

And there are owners in colder climates getting 15+ hours. Also, you are using soft wood. I'm not defending the Woodstock stove, because I still think that the Progress would have been better as a straight cat stove, but you are also leaving out a lot of information when you make your claims.

And the residual 3 hours of heat from the soapstone is great....BUT , unless your house is highly insulated and its warmer outside you are NOT going to get useable heat from that extra 3 hours of stored heat in the stone...........

I've owned soapstone stove before. If I get a Progress or the Steel stove, it's job is to heat about 700 sq ft of space. Much like how the defiant is doeing right now, except that bastard likes to creep up in temps and can never be locked in at a low temp.

Don't get me wrong , the PH is an awesome heater but its not a True CAT burning stove.........Again , it burns like a Non-Cat stove.........If I had to break it down in percentages I would say its 80% non-cat and 20% cat.

Which is one of the reasons I have not purchased a Progress, yet. The Steel stove has more promise as the air controls seem to allow you to burn at lower heat output than the Progress.

 

[webbie]

Yes................
With Blaze King you gotta kinda throw out the numbers and stats because they are able to, with the technology they have perfected, to somehow smolder the wood which is regulated by a bi-metallic coil to keep that huge cigarette burning which feeds the cat that heats the exchanger that extracts every ounce of heat and delivers it into the room. I DONT KNOW HOW THEY DO IT......Hah !
Direct experience and real world results are the real proof in the pudding.............without that, numbers and figures and stats are just that.

If you have a flame show you get a shorter burn....heh...... Only by smoldering the wood can you slow the burn....... Because the cat on a cat stove lights off at a lower temp , you can smolder it TO A POINT............... The BK is able to regulate that smoldering burn like a HUGE CIGARETTE that burns down slowly just like one, using the bi-metallic coil..

So because of this variable alone, it throws all those numbers and stats out the window......And that's just the beginning......You get what I mean ?

Hope that makes sense.........heh

It makes perfect sense from a magically mystery tour or anti-science perspective, but much less from actual mechanics and physics. But Joe Isusu always knew the benefits of that brand...

Not sure if this is news to you, but the EPA tests require that a stove be proven to burn clean at a lower range. One of the EPA simm runs on the hybrids recently was about 1 3/4 pounds per hour, meaning the 45 lb load we are talking about would burn for 20 hours - and due to high efficiency would put out 13K BTU over that time period. Now, granted, testing is not the real world. But at the same time, your experiences, opinions and magical claims are even further from said world.

There is no "proof" here except science. When I sat on the panel in DC I mentioned that some ads in the early days claimed the Buck Stove (or others) burned 14 hours on two logs and heated your home! They also could cool it in the summer by putting frozen milk jugs inside and turning the fan on. Yes, true!

I know BK makes good stoves. I have seen them at the trade shows since the early 1980's and was really impressed by their fabrication and quality. But you are doing them a disservice to claim they somehow skirt the laws of nature. IMHO, of course.

I'm gonna close this one down because, frankly, it's not the kind of information that I want Hearth.com to provide our visitors...once it's gets into "I say, you say".