fast splitter.. anyone use this type of splitter?

[JeffT]

The video that was posted was not the best representation of what this splitter can do.I have not used a S.S, but I would think about it if one popped up for a good price.Do a search on you tube and you will find some better vids.
As far as being a two man op that could go for any splitter.Having a splitter that will go vertical is defiantly a bonus for me.

 

[CountryBoy19]

They are expensive because they have a near monopoly on this type of unit. Rack & pinions are not expensive compared to hyd pumps,valves, cylinders, tanks, etc etc, Randy

The rack and pinion isn't the only thing that makes this tick. You have massive fly-wheels that are pretty costly, bearing rollers, also the engagement, disengagement, and return mechanisms etc. I know it doesn't sound like much, but the little things add up. Look at how many bearing rollers there are, at $20 each that adds up. When you compare all of that it comes out more expensive than a hydraulic pump, valve, and cylinder.

Would I use cycle time to determine how long it takes to split the logs? Absolutely not! The reason for this is that I very rarely will use the entire cycle. I can split a lot of wood using only a few inches of travel with the ram, so it takes a very little time to split a log; that is, it will split just as fast as it shows in that video.

But even using just a few inches of travel of the ram this is still faster. But that's only on the easy wood. So on easy wood the split times are maybe a little more equal, but on more difficult wood, where the full stroke would be needed for a hydraulic splitter this will blow it away as far as time goes.

Maybe I'm just too scientific for some people, but when you eliminate all other variables and look at cycle time, the hydraulic splitters are turtles and the SS is a rabbit, even if you're only using a few inches of the stroke.

Then you throw in all the other variables and IMHO, it comes out in a wash. This thing is light and sips gas, OTOH, it won't split the big nasty crotches etc. You gain some, you lose some, but IMHO, the biggest gain is that you can split everything else much, much faster than you can with hydraulics.

Just as a matter of curiosity, what is your average cycle time when splitting your ash? I don't want an estimated, "Oh a few seconds or so", I want to know what it actually is. I'd be interested in comparing it to full-cycle time on this splitter.

 

[gpcollen1]

Don't need to use one myself as I can tell just from watching several videos on this thing that it is not what I want and not what most folks think it is. It will do nicely for some things but not for most wood burners. Also, bear in mind that in the video he probably has someone feeding him his wood. What if he had to get his own? It won't be in the same place all the time then. What about splitting harder to split woods? What about larger logs, etc.? No, I'll stick to the hydraulics.

Many of us just move the splitter over next to the pile of rounds. Nobody has to feed you logs necessarily...

 

[Wallyworld]

I've had one for over 20 years, its split a ton of twisted red oak, maple, beech and whatever else I've burned. It will wear 3 guys out if its good splitiing and they won't keep up with getting and stacking. And I've never broken a hydraulic hose :lol:

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

They are expensive because they have a near monopoly on this type of unit. Rack & pinions are not expensive compared to hyd pumps,valves, cylinders, tanks, etc etc, Randy

The rack and pinion isn't the only thing that makes this tick. You have massive fly-wheels that are pretty costly, bearing rollers, also the engagement, disengagement, and return mechanisms etc. I know it doesn't sound like much, but the little things add up. Look at how many bearing rollers there are, at $20 each that adds up. When you compare all of that it comes out more expensive than a hydraulic pump, valve, and cylinder.

Would I use cycle time to determine how long it takes to split the logs? Absolutely not! The reason for this is that I very rarely will use the entire cycle. I can split a lot of wood using only a few inches of travel with the ram, so it takes a very little time to split a log; that is, it will split just as fast as it shows in that video.

But even using just a few inches of travel of the ram this is still faster. But that's only on the easy wood. So on easy wood the split times are maybe a little more equal, but on more difficult wood, where the full stroke would be needed for a hydraulic splitter this will blow it away as far as time goes.

Maybe I'm just too scientific for some people, but when you eliminate all other variables and look at cycle time, the hydraulic splitters are turtles and the SS is a rabbit, even if you're only using a few inches of the stroke.

Then you throw in all the other variables and IMHO, it comes out in a wash. This thing is light and sips gas, OTOH, it won't split the big nasty crotches etc. You gain some, you lose some, but IMHO, the biggest gain is that you can split everything else much, much faster than you can with hydraulics.

Just as a matter of curiosity, what is your average cycle time when splitting your ash? I don't want an estimated, "Oh a few seconds or so", I want to know what it actually is. I'd be interested in comparing it to full-cycle time on this splitter.

Flywheels are just big chunks of iron machined round, no high tech there or big cost, a rod,a lever, a pawl? no big cost there. I think the SS is a ripoff for what they cost to make. It looks to be a great machine however, Randy

 

[CountryBoy19]

Flywheels are just big chunks of iron machined round, no high tech there or big cost, a rod,a lever, a pawl? no big cost there. I think the SS is a ripoff for what they cost to make. It looks to be a great machine however, Randy

How much do you think the flywheels cost? Have you priced them?

Flywheels aren't as cheap as you think they are. They are large chunks of steel, steel isn't cheap no matter what shape it is or how easy it is to make it. Then add on all the small stuff, and the additional fabrication for the mechanism and voila, you're right up there in expenses.

If these things are so cheap to make then why aren't companies jumping in the market to make huge, sweeping profits off of them?

ETA, isn't it weird how everybody watches a video on these and then becomes an instant expert on them? "No, that can't possibly work as good as the video shows" "Mine will work better, especially if I modify it to work this way" etc etc. Yet every single person that has bought one of these says, "Man they are faster than it looks on video." "Mine even splits twisted tough pieces." Isn't it weird how everybody that has actually used one of these thinks it's a wonderful machine, and everybody that hasn't used one can't possibly believe that it works as advertised? How often do you see these for sale used? I think that by itself is a pretty accurate gauge of how happy the current users are with it's operation.

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

Flywheels are just big chunks of iron machined round, no high tech there or big cost, a rod,a lever, a pawl? no big cost there. I think the SS is a ripoff for what they cost to make. It looks to be a great machine however, Randy

How much do you think the flywheels cost? Have you priced them?

Flywheels aren't as cheap as you think they are. They are large chunks of steel, steel isn't cheap no matter what shape it is or how easy it is to make it. Then add on all the small stuff, and the additional fabrication for the mechanism and voila, you're right up there in expenses.

If these things are so cheap to make then why aren't companies jumping in the market to make huge, sweeping profits off of them?

ETA, isn't it weird how everybody watches a video on these and then becomes an instant expert on them? "No, that can't possibly work as good as the video shows" "Mine will work better, especially if I modify it to work this way" etc etc. Yet every single person that has bought one of these says, "Man they are faster than it looks on video." "Mine even splits twisted tough pieces." Isn't it weird how everybody that has actually used one of these thinks it's a wonderful machine, and everybody that hasn't used one can't possibly believe that it works as advertised? How often do you see these for sale used? I think that by itself is a pretty accurate gauge of how happy the current users are with it's operation.

First of all the flywheels are most likely cast iron not steel & this is easy to machine out of the blanks. Tell you what, you build a hydraulic pump & I'll build a flywheel & we'll see who gets done first. This is not a case of if these splitters work well, they sure seem to, it is about a very good idea that is being exploited IMHO. Why don't other co's step in & make them, one does & its either $1000 or $1500 cheaper, I forget. Because something works well does that mean it is worth any amount of money? Randy

 

[CountryBoy19]

First of all the flywheels are most likely cast iron not steel & this is easy to machine out of the blanks. Tell you what, you build a hydraulic pump & I'll build a flywheel & we'll see who gets done first.

It's pretty laughable if you really think that is a fair and accurate comparison. #1 we're comparing the cost of building an entire splitter, not the cost of an individual part, #2 we're not comparing how cheaply we can make these by building them ourselves.

If you really want to make a comparison, then lets do it. I'll build a hydraulic splitter, and you build one of these. You can fabricate your own parts but you have to track every cost involved, material costs, consumables (welding wire, torch gas etc), electricity, wear and tear on equipment, start-up costs for any equipment you have to buy to make those items. If you already own the the equipment then figure the real value of that equipment as a startup cost. In order to keep the comparison accurate and fair we're going to figure this as you just went out bought it all to start making these. Now, what wages does a fabricator welder make and what is the employer's overhead to employ that person? We can't forget that as an input cost.

Now, are you going to buy/build a big sand-casting operation to cast your flywheels or are you going to buy them? Oh, you thought turning your own flywheels out of stock would be cheaper? How are you going to handle stock that big? How will you cut blanks out of plate steel 3" thick? Oh, so you decided to buy them now? Have you priced them yet?

I know for a fact that I'm going to buy my hydraulic pumps and cylinders. I can certainly make them myself if I had to, but it's much cheaper for me to buy them from a company that mass-produces them. I have a feeling its the same for your flywheels that are "so cheap".

Do you really want to do this? I grew up in a welding/fab shop so I have a pretty good idea what it's gonna take, and I can tell you right now that a splitter like that costs a whole lot more than you expect to build.

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

First of all the flywheels are most likely cast iron not steel & this is easy to machine out of the blanks. Tell you what, you build a hydraulic pump & I'll build a flywheel & we'll see who gets done first.

It's pretty laughable if you really think that is a fair and accurate comparison. #1 we're comparing the cost of building an entire splitter, not the cost of an individual part, #2 we're not comparing how cheaply we can make these by building them ourselves.

If you really want to make a comparison, then lets do it. I'll build a hydraulic splitter, and you build one of these. You can fabricate your own parts but you have to track every cost involved, material costs, consumables (welding wire, torch gas etc), electricity, wear and tear on equipment, start-up costs for any equipment you have to buy to make those items. If you already own the the equipment then figure the real value of that equipment as a startup cost. In order to keep the comparison accurate and fair we're going to figure this as you just went out bought it all to start making these. Now, what wages does a fabricator welder make and what is the employer's overhead to employ that person? We can't forget that as an input cost.

Now, are you going to buy/build a big sand-casting operation to cast your flywheels or are you going to buy them? Oh, you thought turning your own flywheels out of stock would be cheaper? How are you going to handle stock that big? How will you cut blanks out of plate steel 3" thick? Oh, so you decided to buy them now? Have you priced them yet?

I know for a fact that I'm going to buy my hydraulic pumps and cylinders. I can certainly make them myself if I had to, but it's much cheaper for me to buy them from a company that mass-produces them. I have a feeling its the same for your flywheels that are "so cheap".

Do you really want to do this? I grew up in a welding/fab shop so I have a pretty good idea what it's gonna take, and I can tell you right now that a splitter like that costs a whole lot more than you expect to build.

I think you are taking this a little seriously there. Wolf can build one of these around $1000 cheaper. I wonder why Wolfs flywheels are so much cheaper to produce? You can imagine all you want, no harm in that. You are going to have tough time convincing me that the mechanics of a SS costs more to produce than a hydraulic splitter, Randy

 

[Wallyworld]

First of all the flywheels are most likely cast iron not steel & this is easy to machine out of the blanks. Tell you what, you build a hydraulic pump & I'll build a flywheel & we'll see who gets done first.

It's pretty laughable if you really think that is a fair and accurate comparison. #1 we're comparing the cost of building an entire splitter, not the cost of an individual part, #2 we're not comparing how cheaply we can make these by building them ourselves.

If you really want to make a comparison, then lets do it. I'll build a hydraulic splitter, and you build one of these. You can fabricate your own parts but you have to track every cost involved, material costs, consumables (welding wire, torch gas etc), electricity, wear and tear on equipment, start-up costs for any equipment you have to buy to make those items. If you already own the the equipment then figure the real value of that equipment as a startup cost. In order to keep the comparison accurate and fair we're going to figure this as you just went out bought it all to start making these. Now, what wages does a fabricator welder make and what is the employer's overhead to employ that person? We can't forget that as an input cost.

Now, are you going to buy/build a big sand-casting operation to cast your flywheels or are you going to buy them? Oh, you thought turning your own flywheels out of stock would be cheaper? How are you going to handle stock that big? How will you cut blanks out of plate steel 3" thick? Oh, so you decided to buy them now? Have you priced them yet?

I know for a fact that I'm going to buy my hydraulic pumps and cylinders. I can certainly make them myself if I had to, but it's much cheaper for me to buy them from a company that mass-produces them. I have a feeling its the same for your flywheels that are "so cheap".

Do you really want to do this? I grew up in a welding/fab shop so I have a pretty good idea what it's gonna take, and I can tell you right now that a splitter like that costs a whole lot more than you expect to build.

I think you are taking this a little seriously there. Wolf can build one of these around $1000 cheaper. I wonder why Wolfs flywheels are so much cheaper to produce? You can imagine all you want, no harm in that. You are going to have tough time convincing me that the mechanics of a SS costs more to produce than a hydraulic splitter, Randy

LInk to a wolf splitter. They probably get their flywheels for India, almost everything cast now comes from India.

I will say this about SS, I've replaced cam followers under the carriage and replaced the engine(Briggs) in the years I've had mine and thats it.

 

[CountryBoy19]

I think you are taking this a little seriously there. Wolf can build one of these around $1000 cheaper. I wonder why Wolfs flywheels are so much cheaper to produce? You can imagine all you want, no harm in that. You are going to have tough time convincing me that the mechanics of a SS costs more to produce than a hydraulic splitter, Randy

You're the one that wanted to try to compare the costs of producing a single piece of the splitter. I just presented you with the only accurate way to compare production costs.

BTW, you don't really deal with the financial end of any type of production/fabrication work do you? I can tell because you clearly underestimate how much it costs a business to employee a fabricator or welder. The billable rate on our welders and fabricators at work is $100/hr. Put 10 hours into fabrication on a splitter and you're up to $1,000 just in labor costs. There is a lot more on the SS that needs fabricated vs just purchased and welded together.

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

I think you are taking this a little seriously there. Wolf can build one of these around $1000 cheaper. I wonder why Wolfs flywheels are so much cheaper to produce? You can imagine all you want, no harm in that. You are going to have tough time convincing me that the mechanics of a SS costs more to produce than a hydraulic splitter, Randy

You're the one that wanted to try to compare the costs of producing a single piece of the splitter. I just presented you with the only accurate way to compare production costs.

BTW, you don't really deal with the financial end of any type of production/fabrication work do you? I can tell because you clearly underestimate how much it costs a business to employee a fabricator or welder. The billable rate on our welders and fabricators at work is $100/hr. Put 10 hours into fabrication on a splitter and you're up to $1,000 just in labor costs. There is a lot more on the SS that needs fabricated vs just purchased and welded together.

I guess we are getting nowhere fast here CB, I don't want to run afoul of Hearth rules so have a good one, Randy

 

[CountryBoy19]

I guess we are getting nowhere fast here CB, I don't want to run afoul of Hearth rules so have a good one, Randy

Yeah, I quit too once I realize I'm wrong.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Last time I post on this one.

First, I can not give you a time for cycle on our splitter as I have never taken an exact time for any size or any type of split...nor do I care. Speed is not something one should be looking at while doing this sort of work. Furthermore, I split wood only during March and April and this year that may have to take a back seat since I'm recovering from a total hip replacement.

Finally, I hope you have registered with Craig being as how you for sure must be a dealer trying to sell these things. I really can't see anyone else getting so hyper over all the posts and your way of thinking.

Well, you seem to be the only one that knows anything here so the rest of the thread is all yours. Thank you for your time.


Oh, one last thing. That last post of yours being so sarcastic to Singed Eyebrows was totally out of place. That sort of thing is better posted on different boards.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Finally, I hope you have registered with Craig being as how you for sure must be a dealer trying to sell these things. I really can't see anyone else getting so hyper over all the posts and your way of thinking.

Lol, as I said already, I have no connection to this company or these splitters at all; I have zero to gain by supporting them. I actually learned something new about the company today, apparently the owner's name is Craig? I've just seen them work, and they truly are amazing/graceful pieces of machinery. Then, people, that have never run them, and have no idea about how much they cost to produce come along and try to proclaim that they aren't as fast as they look. That's a lie. And that the company is raping people on prices. I don't know anything at all about their exact cost of production, but I can tell you from experience that people are way underestimating the costs here. What is a guy expected to do? Do you expect me to lay over and let the nay-sayers blaspheme a company that isn't here to defend itself? I'll stand up for what I believe in, and I believe these splitters are much better than you're letting on to, and that the company is making much less profit than singed eyebrow claims.

Now, if somebody came along and said, "Yeah, I have one, and it's not all it's cracked up to be" then that person would get a little more credibility. But, do you really expect me to give you credibility when you've admittedly never run one, and you've never even timed your own splitting process, yet you try to claim that it's not any faster? If anybody believed a statement like that with no supporting evidence I'd call them gullible, but if a person believed a statement like that when there is a lot of evidence and first-hand testimonial to the contrary I would call them down right stupid. Sorry if that offends somebody, but that's the truth.

Oh, one last thing. That last post of yours being so sarcastic to Singed Eyebrows was totally out of place. That sort of thing is better posted on different boards.

Lets face it here, it's clear that he was very adamant about his stance. I don't know very many men that are that adamant about their stance and then all of the sudden give up their stance without explanation or reason unless there is one exception. That exception being that they realized they were wrong, but didn't want to openly admit it. I've been around enough forums long enough to know that when somebody is discussing an issue like that, and then all of the sudden leaves the discussion with a cop-out for an excuse, the light-bulb just clicked and they're too ashamed to admit it.

Was I out of line saying that to him? Possibly
Was it the truth? Most likely yes

 

[3fordasho]

I don't have a Super Split but they seem to have their supporters. A couple guys over on AS sure love their SS. I have to wonder why it is that if they're the best thing since sliced bread more manufactures have not gone after this style of splitter? Everyone and their brother makes an hydralic splitter but only one or two make flywheel driven rack/pinion style. The only thing I know for sure is I would have to find one and try it out before investing $2600 into one. Anyone in southern/central Minnesota got one? I've got some elm to try it out with...

 

[Wallyworld]

I don't have a Super Split but they seem to have their supporters. A couple guys over on AS sure love their SS. I have to wonder why it is that if they're the best thing since sliced bread more manufactures have not gone after this style of splitter? Everyone and their brother makes an hydralic splitter but only one or two make flywheel driven rack/pinion style. The only thing I know for sure is I would have to find one and try it out before investing $2600 into one. Anyone in southern/central Minnesota got one? I've got some elm to try it out with...

$2600 or 1000, 1200,whatever a hydraulic unit costs, there is your answer.

 

[richg]

No thanks. At 48 seconds, he struggles with a big round and starts chucking off monster splits. Splitting wood is not a drag race.

 

[mywaynow]

Somewhere there is a database with ratings on splitters; amputation ratings! I am sure this one will make the top ten. CB is definitely selling those things, just read the posts, long winded and continuously defensive. If you want to split small ash or red oak, it may work fine. Just watch your fingers! Any thing big and gnarly and your going to be in trouble. Wouldn't touch the thing!

 

[wellbuilt home]

Imma tell you guys , The SS is veryyyyyyyy fast .
It is a power tool and if you stick your finger in front of the wedge it would drop off , and you will never feel it .
The ss will push any log you could lift thru in 2 seconds.
The wedge is short and if one hand is on the pull handle and the other one is sitting on top of the log it is really very safe .
my sons use it with out a problem .
As far as the money , It is what it is My SS was $2450 door to door , A large commercial splitter cost 5/7000 + .
The wolf looks ok for 1400 i just bought the SS because i would rather get a better splitter then save a few bucks .
Its only money John

 

[JeffT]

No thanks. At 48 seconds, he struggles with a big round and starts chucking off monster splits. Splitting wood is not a drag race.

Yea,that doesn't happen with a hydraulic splitter.

 

[mliiiwit]

My background: I grew up using hydraulic and manual splitting and have researched inertial splitters for about a week now.

My take on hyd. vs. inertial splitters and their proponents / detractors: Read the quotes in BEGREEN's signature. Anyone who has done their research and is still a dedicated detractor of inertial splitters / proponent of hydraulic splitters is either "mediocre-minded", "stupid", "obstinate", some combination of these 3, simply not concerned with speed of doing a task and the expenses of consumables and time spent on maintenance, or simply require some versatility not currently available in inertial splitters, i.e. vertical splitting. If you are none of the above but consider yourself a "hydraulic splitter man", OPEN YOUR MIND and do a bit of research. If you ARE one of the aforementioned, I hope you are of the latter persuasions and I personally have no problem with that as long as you don't off-handedly dismiss obviously better and more efficient means of accomplishing an end. After all, a cruise in a model T or A is inarguably more romantic than one in a Prius. However, I personally would choose the Prius over old technology for use as a tool.

Consider acquisition costs, operating costs and maintenance costs. A new inertial splitter requires additional investment in fuel and possibly engine oil (or maybe an extension cord). A hydraulic splitter requires additional investment in these items and hydraulic fluid. I've read on this site of hundreds of dollars being spent for one fill of hydraulic fluid, which must be replaced periodically for best longevity of the machine. An inertial splitter will occasionally require replacement of a relatively inexpensive wear plate (which could be fabricated by the owner rather than purchased as a ready-made part) and a few bearings which can be purchased after-market at considerable savings. Hydraulic splitters will eventually require replacement of hoses and reseal of valves and cylinders or replacement of those components. Inertial splitters will eventually require replacement of rack gears and pinion shafts, drive belts and rebuild or replacement of centrifugal clutches. All recip engines will require regular maintenance and eventual overhaul or replacement. These expenses are relative to engine size and workload, so are assumably higher on "brute-force" hydraulic machines than on lower-powered inertial machines. All said, I can easily believe that total investment over the life of a machine would be no more than equal to, and probably considerably less, for an inertial splitter vs. a hydraulic splitter. Not to mention the potential time savings to do the same quantity of work.

As I understand current offerings, the currently available inertial splitters are of higher "made and assembled in USA" value than hydraulic splitters. THIS IS IMPORTANT TO ME AS IT SHOULD BE TO ALL U.S. CITIZENS, especially when quality is equal among products. One (reportedly) Chinese-built inertial splitter did come on the market at a significantly lower price, but disappeared in short order due to quality issues (the Speeco inertial splitter sold through TSC).

Considering the simpler mechanical design, I also believe the averagely-inclined individual could build their own inertial splitter much more simply (and cheaper) from salvaged parts than they could a hydraulic splitter by using automotive flywheels, a push lawnmower-sized engine or electric motor, shorter main beam, belts and linkages vs. pumps, valves & hoses, bolt on pillow blocks vs. welded attachments, longer main beam, etc., etc. required for a hydraulic splitter.

I have elected to pay a premium for a US made, somewhat unproven wood burner from a very respected manufacturer to heat my home (Woodstock Progress Hybrid). I also expect to either build my own inertial splitter (in true American spirit) or, at the least, to buy the "best-for-the-money" available US made unit (SS today, IMO) when I am ready to give up on manual splitting, which I don't expect to take long considering I"m approaching 50.

That's my $.02 worth (yeah, I know - I have a lot of that).

RO16

RO16 that I occasionally fire up out back o' my shack (on the patio) - my version of a cruise in a model A
WS PH expected next week - chimney and hearth are ready.
Small supply of seasoned, locally-harvested (my own yard) oak & pecan.
Mac 3200 - easily starts on Stabil-ized gas after 2+ years not running.
Cheapo splitting maul, 5 lb sledge & splitting wedgel & a Fiskars splitting axe for the easier pieces
POS free boxwood that I experiment with out back o' my shack
Impressive (to me) homemade woodgas cookstove of another's design but with my modification.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnqVeaKj23c&feature=related

seems to be splitting the wood up pretty quickly.

I'm faster than that with my ax. Also looks like very easy splitting Wester Red Cedar.

 

[EJL923]

My buddy has one, it is definitely fast. However, it is only as fast as you can work. You can get extremely tired very fast working at that rate. Fatigue leads to injury. Another thing is i have had many times as well as people i am working with where an anvil moving that quick would have taken my hand off. The whole speed and fatigue thing doesnt seem safe to me. Just personal experience with it. My buddy has also complained of wear on the rails.

 

[JeffT]

I've seen lots of vid's on the super split and would love to have one.That said I will cruse along with a hydro. unit until one becomes available in my price range(used or new).