Need advice for new install

[Grisu]

I would go out on a limb and venture agues that there are two types of people using old stoves. 1, Those who have had their stoves for a long time and are either experts at using them or have used the same poor burning practices for many years and will never change their ways or 2, someone who is low on cash but needs a way to keep their family warm and has either been given an old stove or bought one for short money. Either way "just a grand" for a new Englander is not in their reality

I would add a 3rd: People who had been with woodstoves in their youth and have no clue that they also (like many other things) have seen significant improvements over time.

I have no problem with 1 and 2 continue using a classic stove but want to avoid that #3 buys one just because they are uninformed. Instead of grumbling about the EPA-stove crowd listing the benefits of a newer stove why not post the advantages of a classic stove and let the user decide which one they rather want to own?

 

[Scols]

In my experience the older stoves throw out more heat, have greater durability and in my opinion are much more pleasing to the eye. If your wood is less than perfect you can still get good heat from a pre EPA stove while the Englander 13 we used in our first winter with a stove usually left us cold due to unseasoned wood. Theres less maintenance with pre EPA stoves when you account for the lack of cats etc.... Instead of trolling for old stove users to convert to EPA's how about using your knowledge to guide those who desire new stoves.

 

[Frank625]

I would go out on a limb and venture agues that there are two types of people using old stoves. 1, Those who have had their stoves for a long time and are either experts at using them or have used the same poor burning practices for many years and will never change their ways or 2, someone who is low on cash but needs a way to keep their family warm and has either been given an old stove or bought one for short money. Either way "just a grand" for a new Englander is not in their reality

I had a high electric bill because of my electric heat. $100 for my stove, refinished it and cleaned it in my shop, $100 for adapters and pipe ( Luckily I already had a double wall insulated stainless steel chimney in place), $100 for tile and concrete board. Free Wood I cut myself, I cut the driest dead stuff on my property that year, now I stock pile. The whole setup paid for itself in the first two months and that was three seasons ago. I'm not interested in spending more money on my stove or going with an EPA stove. It's fine if you want to reduce the smoke you create with an EPA stove, but just think of those hundreds of thousands acres that burn each year in forest fires for the past few thousand years. It is just my opinion and it may not ne so humble, but I think the good you are doing is mostly in your mind. The EPA is another Government Agency mandating more rules and bureaucracy, some beneficial some not. I do believe that if there is any kind of disaster, financial collapse, etc......the guys with the Older Stoves will be able to provide heat for their families and there will be a lot of Cold EPA stoves.

 

[bholler]

Honestly i care about the environment and pollute as little as i can but that has very little to do with my opinion of new versus old stoves. I clean and work on chimneys all day year round and i see the difference in the stacks on both new and old. And there are a few guys that have old stoves that burn really dry wood and their stacks actually look pretty good but most have a decent amount of creosote and with new stoves it is the opposite most are pretty good conditions and a few are nasty. You guys are to focused on rebelling against the epa and are looking past the fact that they are better stoves in just about every way. And by the way the englander 13 nc is a small stove what were you trying to heat with it If the stove is to small all the efficiency in the world wont make it big enough. Again if people are making the informed decision to use old stoves and they are doing it safely and responsibly i am all for it but they should be informed about both sides.

 

[BrotherBart]

I do believe that if there is any kind of disaster, financial collapse, etc......the guys with the Older Stoves will be able to provide heat for their families and there will be a lot of Cold EPA stoves.

I would love to hear the logic behind that one.

 

[bholler]

Yeah bb that doesn't make any sense to me either because honestly if the parts are no longer available you can burn modern stoves without lots of those parts and they will work about the same as the old ones. I know lots of people with older cat stoves that got tired of replacing the cat and just go without it and they burn fine if they have good wood. They are not nearly as efficient as they should be but they heat ok. (i am not recomending burning without all the parts by any means just saying they work ok in a pinch)

 

[Frank625]

I would love to hear the logic behind that one.

You won't have the luxury of burning perfect wood nor the time to prepare it. The old stoves are more versatile...capisce...you understand now brotha

 

[bholler]

You won't have the luxury of burning perfect wood nor the time to prepare it. The old stoves are more versatile...capisce...you understand now brotha

The new stoves will burn on less than perfect wood just like the old ones will. And new stoves use less wood to do the same job so i would think that would be a benefit. And why would it be harder to season wood in the event of a disaster? doesn't really add up if you can still process wood why would it change things any?

 

[BrotherBart]

Burned in the old stoves for 30 years. Wet wood doesn't work any better in them than it does in the newer stoves. And can be burned in either one. I don't care what stove people burn in. But I do care when people speak of that which they do not have experience.

I would like to know what a financial collapse has to do with being ahead on drying wood. Seems to me those with three years worth drying on the stacks would be better off than the guy cutting last Thursday to burn today anyway.

 

[Grisu]

I want to see all those "preppers" trying to cut and split 10 cords for their smokedragons with bow saw and axe because they don't get fuel nor spare parts for their chainsaw and splitter while I feed my EPA-stove happily with some deadfall.

 

[Boomer Sailor]

I'll guess I'll keep my mouth shut about my pellet insert I did have a wood stove before this, but the wife refused... (did I say REFUSED?) to touch it. I work evenings... she works days... I would load the stove before I left - she would come home to a warm cozy house and beautiful fire... I would come home at 1:30am to a cold house... a 175-degree stove.... barely an ember left to light a match from and start the process all over again.

I lost that battle... but I do have a lazy man's 24/7 flame and a 70 degree house when I get home at 1:30. On second thought... maybe I didn't lose!

Sounds like you love the old stove though. Get what makes you happy - stoves can be a bit of work (labor of love) - just stay warm and happy!

 

[begreen]

You won't have the luxury of burning perfect wood nor the time to prepare it. The old stoves are more versatile...capisce...you understand now brotha

I have both old and new stoves. Both burn way better with dry wood. Just why would one not continue the practice of having a generous supply of wood a year or two in advance. Exactly why would one not have this "luxury"? No capisce.

 

[LiamK]

Agreed that not everyone is in a position to buy a new stove. Learning about the old ones helps us.

2, someone who is low on cash but needs a way to keep their family warm and has been given an old stove... "just a grand" for a new Englander is not in their reality

Yep, that'd be me. I got a free wood stove from a guy who was gutting his house. I'm unemployed, in debt, looking for work, and need to heat my house this winter. I do not have $1,000 to spend, period.

I'm trying to learn more about the 1986 Avalon AVB-800 stove that I got for free. Pics, details and questions are posted here: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...b-800-or-av5-800-insert-from-oct-1985.129197/

 

[begreen]

For others following this thread, we have a classics forum for discussions on installing, running, buying and repair old stoves. Note that even if the stove is for free, installing it safely is not usually free.