Enviro Windsor, does anyone have a PDF to the original brochure?

[DexterDay]

Make sure you dont exceed 5 ft horizontal. Put at least a 1/4" (1/2" is better, per ft of horizontal) of rise in the vent.

What pellet vent are you buying? Simpson, Selkirk????

I also wonder if that is the best location.. You need a thimble every time you pass through a wall. So 2 thimbles for 2 walls. If you do have about 5' of horizontal, I would definitely put the vertical rise in. 5 ft is a long way to rely on your combustion blower to do the work... Natural draft can be a good friend of pellet stoves.

You got an awesome deal on it. Hope all is well with the "new house" . Looks like a nice place. Hope the family is well and warm. Your gonna love pellets.. I can understand how much you might miss woodburning, but I am sure after 1 season. You will be hooked and NEED both.... Wood and Pellets...

 

[VCBurner]

You may have misunderstood my remark about the rise, it is a very small towards the vent rise that must be in every horizontal pellet vent run. I'll have to look it up it isn't much but under no circumstance should any pellet vent run be level or downhill.

I think the issue the manual was making reference too was back pressure, it can cause two problems overheating the combustion blower and allowing smoke to flow backwards and out the air intake.

I know what you mean by having a rise on the horizontal pipe. As with any wood stove horizontal pipes must be slightly climbing never level. I just don't know how good it is to have a 5'2" h. run though. The manual does not state a maximum horizontal run. The dealer may shed some light on the subject. I also know he may also try to sell me on something, which is always a downside of going to the dealer for advice. Some people are willing to give advice and not try to sell though!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You may have misunderstood my remark about the rise, it is a very small towards the vent rise that must be in every horizontal pellet vent run. I'll have to look it up it isn't much but under no circumstance should any pellet vent run be level or downhill.

I think the issue the manual was making reference too was back pressure, it can cause two problems overheating the combustion blower and allowing smoke to flow backwards and out the air intake.

I know what you mean by having a rise on the horizontal pipe. As with any wood stove horizontal pipes must be slightly climbing never level. I just don't know how good it is to have a 5'2" h. run though. The manual does not state a maximum horizontal run. The dealer may shed some light on the subject. I also know he may also try to sell me on something, which is always a downside of going to the dealer for advice. Some people are willing to give advice and not try to sell though!

A freind is looking for just that information. Must be patient, I wouldn't attempt it with 3" it may work with 4" but I'll wait for an answer. It will be within specification for its EVL but frequently stove manufacturers have issues with horizontal runs.

 

[VCBurner]

How tall is the closet? Could you put the stove in the corner (under the picture in your 3rd pic) and run pipe up the wall and out across the ceiling of the closet? The corner might be a nice spot for the stove and it would get you some vertical rise.

Putting a pipe in the tallest part of the close would surely mean losing some closet space there. By putting it at the lower end of the stairs it would mean less storage space lost. It also means more centered in the room and closer to the center of stairwell opening, which likely translates to better heat transfer to the top floor of the house. We just can't afford to lose any more closet space in the small bedroom. It is the only downstairs bedroom so the wife and I took it and gave the upstairs to the boys. As it is I'm going to make a closet for myself next to the washer and dryer in the downstairs bathroom. It will be good, as I leave the house really early and won't wake her up before going to work looking for my clothes!

 

[VCBurner]

The recommended rise on a horizontal run is 1/4" per foot of pipe.

OK thanks Smokey, I thought I remmenbered that figure. That would translate to a 1-1/4" rise for my situation.

 

[jtakeman]

You may have misunderstood my remark about the rise, it is a very small towards the vent rise that must be in every horizontal pellet vent run. I'll have to look it up it isn't much but under no circumstance should any pellet vent run be level or downhill.

I think the issue the manual was making reference too was back pressure, it can cause two problems overheating the combustion blower and allowing smoke to flow backwards and out the air intake.

I know what you mean by having a rise on the horizontal pipe. As with any wood stove horizontal pipes must be slightly climbing never level. I just don't know how good it is to have a 5'2" h. run though. The manual does not state a maximum horizontal run. The dealer may shed some light on the subject. I also know he may also try to sell me on something, which is always a downside of going to the dealer for advice. Some people are willing to give advice and not try to sell though!

A freind is looking for just that information. Must be patient, I wouldn't attempt it with 3" it may work with 4" but I'll wait for an answer. It will be within specification for its EVL but frequently stove manufacturers have issues with horizontal runs.

I found nothing in "any" on the Enviro manuals for max horizontal run. I thought it was 4 feet???? I have an email in to them.

Is there any max distance in the pipe installation manual?

 

[VCBurner]

Make sure you dont exceed 5 ft horizontal. OK, will do I can shrink the 5'2" to 5' I'm sure. Put at least a 1/4" (1/2" is better, per ft of horizontal) of rise in the vent.
I'll shoot for a 2" rise then this way it'll be better than 1/4" per foot rise.
What pellet vent are you buying? Simpson, Selkirk???? I don't know what kind of pipe I have yet, my father in law is giving me his double wall pipe he recently acquired, he said he has a termination cap, a 36" expandable section?, a 20" section, a 90, and a thimble. I'll have to decide tomorrow if I'll need some more things (another thimble being a great possibility.)

I also wonder if that is the best location.. You need a thimble every time you pass through a wall. So 2 thimbles for 2 walls. If you do have about 5' of horizontal, I would definitely put the vertical rise in. 5 ft is a long way to rely on your combustion blower to do the work... Natural draft can be a good friend of pellet stoves. I may end up picking up a 3' section of double wall to compliment the draft right away depending on what the dealer tells me. In particular the stove itself, it may be one that needs that vertical run outside.

You got an awesome deal on it. I thought so, it sure is a nice looking stove, I hope it works as well as it looks.Hope all is well with the "new house" . Looks like a nice place. Hope the family is well and warm. Thanks DD, they all love the new place, it's going to take some time to get used to the new town for me. But the house is more spacious and a lot more comfortable. I just hope it'll be warm too! :cheese: Your gonna love pellets.. I can understand how much you might miss woodburning, but I am sure after 1 season. You will be hooked and NEED both.... Wood and Pellets...

Thanks for the words DD, I'll have fun learning a new way to be warm and with people such as you and others on this site it'll be an easier learning curve.
Burn on!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You may have misunderstood my remark about the rise, it is a very small towards the vent rise that must be in every horizontal pellet vent run. I'll have to look it up it isn't much but under no circumstance should any pellet vent run be level or downhill.

I think the issue the manual was making reference too was back pressure, it can cause two problems overheating the combustion blower and allowing smoke to flow backwards and out the air intake.

I know what you mean by having a rise on the horizontal pipe. As with any wood stove horizontal pipes must be slightly climbing never level. I just don't know how good it is to have a 5'2" h. run though. The manual does not state a maximum horizontal run. The dealer may shed some light on the subject. I also know he may also try to sell me on something, which is always a downside of going to the dealer for advice. Some people are willing to give advice and not try to sell though!

A freind is looking for just that information. Must be patient, I wouldn't attempt it with 3" it may work with 4" but I'll wait for an answer. It will be within specification for its EVL but frequently stove manufacturers have issues with horizontal runs.

I found nothing in "any" on the Enviro manuals for max horizontal run. I thought it was 4 feet???? I have an email in to them.

Is there any max distance in the pipe installation manual?

None that I've found other than the EVL considerations, it really comes down to what the manufacturer says in order to be code compliant, that is what I'm concerned about, you know doting the i and crossing the t . Hey it takes me a long time to play with things that have fire in them, been around to long not to have a lot of respect for that which can either keep us warm or kill us.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

BTW VCBurner, j-takeman does his homework and knows a more than a little bit about these here pellet eaters.

 

[VCBurner]

I found nothing in "any" on the Enviro manuals for max horizontal run. I thought it was 4 feet???? I have an email in to them.

Is there any max distance in the pipe installation manual?

Thanks J, I'll have to look into the pipe manufacturer's recommendations, the Enviro dealer may also be of some help decifering this riddle. He'll be open again on Wednesday, I'll put off any major decisions until then. If anyone knows for sure please let me know.

Can't wait to get her going though, she looks so cold and dark now! :lol:

 

[VCBurner]

BTW VCBurner, j-takeman does his homework and knows a more than a little bit about these here pellet eaters.

:lol: I tend to take the advice of people such as you and J, who have thousands of posts. You had to do a great deal of reading and writing about these things to get there. Most people around here have shared lots of essential information that I had to soak in the past couple of years. I love this site and respect its members and their opinions. This is a helpfull community!

Thanks again guys!

 

[DexterDay]

BTW VCBurner, j-takeman does his homework and knows a more than a little bit about these here pellet eaters.

Yep... I say 5' max (that is a lot of Manufacturers max) but that Does NOT mean it is the recommendation of Enviro. Jay has an email out, then wait for an answer. He does know more about stoves than almost all of the dealers around me (except one and he knows who he is)


Still a great stove at a great price. You and your family will enjoy for many years.

 

[VCBurner]

BTW VCBurner, j-takeman does his homework and knows a more than a little bit about these here pellet eaters.

Yep... I say 5' max (that is a lot of Manufacturers max) but that Does NOT mean it is the recommendation of Enviro. Jay has an email out, then wait for an answer. He does know more about stoves than almost all of the dealers around me (except one and he knows who he is)


Still a great stove at a great price. You and your family will enjoy for many years.

Thanks again DD,

I'll wait for the reply to J's email, in the meantime I'll try to do a little legwork myself and also get the hearth pad ready. I have another hearth pad but it was one that came with the Defiant Encore and it would be way too big for the windsor. It'll give me something to do so I don't have to sit and stare at the cold stove! :lol:

 

[BrowningBAR]

VC Burner threads are thorough! I'm looking forward to another Dutchwest Diary-Like thread on this thing. Although, I should be upset with him since I never even got a PM tipping me off to the fact that he was selling his Encore...

Looking forward to more posts on the Pellet adventure.

 

[begreen]

Please help with these questions, I want to get it done before the weekend. Cold season is approaching soon, though we've been lucky around here so far.

I've been thinking about this installation. Personally, I don't like the location. It looks wrong and the sofa looks crammed into the corner. Also, it will be too easy for someone on that sofa to inadvertently reach over to a hot stove side or top. Have you considered moving the sofa over to the left so that you could do a corner install? That looks safer and I think the placement would look more visually correct there. Not sure about what venting complications this would present.

 

[BIGISLANDHIKERS]

Ok, so the stove has come home. Thank you to Enviro for the kindness and understanding of my situation. Thanks to those who posted the opinions on this thread helping me to make a decision.
I'm now on the installation stage which I want to complete by the end of the week if possible. My questions are, I have just enough clearance to the sides of the stove to combustibles. There are 8" on both sides but I'm not convinced it'll be enough. Maybe it's just the lack of experience with pellet stoves. Is it ok to put the stove 8" away from a couch? Another question is what to use for air intake pipe. The manual states 2" steel, aluminum or copper may be used. I couldn't find any 2" aluminum flex at a plumbing and heating supplyer. However I may be able to get some 2" electrical metal tubing, which may be the answer, any ideas?

Oh yeah, here are some pics of it on a furniture dolly. I plan on running double wall from the back of the stove into a through the wall thimble and a 12" section outside with a termination cap. Another question is I have to go through a wall under the stairs first, before reaching the outside wall. The picture should explain things better. Can I cut a 6" circle out of the single sheetrock layer and put the double wall pipe through the center of it? The wall is simply a single layer of sheetrock that makes up a closet wall. I understand the section the pipe runs through has tyo be enclosed so the closet will have an additional wall put in as well.

So the pipe going under the stairs will be enclosed? Thats alot of horizontal. Also, seems like it would be alot less work to find a spot on an exterior wall to vent.

BIH

 

[jtakeman]

I found nothing in "any" on the Enviro manuals for max horizontal run. I thought it was 4 feet???? I have an email in to them.

Is there any max distance in the pipe installation manual?

Thanks J, I'll have to look into the pipe manufacturer's recommendations, the Enviro dealer may also be of some help decifering this riddle. He'll be open again on Wednesday, I'll put off any major decisions until then. If anyone knows for sure please let me know.

Can't wait to get her going though, she looks so cold and dark now! :lol:

Chris,

The message I got was anything over 4 feet isn't recommended. 2 feet is the preferred standard with a stove that has 3" outlet dia. The 4 foot would be for something with a 4" pipe dia. The Windsor has a 3" oulet AFAIK. So you would be looking for problems at that length of run.

Personally I would look at the exterior wall even if it has windows. If you terminate(cap/outlet location) 4 feet from the windows you should be good to go. Pipe can run near the windows with no issues, Just can't have the outlet near them. Cost would be more in pipe, But the install would be less trouble some. I would also seal any joints that are near any window for safety sake.

Someone stated you need a thimble at each wall pass thru. 100% correct, You can't just cut the sheet rock and run the pipe thru it. Serious code violation and will not pass inspection. The price for the extra thimble gets you some extra pipe so it seems close to a wash IMHO. I'd also worry that things would get shoved next to the pipe inside the closet. A sure fire hazzard if you didn't box it in!

Keep us posted.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Thanks for running that horizontal run question down Jay.

Now I'm going to ask a question, what is directly above your proposed location (and just so you understand I'm not in any way a fan of holes in a roof etc.. , just covering the bases) ?

 

[VCBurner]

Thank you everyone for the research! Smokey, to answer your question:
Above the location there is a small bedroom, which is my 11 y.o's. room. Running pipe up would mean wholes all over the rental house. Two ceilings a floor and a roof. The room is small as it is and the landlady wouldn't go for that much change made to the house, including a possible chase in that bedroom!

j-takeman, the other exterior wall is the front of the house. It has three windows and a front door as well as baseboard heat running almost the entire length of the wall. As far as the first wall I'm going through I plan on putting a thimble in it as well realizing that a whole probably wouldn't do. The run from the back of the stove to the exterior of the house will be exactly 4'2", I will then add a 90 to that and run 5feet of pipe to the top of it adding to the natural draft of the gasses. As far as the pipe going through the closet, it'll be boxed in. I'm building a knee wall under the stairs to completely block off the lower section of the closet under the stairs. Thanks for the question, BIGISLANDHIKERS. I agree with you BeGreen about the loveseat being too close to the stove. It does not look good esthetically. The manual also states 8" to a combustible "sidewall" not a sofa where a throw pillow can easily fall off and wedge itself agaist a burning stove. So I'm pretty convinced that it would be better to have a small chair there, where if a pillow were to fall it would not hit the stove. I'm thinking a small recliner or rocker/ottoman chair. The recliner I found looks like a wingback chair but is probably too expensive to purchase right now. The rocker is comfortable, cheaper ($139) and an easy to move solution, I could place elsewhere in the home if we were to decide to purchase my recliner later on. Unfortunatelly, the corner install is out of the question due to the closet space it would be killing. I do agree it would be more esthetically pleasing. We were originally set on having the entire wall for the stove, but once the new sofas arived we decided to put one there and it has become a preferred sitting space, so having a chair there would be great. The previous owner also had this stove next to a sofa in his livingroom (look @ original post for a pic of it.)


Thank you all for the insightful advice and research. I knew I could count on folks around here to help me make a good decision. Please fell free to continue the questions and answers on this topic, it'll only help someone in the longrun. I'll include a couple of pics of the outside of the house, I think Smokey had asked about it. The pipe is going to come out about 2'6" above the bottom of the siding and around centered between the basement entrance door and the telephone module (small gray box just to the left of the meter.)

 

[VCBurner]

VC Burner threads are thorough! I'm looking forward to another Dutchwest Diary-Like thread on this thing. Although, I should be upset with him since I never even got a PM tipping me off to the fact that he was selling his Encore...

Looking forward to more posts on the Pellet adventure.

:lol: Oops!
BrowninBAR, I hope this will become another informative thread that will serve as a guide to others looking to install/run the same stove, or like stoves. So to this end I will post all negative/positive results trying to be as unbiased as possible.

As far as the Encore, I never even saw any money for it, brother! :wow: However, my inlaws did buy us a washer and dryer set totalling $1300 in exchange for the stove! My wife does laundry more than ever now :lol: so we here are all winners on this one! The laundry room is right next to the kitchen too, where she tends to spend lots of time making us delicious family dinners! Things seem to really be falling together now, despite the sudden move and all things generated by it!

Take care! Burn on!

 

[jtakeman]

I'd be sure to check the pipe for ash collecting on a regular basis.

 

[VCBurner]

I'd be sure to check the pipe for ash collecting on a regular basis.

Good idea, I had thought about putting an access hatch into the block off wall.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Remember with your proposed venting you'll be both at the EVL limits for 3" pipe (I hope your pipe will be 4") and exceeding the manufacturers maximum recommended horizontal run.

Keep an eye on the burn pot for pile up as well as the horizontal run for ash build up.

 

[BIGISLANDHIKERS]

I'd be sure to check the pipe for ash collecting on a regular basis.

Good idea, I had thought about putting an access hatch into the block off wall.

You will still need a way to clean out the horizontal. ideally this needs to be done without taking the pipe apart.

 

[VCBurner]

Remember with your proposed venting you'll be both at the EVL limits for 3" pipe (I hope your pipe will be 4") and exceeding the manufacturers maximum recommended horizontal run.

Keep an eye on the burn pot for pile up as well as the horizontal run for ash build up.

Ok will do, thanks Smokey! I was supposed to pick up the pipes and hearth materials yesterday, but my father in law ended up working overtime and we could not meet because I had a soccer team to coach at 5pm.
I'll be going to my grandfather in law's house to pick it up today. He lives half way between us. My FIL dropped off the material there after work last night. We are now an hour away from my in laws due to a recent move. They live close to the souther border of Mass and Rhode Island, we live close to the Mass/New Hampshire line.

My wife does not like the idea of a gray stove on a solid gray slate, so we'll pick up a box of tyle to make a hearth.