Need help to figure out what we need to do.

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I don't mind roof vents on the side of my home; generally better construction than the (often plastic) vents on walls.
But that damper shows that when you use a part for something it wasn't meant for, you need to think carefully.

I hope that's it!
 
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I don't mind roof vents on the side of my home; generally better construction than the (often plastic) vents on walls.
But that damper shows that when you use a part for something it wasn't meant for, you need to think carefully.

I hope that's it!
Yup. We are fine with it being a roof vent. It is metal and seems like ok construction. But you would think they would have taken the damper out.

I hope that's it too. If not then we will have to look into extending the chimney which I would really rather not do.

Thanks for the help. I will report back after we have another fire.
 
Yup. We are fine with it being a roof vent. It is metal and seems like ok construction. But you would think they would have taken the damper out.

I hope that's it too. If not then we will have to look into extending the chimney which I would really rather not do.

Thanks for the help. I will report back after we have another fire.
Well at least no wasps could get into the OAK pipe. I thought to myself from your first pic that your outlet looked a lot like my bathroom fan outlets. Didn't think a damper would be in the way for an inlet. I do still put a slightly finer mesh over the screen to keep the wasps out still, on the bath fan vents and the OAK. They are all on the backside of the house. They will try to build nests anywhere. It could come off in the winter.
 
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Maybe the previous owner failed to mention, Hey you need to prop that damper open in winter if you want to use the stove.
The original Idea could have been that it's used to seal off the oak from bees, bugs etc. in summer?
 
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Well at least no wasps could get into the OAK pipe. I thought to myself from your first pic that your outlet looked a lot like my bathroom fan outlets. Didn't think a damper would be in the way for an inlet. I do still put a slightly finer mesh over the screen to keep the wasps out still, on the bath fan vents and the OAK. They are all on the backside of the house. They will try to build nests anywhere. It could come off in the winter.
It is funny because when we got the exhaust vent off and the pipe was clear I was surprised there wasn’t much in the pipe other than dust. It wasn’t until we saw the damper that I realized why. We are going to put something over the screen that is there when winter is over. I do not want to be dealing with wasps and god knows what else getting into the stove. I go around every spring and summer removing the beginnings of wasp nests.
 
Maybe the previous owner failed to mention, Hey you need to prop that damper open in winter if you want to use the stove.
The original Idea could have been that it's used to seal off the oak from bees, bugs etc. in summer?
We are the only owners. We had the cabin built 7 years ago. We did not know anything about wood stoves. Everything I know now I learned from this website of course after the fact. I wish I would have been more knowledgable before the stove was

We are going to cover the exhaust with something the other times of the year to keep stuff out. I am just going to have to remember to remove it come winter.
 
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Good work on finding that damper and removing it. I'm really interested to hear the results of your next fire. It will be wonderful for you to be able finally to have that stove working as it should, and I'm hopeful that that will be the case.
 
This may not be necessary if you've indeed already solved your problem, but I had been looking earlier for information regarding chimney height at various elevations, and I located it this morning. This is from my Blaze King manual, so not specific to Jotul, but I figure physics is physics, so it probably applies to your stove as well. Since you're at 1700 feet elevation on the side of a mountain with probably at least two thirty degree elbows, it looks like 18.5 feet would be your minimum height. Your initial description made it sound like you were around nineteen feet, so you might be on the border of good draft anyway, and a restriction on incoming air would certainly hamstring the stove. I'm hopeful that you have already taken care of the issue with the removal of that damper, but I thought I'd put this chart in anyway just so that you can verify that you've got the height you need while you're already in troubleshooting mode.

[Hearth.com] Need help to figure out what we need to do.
 
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If that damper was closed or even partially closed that would absolutely cause big problems running your stove. Hopefully you will have an entirely new experience with the f500. It is a great stove.
 
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Instead of using a damper to keep insects out of the OAK, use something like this:
 
Did u guys have a fire tonight?
 
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Well I started a fire yesterday and really didn't notice much difference. I really thought that would fix things. Very frustrating. I never even had to close the air control down. Got barely any secondaries. Started out with 3 small splits, 2 bio bricks, some kindling and a super cedar cut into 4 pieces. Stove top temp from corner reading got to 350 but it took a while to get there but it was from a cold stove. I added a bigger split. Stove top never got above 400 degrees. Maybe I expect too much? I have seen videos of other peoples wood stove fires and they are blazing and got secondaries going like crazy. Now we do get enough heat to heat our main level. We do not use the stove for main heat source but when we light it we keep it going all day until we go to bed and then I let it die out. By the evening the temperature was at 76 degrees and we had to open a window and sliding door. The main level was 67 degrees when I first lit the fire at 11:30am.

Going to test the moisture content of the wood again today. I have some splits from the rack we have been using wood off of that have been sitting in the house for 2 days. I went back through some pictures to see if I could find a date when that wood was split and on the rack. It's been on there since at least May 26th 2021. But I will check some of the pieces anyway to rule that out.

We are also going to be taking the metal exhaust down and just going to get a flat piece of wood with a hole in it and screen it to make sure there is little restrictions. The exhaust is under our deck so we don't have to worry much about rain getting in.
 
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This may not be necessary if you've indeed already solved your problem, but I had been looking earlier for information regarding chimney height at various elevations, and I located it this morning. This is from my Blaze King manual, so not specific to Jotul, but I figure physics is physics, so it probably applies to your stove as well. Since you're at 1700 feet elevation on the side of a mountain with probably at least two thirty degree elbows, it looks like 18.5 feet would be your minimum height. Your initial description made it sound like you were around nineteen feet, so you might be on the border of good draft anyway, and a restriction on incoming air would certainly hamstring the stove. I'm hopeful that you have already taken care of the issue with the removal of that damper, but I thought I'd put this chart in anyway just so that you can verify that you've got the height you need while you're already in troubleshooting mode.

View attachment 335097
Thank you for that chart. I think we are close to the minimum but who knows if the Jotul F500 requires more height than the Blaze King. I am trying to rule everything else out first before going the add more height to the chimney route.
 
Dang! I was really hoping you had it...

Do you have a flue probe thermometer? I was quite pleased with how much one helped me run and shut down better at home when I added it. I wish I could have one in the zc up north.

I don't know what your outside temperature is like right now or what it typically is when you are burning, but even with the easy breathing NC30 at home without the OAK there's a huge difference in draft comparing 35 degrees and 25 degrees.

I wonder if you just haven't been able to get the flue hot enough to pull enough air through the OAK?

If the house isn't tight like you've said... How difficult would it be to remove a section of stovepipe, jack up the stove, remove that crimped connection between the duct coming out of the floor and the stove, set the stove down, and reconnect the stovepipe? Having that gap in there would allow the stove to pull room air and not be fighting the friction of pulling air through the OAK. Might be an option rather than extending the chimney.
 
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Dang! I was really hoping you had it...

Do you have a flue probe thermometer? I was quite pleased with how much one helped me run and shut down better at home when I added it. I wish I could have one in the zc up north.

I don't know what your outside temperature is like right now or what it typically is when you are burning, but even with the easy breathing NC30 at home without the OAK there's a huge difference in draft comparing 35 degrees and 25 degrees.

I wonder if you just haven't been able to get the flue hot enough to pull enough air through the OAK?

If the house isn't tight like you've said... How difficult would it be to remove a section of stovepipe, jack up the stove, remove that crimped connection between the duct coming out of the floor and the stove, set the stove down, and reconnect the stovepipe? Having that gap in there would allow the stove to pull room air and not be fighting the friction of pulling air through the OAK. Might be an option rather than extending the chimney.
It was about 40 when I first started the fire but then it went down into the 30's later on and didn't seem to improve with the lower temps. But the previous days it was in the 30's and down into the 20's.

Removing that piping for OAK that comes into the stove is not going to be easy. Jacking up the stove will be a big issue. The stove is on a raised hearth not just sitting on the floor.

We do not have a flue probe. We have just always gone by stove top temp.
 
Well went and split wood and tried to use the moisture meter and one of the prongs snapped off. So off to look for a new moisture meter.
 
I am talking about closing up the hole in the hearth where the pipe comes up through to connect to the stove not closing up the hole in the actual stove.

View attachment 335011
I see three pieces. The stove conector, a short stub piece and then what goes down through the hearth.
To remove I would take a small dremel cutoff tool and slice vertically down the middle stub piece.

The attack with pliers and tin snips. The stove connector can be pulled out as it’s just held in by bent over tabs.
 
I see three pieces. The stove conector, a short stub piece and then what goes down through the hearth.
To remove I would take a small dremel cutoff tool and slice vertically down the middle stub piece.

The attack with pliers and tin snips. The stove connector can be pulled out as it’s just held in by bent over tabs.
Yes I am sure that would work but if it turns out that isn't the issue I see it being an issue getting it back together and what exactly would we use metal wise?
 
Yes I am sure that would work but if it turns out that isn't the issue I see it being an issue getting it back together and what exactly would we use metal wise?
A short piece of 4” metal duct split length wise two hose clamps and piece of metal tape;) I was MacGyver in a previous life!
 
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I started with just a stove top thermometer. They lag way behind the instant reading of a flue probe. Much happier with the probe and use that exclusively for timing air adjustments and the stove top thermometer is just an extra reference, but many do the same as you with just the stove top. My best draft is between 700 & 750 flue temperature... Lower is a bit weak, higher is a bit strong.

Have you ever checked draft with a manometer?

Any car jack (or 2) might work for jacking up if you can get the stovepipe out or if one of the sections is telescoping. Rolling garage floor jack would probably be best (sits lower). Might be able to do it with some blocking and a 2x4 or 2x6 on edge for a lever.
 
I'm sorry that you didn't have more success, though it does sound as though you had plenty of heat getting into the house. Is it possible that your stovetop thermometer is off? Do you have an infrared temperature gun you could use to measure surface temperatures? I find mine useful for the stovetop but also for double checking my oven or the refrigerator or even air coming out of ceiling vents.

I also noticed that you're using biobricks in your test load. I remember when we bought a load of bricks a number of years ago when I had torn rotator cuffs. They burned fine, but I did not use them to start off in a cold stove. I only loaded them on top of coals, and I mixed them in with cordwood because they weren't as high in BTU's as my oak and beech. I'm not sure how large the firebox of your stove is, but I wonder if you're not getting good secondaries because you're just not filling it full enough to generate the heat at the top that you need.

Since you're also saying that your house is not a tight house by any means, I think you are safe being destructive to the pipe below the stove. You could take a hacksaw and cut through the middle or a drill and drill some holes into it without needing to jack up the stove. I found a thread in the Jotul subforum from November where an owner installed an OAK, had trouble, removed it, and things improved. I'm afraid the thread didn't conclude with any explanation of the restriction, but I thought it might be worth a read for you and for others who are giving advice on this thread to see what they think.

 
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Big bummer!

Not having secondaries and having wood that was in a shed since 2021 with a flue that should be reasonable, and with sufficient air supply (OAK not obstructed and not crazy long), is puzzling.

So another thought I had: are you sure the piping of air to your secondary tubes is free from obstructions? (mfg debris, spider nest etc.)
The holes may be free, but is the full pathway in the stove free? I don't know how long the stove sat after it came from the factory for insects to get in, or that there may be some manufacturing debris in there.

I don't know the best way to check that, but it's worth a thought.
 
I'm sorry that you didn't have more success, though it does sound as though you had plenty of heat getting into the house. Is it possible that your stovetop thermometer is off? Do you have an infrared temperature gun you could use to measure surface temperatures? I find mine useful for the stovetop but also for double checking my oven or the refrigerator or even air coming out of ceiling vents.

I also noticed that you're using biobricks in your test load. I remember when we bought a load of bricks a number of years ago when I had torn rotator cuffs. They burned fine, but I did not use them to start off in a cold stove. I only loaded them on top of coals, and I mixed them in with cordwood because they weren't as high in BTU's as my oak and beech. I'm not sure how large the firebox of your stove is, but I wonder if you're not getting good secondaries because you're just not filling it full enough to generate the heat at the top that you need.

Since you're also saying that your house is not a tight house by any means, I think you are safe being destructive to the pipe below the stove. You could take a hacksaw and cut through the middle or a drill and drill some holes into it without needing to jack up the stove. I found a thread in the Jotul subforum from November where an owner installed an OAK, had trouble, removed it, and things improved. I'm afraid the thread didn't conclude with any explanation of the restriction, but I thought it might be worth a read for you and for others who are giving advice on this thread to see what they think.

I have both a stove top thermometer and IR gun. I use both. I use the stove top thermometer for a quick glance and then use the IR gun when the stove gets hotter.

I didnt always use bio bricks. I started using 2 at start up along with oak splits because I was having problems getting things started.

It is very possible I am not loading it enough for secondaries. I’m gonna check wood moisture again once the new pins come for my meter. You would think after 3 years it should be dry. I will try loading the stove as full as I can get it next time I have a fire. It is going to get in the low 50’s the next few days so no fire.

I will look through that thread about removing the OAK. When I realized we had an OAK I thought it was a good thing. Apparently it may not be. We are going to try the least expensive and least destructive things first and then move on to destructive and expensive. LOL
 
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