Just for fun: restarting stove from a coal slivers

[zmender]

The high for today is forecasted to be in the high-50s, so I let the fire die out last night to do clean out the stove this morning. After scooping out all the ashes, I noticed that there were still a few slivers of coal left. I suddenly got a wild hair and decided to see if I can relight the stove with nothing but these few pieces of ember.

Started with a base of crumbled up paper and a thick wad of laundry lint, and I dropped the coal pieces right on there. On top of the coals I built a small lattice of toothpick sized kindling with more crumbled up pieces of paper. The smoke started getting pretty thick, and by 10 minutes mark, the "spontaneous combustion" occurred and in a ball of flame the whole pile caught on. I sprinkled dry pine shaving on top while adding more small tiny faggots. By 20min mark I had a small coal bed and flame was hot enough to light up normal sized kindling. Once those cedar kindling caught on, I was able to add thin + normal sized splits on top.

T-0: Added coal to wad of lint + paper
T-10: Spontaneous combustion
T-20: Normal sized kindling
T-25: Thin splits
T-30: Normal splits

 

[Eman85]

Your merit badge is in the mail

 

[peakbagger]

You had an unfair advantage, a warm chimney which means a good draft. That is trick to starting a fire with coals, they need air.

 

[ctreitzell]

With my wood stove incorrectly installed as it is;
this type re-start from coals is a complete and total recipe for disaster

the learning curve for using a modern, high efficiency wood stove has been a frustrating, smoky affair

I now have a handle on it...but it has taken a lot of mistakes and damage to my wood stove...I'd rather the stove be damaged than a person or creature or the house was harmed
About 2 weeks ago I was experimenting with shutting the air intake down to prolong burn times overnight and throughout midday. (I was i spired by lurking on this forum). I had a week of success and felt pleased that I was getting the hang of it.

Then, one morning, I woke to a cold flue with minus temps outside. I didn't realize the flue was too cold to draw...I opened the air intake, sat down with my cat...started reading a comic on my ipad and suddenly about 5 minutes later the Nest Protect started donging and warned of rising CO levels in the living room. I looked at the Panadero and smoke was pouring in from the air intake!

OH SNAP

I opened the doors and windows and then very stupidly got a handful of split poplar (which I use for cold starts) and chucked it in the stove.
HUGE MISTAKE !
Then I went and got my tools to open the flue access out side (it's right outside the window)...as smoke poured to the room, screwdrivered off the access cap...plugged in the hairdryer...and proceeded to heat the flue...hous billowing with smoke now...panic throughout the house...I got my wife spotting the stove window while I try to heat the flue...it's just taking forever cuz it's -4°C and I have a horizontal run 🤦‍♂️
Eventually flue starts to draw...but no flames...hop in the house, point the hairdryer at the poplar and instant flames

smoke clears...then suddenly it's lunchtime! That was fun! NOT

ugh...couple days later...I try a choked ember restart in the evening...again, HUGE MISTAKE!
Left a lot of choked embers in the stove, tried a cold start procedure and smoked the place out again. Before I could light my lighter, the embers were smoking like a factory.

So, the only way for me to try a choked ember restart is to FIRST heat up the flue with hair dryer; then open the air intake

Frankly, I've been too unconfident to try it...I'd rather scoop out all the choked embers and do a cold start...thing is, by the time I've got the cold start done, there's a raging fire in my ash can

these modern high efficiency stoves require a lot of knowledge and strict procedure! In my case, the horizontal run is a huge problem, but like I've said before...I doubt a correctly installed flue would make that much difference

 

[Jnclem]

I guess I don’t understand the problem here. I’ve started our stove from very small coals many, many times with no problem. I usually don’t, because it’s simply easier to restart with some kindling and paper or pitchwood. But, I’ve had very minimal coals, put some tiny scraps of kindling on it, blow it into flames and build from there, countless times. Even if it's cold outside, there should be some positive pressure unless your house is that cold too. The new stoves are a little different, but still work on the same basic principles as any wood stove. What am I missing.

 

[ctreitzell]

I guess I don’t understand the problem here. I’ve started our stove from very small coals many, many times with no problem. I usually don’t, because it’s simply easier to restart with some kindling and paper or pitchwood. But, I’ve had very minimal coals, put some tiny scraps of kindling on it, blow it into flames and build from there, countless times. Even if it's cold outside, there should be some positive pressure unless your house is that cold too. The new stoves are a little different, but still work on the same basic principles as any wood stove. What am I missing.

are you addressing my comment?

I've described it in detail-
it depends upon the stove and install
as I've stated numerous times my install is not good; I know how to work around it now
I've read online reviews of these Panadero stoves where owners complain of smoking out the house on cold starts...I'll find them and link...

if you try to start or restart a fire in my stove install with a cold flue; you will cerainly fill the house with smoke and set the alarms off...creating a potentially dangerous situation

I haven't used paper to start a fire in a very, very long time...I use wood, typically very dry hardwood and poplar...the poplar burns all by itself once started, hence why matchsticks are poplar I do not like using chemical firestarters and won't use them in the house. I never burn pine or conifer as I mainly have access to hardwoods. I do use shish kebab skewers to start fires in my stove ...I light them by a candle...which would have been lit by a butane power oven lighter or match

 

[zmender]

I think you should get that install checked out sooner than later... I mean CO alarm going off is no joke. I grew up with pot bellied coal stoves and indoor charcoal firepits, being through many fireplaces and stove over years... NOT ONCE I had CO alarm go off nor anyone in my social circle having their CO go off.

While peakbagger called me out for cheating with warm flue, I would gladly repeat experiment again on a cold flue... only difference is that I'll stack up splits so my amber is right under the secondary tubes, not any different from how I'd start a top-down fire.

 

[zmender]

Your merit badge is in the mail

Tough audience.

 

[ctreitzell]

I think you should get that install checked out sooner than later... I mean CO alarm going off is no joke. I grew up with pot bellied coal stoves and indoor charcoal firepits, being through many fireplaces and stove over years... NOT ONCE I had CO alarm go off nor anyone in my social circle having their CO go off.

While peakbagger called me out for cheating with warm flue, I would gladly repeat experiment again on a cold flue... only difference is that I'll stack up splits so my amber is right under the secondary tubes, not any different from how I'd start a top-down fire.

I did the install...who is going to check it?

I'm tellin ya, those services are not readily available here...I'll look into it, but there is a lot of bad flue install happening out here

there was nothing in the air when the alarm was warning of CO...the alarm said it 2 or 3 times and then smoke was billowing out the bottom of the stove...it ain't pipes leaking in the house

I'll keep posting pics once I get it right for this site and the admonitions can launch away!

 

[ctreitzell]

yeah, as my wife just reminded me, when researching local installers, there were literally zero reviews that were not absolutely scathing

round here, do it yourself or get left with a costly, unfinished job site with unusable appliances

 

[Jnclem]

are you addressing my comment?

I've described it in detail-
it depends upon the stove and install
as I've stated numerous times my install is not good; I know how to work around it now
I've read online reviews of these Panadero stoves where owners complain of smoking out the house on cold starts...I'll find them and link...

if you try to start or restart a fire in my stove install with a cold flue; you will cerainly fill the house with smoke and set the alarms off...creating a potentially dangerous situation

I haven't used paper to start a fire in a very, very long time...I use wood, typically very dry hardwood and poplar...the poplar burns all by itself once started, hence why matchsticks are poplar I do not like using chemical firestarters and won't use them in the house. I never burn pine or conifer as I mainly have access to hardwoods. I do use shish kebab skewers to start fires in my stove ...I light them by a candle...which would have been lit by a butane power oven lighter or match

I was, but I found some of your other threads about your stove and installation and realized you are dealing with a very different setup than I am.

 

[zmender]

yeah, as my wife just reminded me, when researching local installers, there were literally zero reviews that were not absolutely scathing

round here, do it yourself or get left with a costly, unfinished job site with unusable appliances

Yikes man. I think it'd be best if you post a schematic of your setup in the hearth room and get folks like @bholler or @begreen to comment. Again having CO alarm for whatever reason is a big deal

 

[ctreitzell]

Yikes man. I think it'd be best if you post a schematic of your setup in the hearth room and get folks like @bholler or @begreen to comment. Again having CO alarm for whatever reason is a big deal

I read up on it on the HETAS site last night. The issue is with "slumbering" an appliance.

You can read that article here:
https://www.hetas.co.uk/consumer/advice-hub/advice-articles/slumbering-your-stove/

I did not know this, now I do. Everyone should know that.

I'm very happy it was not a gas issue and no family member was harmed. My CO alarms were absolutely unburned fuel (wood) drafting back into the house after the flue cooled during the slumbering.

I was slumbering the Panadero for about a week, cuz it was working. With the CO alarms gone off that I had, I have stopped slumbering the stove. What I understand from my research is DEFRA discourages slumbering...and for good reason! I was calling it a "choked ember restart", but is widely known as "slumbering".

I've shared my current flue set up in my intro thread...I seriously doubt we'll change it this season. We plan on starting our rebuild in 2024...that will mean some works to the current main dwelling with top venting a larger firebox stove for the interim...but that won't happen until after winter...I have a lot of roofing to replace and repair and that has to be the priority.

We have new seals coming for the Panadero stove door (current ones are 1 year old and in reasonable state...nevertheless, I won't slumber this stove anymore

 

[Investment Camper]

I always burn a few pages of newspaper before starting a fire to send a blast of heat through the pipe first. But it ain’t -4 here in Maryland either.

 

[ctreitzell]

I always burn a few pages of newspaper before starting a fire to send a blast of heat through the pipe first. But it ain’t -4 here in Maryland either.

well, to clarify, that's -4°C which is around 24°F
at least we can have electricity as compared with the poor folks in the north who got flooded and the electricity has had to be be shut off...we are fortunate here

 

[Caw]

We speak freedom units here my friend 😉

I'm totally just teasing you but in reality most folks here are going to assume F when talking about temps without labels.

 

[ctreitzell]

We speak freedom units here my friend 😉

I'm totally just teasing you but in reality most folks here are going to assume F when talking about temps without labels.

I don't find where I said -4 unlabelled in this thread...maybe been from another thread that @Investment Camper got that? I write a lot...maybe it's earlier

I would keep it all in F yet my mercury is all in C...so I'm converting all the time

we have about a half inch of snow here at the mo...nothing like your photos!

 

[ClintonH]

I don't find where I said -4 unlabelled in this thread...maybe been from another thread that @Investment Camper got that? I write a lot...maybe it's earlier

I would keep it all in F yet my mercury is all in C...so I'm converting all the time

we have about a half inch of snow here at the mo...nothing like your photos!

Hey--if you say it's about 1 cm of snow, +/-, a fair amount will get the idea!