Disappointing heating bill analysis

[mwatt65]

This is my first season burning with wood, I bought three cords of white oak for under $200 from a guy who sold his house and wanted rid of it, I have used half of it so far this year. My house has never been warmer and I have only used about 170 gallons of oil so far this year! verse $3500 last year (last oil fill was April last year)
I would say I'm in love with burning wood & all the work involved.
Just built a wood shed, now the fun begins seeing how much it holds!

 

[pdxdave]

We've now had enough oil bills this season for me to take a first run at quantifying the effect of our new wood burning fireplace insert (Fireplace Xtrordinair 33 Elite).

During the coldest part of last winter (2012-2013), from December 4 to March 4, we used approximately 456 gallons of oil. During the same period, there were about 3072 heating degree days. So, we got about 6.73 heating degree days per gallon. (I'm focusing on the coldest part of winter since we also use oil for our hot water, so the numbers for other parts of the year aren't directly comparable.) This was also with our thermostats kept relatively low, and after having some insulation work done in the fall of 2012. We have our little kids in the house all day, so significant energy usage is kind of inevitable.

This year, from November 19 through February 18, we used approximately 434 gallons of oil. During the same period, there were about 3485 heating degree days -- a colder winter. This means we got about 8.02 heating degree days per gallon.

Another way to look at it is that, if we had done this winter at the same rate of HDD per gallon as last winter, we would have used 518 gallons so far, as opposed to the 434 gallons we have used. At our latest heating oil prices, those 83 extra gallons would have cost $325.

While I'm happy that our oil bills are lower, the savings are not quite as big as I had been hoping. In fact, once you consider the price of the wood we've been burning, it's probably a wash at best. So, unless the numbers look dramatically different at the end of the heating season, it probably makes the most sense to think of our fireplace as something that enhances the ambiance, keeps the living room toasty, and prepares us for emergencies, rather than something that saves us money on a day-to-day basis.

It's the stove, I pretty much guarantee it. These things are beyond sub-par and I am looking to get out from under it as soon as I can.

 

[woodgeek]

Well, lots of good comments, but to the OP:

I would add that the operator matters. Even if you are buying wood, you should be saving some money. You are saying you offset 80 gallons of oil (about 8-9 million BTU output) with $300 of CSD wood. Let's have some numbers. How many cords did you burn? If you burned 1.5 cords to get 8-9 MBTU, then most of the heat you made went up the flue. A common newb error is to run too much air...nice big bright fire, but half the heat output and burn time you should be getting. Its counterintuitive, but sometimes less air means a lot more heat out.

Even if you are burning in the sweetspot, as others have said, you might be losing a lot of heat out an exterior chimney setup. A lot of new burners post with 'where is all the heat?' and say their stove rooms are barely getting warm from a monster fire. Oftentimes is a hidden install error, bad airsealing of the liner at the top of the chimney, missing block off plate, etc. Did you see the install?

As for your math, obviously if you kept the place 5°F warmer, you should add 5*(#days) to the HDD you used in the calculation. Demand is also somewhat non-linear, colder weather will need more BTUs than suggested by HDD alone, since infiltration losses go like DeltaT^2. Both changes move you to higher savings.

 

[Woodstuck]

I moved into my house in May with electric baseboard for heat. In September I installed my Progress Hybrid and the baseboard breakers have been off ever since. Also lucked out to find a local guy who delivers split oak for $100 a cord with a 10 cord min. The neighbor and I split the cost on 12 cords to supplement the 2-3 cords I already had so I could get a few years ahead. I know I live in a warmer climate then the OP but I cant imagine what my electric bills would have been.

 

[prezes13]

I got all this for $50, I used to burn about 300-350 gal of oil a year this year I burned maybe a 100. I don't run my stove 24/7 yet. Maybe next year. I think it's well worth it to burn wood and see the oil truck drive by.

 

[KB007]

I'd be inclined to try overnight burns to keep the oil from coming on. Ultimately it's about 1/3 of your burn day.

 

[ClassicSWC]

I have a 1,000sf rancher. Gas furnace, stove,dryer water heater. January was an exceptionally cold month for around S.E. Pa. Gas bill was $50, electric bill was $30. This is using the small Nashua. Years ago when I first started burning wood, my gas went from 184 c.u. a month to 18.It's awful nice to be able to gather up the change in the couch to pay the bills when others are into 4 digits for heat.

 

[begreen]

 

[mikey]

We've now had enough oil bills this season for me to take a first run at quantifying the effect of our new wood burning fireplace insert (Fireplace Xtrordinair 33 Elite).

During the coldest part of last winter (2012-2013), from December 4 to March 4, we used approximately 456 gallons of oil. During the same period, there were about 3072 heating degree days. So, we got about 6.73 heating degree days per gallon. (I'm focusing on the coldest part of winter since we also use oil for our hot water, so the numbers for other parts of the year aren't directly comparable.) This was also with our thermostats kept relatively low, and after having some insulation work done in the fall of 2012. We have our little kids in the house all day, so significant energy usage is kind of inevitable.

This year, from November 19 through February 18, we used approximately 434 gallons of oil. During the same period, there were about 3485 heating degree days -- a colder winter. This means we got about 8.02 heating degree days per gallon.

Another way to look at it is that, if we had done this winter at the same rate of HDD per gallon as last winter, we would have used 518 gallons so far, as opposed to the 434 gallons we have used. At our latest heating oil prices, those 83 extra gallons would have cost $325.

While I'm happy that our oil bills are lower, the savings are not quite as big as I had been hoping. In fact, once you consider the price of the wood we've been burning, it's probably a wash at best. So, unless the numbers look dramatically different at the end of the heating season, it probably makes the most sense to think of our fireplace as something that enhances the ambiance, keeps the living room toasty, and prepares us for emergencies, rather than something that saves us money on a day-to-day basis.

 

[johnpma]

Why would you say oil is dirty? Burns cleaner just looking at all three flues--- pellet, wood stove and oil burner. No clean out to do. No ash to vac. No sooty glass ever. You get some water vapor during a burn and that's it. As far as being expensive goes, that is all relative. Move to Europe for a couple years and you'll be coming back screaming for the oil man to filler up to the brim. Everything has it's niche, and some are necessary evils. Consider it cost of existence. Live comfortably and within your tolerance or joy of putting in effort to achieve that.

dirty comparing to natural gas, and burning good seasoned cord wood. Sludge in tank, clogged nozzles, you DO have to clean your oil furnace/boiler, and you pay $3.88/gallon Much rather vacuum ash or run a brush up the pipe than deal with a no heat clogged nozzle situation. Or I guess I could move south and avoid heating all together.

 

[_CY_]

A very useful project this spring would be a proper woodshed. We move our stacks into the woodshed for final drying. That ensures good cover and ventilation and nice dry wood all winter long.This shed holds 6 cords of wood.

View attachment 128105

good looking woodshed ... looks very easy to build. that's exactly what I need.
what's the dimensions? did you build a concrete pad?

to OP .. you need to be more creative with finding free wood. sounds like you are in town like me.

wood is free but labor is not .. best tactic scoring free wood lately has been to keep an eye out for large tree removals closeby. for me typically a 5ft DBH Oak which requires a full crew with serious machinery to handle.

that tree crew is going to be paid for removing that 5ft Oak, including hauling off all the wood. it's going to take min two guys to unload at dump. so they've got costs of two men for several hours + costs to dump wood + mileage on truck/trailer.

here you come along and offer a free dump for all wood a few blocks away saving several very expensive man hours. pro tree crews will typically have front end loaders and brush grinders. so there are no small brush to deal with.

here's the catch .. you must be equipped with pro chainsaws and hydraulic splitter large enough to handle big wood. a chunk of 5ft diameter Oak could weigh 1,000+ lbs. this means you've got to be competent enough to handle big wood with peavey, etc.

if say you've got a Stihl 084 (120cc) MS660 and other like saws. noodling down to easy to handle size is not a big deal. from an investment point of view .. $$$ invested in pro chainsaws are pretty safe. use the crap out of a Stihl MS660 for several years and sell for close to what you've got in it come time to upgrade.

used to hook up with my tree cutting buddy. when he had a large take down for hickory, pecan or oak. I'd show up with my 14k lb trailer .. they would load wood on to trailer. I'd haul wood home.

since I started tactic of offering a free dump for large tree take downs (oak only) closeby. have not hauled any wood for several years. a 5ft DBH oak could contain 3+ cords of the highest quality wood delivered for free.

wood is free but labor is not .. wood remains the one energy source that is not controlled by big business and never will be!

 

[begreen]

There are two 8'x8'x8' bays. I built it on leveling cement pier blocks. Pallets make the "floor".

 

[MikoDel]

I'm assuming you buy your wood. Nothing wrong with that if you must but the real savings in wood burning are if you can harvest your own. Of course even then, there are factors that play into it such as distance traveled, equipment etc.

With the amount of work required to keep ourselves in wood heat, I literally wouldn't even consider doing it if I didn't get free wood. Even before I did tree work, I had a pickup and always found free firewood. I moved into a house w/a wood stove, but if I were paying for firewood, maybe I'd make a fire here and there for Christmas etc., but it wouldn't be a lifestyle. I'd save it for emergencies only. (which we had a few of this winter.)

Lately I've been calling my wife "588" because she complained our PECO bill was $588 in January, even with the stove, and a corner wall fan blowing the heat. I walk around and there's space heaters left on upstairs when no one's there, lights blazing (big wattage), thermostat on 71* all the time even when out all day... I'll shut off lights as I walk around, or call out "Hey 588, you using this heater?" And of course no one's been in the room for an hour.

If I had it my way the T-Stat would stay on *60 night and day, and stuff would be powered down when not used. But I live with strange people who think light switches only go in one direction and the heat will get to 73* faster if you put the thermostat on 78*.

 

[prezes13]

With the amount of work required to keep ourselves in wood heat, I literally wouldn't even consider doing it if I didn't get free wood. Even before I did tree work, I had a pickup and always found free firewood. I moved into a house w/a wood stove, but if I were paying for firewood, maybe I'd make a fire here and there for Christmas etc., but it wouldn't be a lifestyle. I'd save it for emergencies only. (which we had a few of this winter.)

Lately I've been calling my wife "588" because she complained our PECO bill was $588 in January, even with the stove, and a corner wall fan blowing the heat. I walk around and there's space heaters left on upstairs when no one's there, lights blazing (big wattage), thermostat on 71* all the time even when out all day... I'll shut off lights as I walk around, or call out "Hey 588, you using this heater?" And of course no one's been in the room for an hour.

If I had it my way the T-Stat would stay on *60 night and day, and stuff would be powered down when not used. But I live with strange people who think light switches only go in one direction and the heat will get to 73* faster if you put the thermostat on 78*.

Couldn't agree with you more. I got the same thing going at my house, my wife would leave the light on in one room for 20 minutes because she will be back there for 2. It drives me crazy. I ask her if she has stocks in light power company. As far as free wood I know a guy who does tree removal once a year or so he would drop a log truck full. I would give him $50 for fuel.

 

[Ashful]

And I felt like a real man swinging the maul around this fall as we got the wood pile ready.

This fall? That's likely a major factor in your disappointing numbers. You're a numbers guy, so look up the required BTU's to boil off xx lbs. of water, and then crunch those numbers against the cords burned. You'll probably find a large portion of your missing savings.

 

[KB007]

Hmm, I just looked up that model of insert and it says it's a 2.2 cuft firebox. That'll have an effect on your ability to run a good overnight burn. Sounds like a combination of fiebox size, may be some less than seasoned wood that may be causing your grief. It's easier to let your wood season more than to buy a bigger insert, so get working on getting a couple of years ahead on your wood.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

wood remains the one energy source that is not controlled by big business and never will be!

With the superfluous and ever tightening regulations on emissions I'm starting to doubt this. . .

 

[mass_burner]

With the amount of work required to keep ourselves in wood heat, I literally wouldn't even consider doing it if I didn't get free wood. Even before I did tree work, I had a pickup and always found free firewood. I moved into a house w/a wood stove, but if I were paying for firewood, maybe I'd make a fire here and there for Christmas etc., but it wouldn't be a lifestyle. I'd save it for emergencies only. (which we had a few of this winter.)

Lately I've been calling my wife "588" because she complained our PECO bill was $588 in January, even with the stove, and a corner wall fan blowing the heat. I walk around and there's space heaters left on upstairs when no one's there, lights blazing (big wattage), thermostat on 71* all the time even when out all day... I'll shut off lights as I walk around, or call out "Hey 588, you using this heater?" And of course no one's been in the room for an hour.

If I had it my way the T-Stat would stay on *60 night and day, and stuff would be powered down when not used. But I live with strange people who think light switches only go in one direction and the heat will get to 73* faster if you put the thermostat on 78*.

you should put your space heaters on those plug in timers. set it for 1/2 hr before the room is occupied for how ever long the room is occupied. these work well if there is a routine established.

 

[Bobbin]

My suggestion that the old thermostats controlling the 4 zones in our home be replaced with programmable units has received a lukewarm reception. It's disappointing, but I understand! change can be very hard. I came of age in the "energy crisis" and my old man was brutal about turning off lights, turning down the thermostat, etc. (he was also really stupid about things like weather stripping and insulation, lol). I consider myself slightly more evolved; and will take it upon myself to simply change out the old thermostats and learn how to program them (the one in my shop is great). Since we're going to replace the house boiler this spring, it will be the perfect time. And the good man is imminently practical, he will not only recognize the benefit but he'll be thankful he didn't have to "participate".

 

[Charles1981]

my wood cost is 600$ a year for about 5.5 cords. sure it takes me 4-5 long hard days to process it, but even this winter our biggest power bill was 98$. To me the work invested is nominal as it keeps me healthy, and i do go out and process a few trrees a year on property but overall prefer to get log length dumped right next my woodpile. i would be pulling my hair at 588 a month. thats almost what our mortgage is

 

[Dave K]

My suggestion that the old thermostats controlling the 4 zones in our home be replaced with programmable units has received a lukewarm reception. It's disappointing, but I understand! change can be very hard. I came of age in the "energy crisis" and my old man was brutal about turning off lights, turning down the thermostat, etc. (he was also really stupid about things like weather stripping and insulation, lol). I consider myself slightly more evolved; and will take it upon myself to simply change out the old thermostats and learn how to program them (the one in my shop is great). Since we're going to replace the house boiler this spring, it will be the perfect time. And the good man is imminently practical, he will not only recognize the benefit but he'll be thankful he didn't have to "participate".

Changing the thermostat is very simple. I installed a wireless thermostat this fall so (when needed) I can turn the heat on from my smartphone a half hour before we get home. Saves us a lot more $$ than I expected

 

[Bobbin]

I'm still using a "dumb phone" (but given our present place in "evolution" that's OK). I like the idea that we could "set" the thermostat to "stand down" and snap to attention when the zone's room(s) require a "goose" with respect to heat. We have zones that require only maintenance heat and one that could be programmed to "come on" and automatically make the room comfy and reliably return it to the base temperature (the good man is not so good at turning down a thermostat). The good man shrugs this off (prolly because the notion of screwing around with "programming" overwhelms him; I'm good with that). I'm gratified to read that this has provided savings! (thanks Dave K!)