Different burning techniques

[arnermd]

At what cat temp should one start to get concerned?

My warm start yesterday morning burning off the glass, attached. I only add 2-3 splits at a time during the day to try to not over heat the house, but my house temp got into the upper 70s. Had to crack a window!

View attachment 319599

That's the million dollar question.... would love to hear from VC on this....

My alarm setpoint varies as the burn season progresses.... Early on I set it for 1450, then I get annoyed with it going off all the time and I raise it to 1500. After a few nights of it going off at 2am I raise it to 1550 and when cold weather drives me to full loads it ends up at 1600....

 

[Todd]

Found this posted at Midwest Hearth

Temperatures above 1800°F (1000°C) will damage the combustor. Temperatures between 1400° and 1600°F (650-760°C) are common, but operating temperatures between 1000° and 1300°F (537-704°C) are recommended.

 

[arnermd]

Condar has the following statements on their website:

• Catalytic reaction maxes out at about 1300° Fahrenheit through any combustor. Exceeding this temperature is destructive to the combustor and to the components of your stove.
• catalysts best operating temperatures are between 600° and 1500°F (316°-816°C)

I personally do not care if my cat is damaged, its easy to replace and not too expensive. If I have to replace it every year I am OK with that... would rather not but its not a big deal to me.

What I really care about is the refractory, what is the recommended peak/sustained operating temps for it?
Refractory is much harder to replace and much more expensive....

 

[AsylumResident]

Condar has the following statements on their website:

• Catalytic reaction maxes out at about 1300° Fahrenheit through any combustor. Exceeding this temperature is destructive to the combustor and to the components of your stove.
• catalysts best operating temperatures are between 600° and 1500°F (316°-816°C)

I personally do not care if my cat is damaged, its easy to replace and not too expensive. If I have to replace it every year I am OK with that... would rather not but its not a big deal to me.

What I really care about is the refractory, what is the recommended peak/sustained operating temps for it?
Refractory is much harder to replace and much more expensive....

I'm on pins and needles for the answer...

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Doing some of the reading.. my thoughts are the same as I posted.. 1600. someone may prefer a different temperature.. maybe higher.. and for them, thats ok. were all a little different in our thoughts and what is right for us..

 

[Woodsplitter67]

so.. here is my stove..packed tight for the overnight burn.. this wood is sitting on a small bed of coals and cat was 1100 when the air was immediately cut back cat is slowly climbing..

 

[Woodsplitter67]

So at 5am this is what the stove looked like..
Cat at 502 STT at 423.. the bed of coals is half way up the anirons .. it could easily burn a couple more hours.. the glass is somewhat still clean.. it has some streaks to it

 

[AsylumResident]

For you, with the coals up that high, would you be able to load up again and keep burning without an issue? Or do you need to let the coals burn down some first?

I understand you don't have to load up right now because that will keep giving off some good heat for awhile, but inquiring minds and all.

 

[arnermd]

So at 5am this is what the stove looked like..
Cat at 502 STT at 423.. the bed of coals is half way up the anirons .. it could easily burn a couple more hours.. the glass is somewhat still clean.. it has some streaks to it

View attachment 319672 View attachment 319673 View attachment 319674 View attachment 319675 View attachment 319676

Did you happen to notice what the cat temp peaked at?

On my burn last night:
- Loaded 3 med splits, At STT=450 I engaged cat and let it go for a while. Cat only went to 1000 then dropped to 800.
- Spread the coals around evenly and loaded full, engaged cat and set air to 30% right away.
- Cat hung around 1000 for about 2 hours then rose pretty quick to 1600 with no sign of stopping....
- Increased air to 50% and cat immediately came down to 1400. I was happy about that.
- Let it sit for an hour then reduced air back to 30% and cat cruised at 1300-1400 for a few hours.
- At the end it spiked to 1550 but then dropped off.

I think my mistake was on the full load not leaving air high for long enough and I got behind the curve..... I did notice when I threw in the cat the temp hovered around 900- 1000 for 2 hours. On previous good burns it popped right up to 1200+

 

[AsylumResident]

Did you happen to notice what the cat temp peaked at?

On my burn last night:
- Loaded 3 med splits, At STT=450 I engaged cat and let it go for a while. Cat only went to 1000 then dropped to 800.
- Spread the coals around evenly and loaded full, engaged cat and set air to 30% right away.
- Cat hung around 1000 for about 2 hours then rose pretty quick to 1600 with no sign of stopping....
- Increased air to 50% and cat immediately came down to 1400. I was happy about that.
- Let it sit for an hour then reduced air back to 30% and cat cruised at 1300-1400 for a few hours.
- At the end it spiked to 1550 but then dropped off.

I think my mistake was on the full load not leaving air high for long enough and I got behind the curve..... I did notice when I threw in the cat the temp hovered around 900- 1000 for 2 hours. On previous good burns it popped right up to 1200+

What I have found so far, is that if I drop the air immediately like you did during this method, I get the same result as you. Stays low up front for awhile then at about 2 to 2.5 hours the cat jumps a lot.

 

[arnermd]

What I have found so far, is that if I drop the air immediately like you did during this method, I get the same result as you. Stays low up front for awhile then at about 2 to 2.5 hours the cat jumps a lot.

I am very encouraged that our stoves seem to be acting alike..... give me hope and comfort.

You been doing anything with the draft data? I don't use it for much, I check it once a every few weeks or if something seems weird.

 

[AsylumResident]

I am very encouraged that our stoves seem to be acting alike..... give me hope and comfort.

You been doing anything with the draft data? I don't use it for much, I check it once a every few weeks or if something seems weird.

Basically the same, I'll check it periodically. I can usually tell what my draft is based on what my flue temp is. So far it has correlated pretty close. The highest reading I got so far (not trying to out do myself on this variable) was when my stove ran away on me. I was about to start taking splits out and I thought to myself, I'm going to want to know what the draft is right now. That's when it was .15 or .16, I'd have to go back and look at the post when that happened.

 

[JohnDaileyNH]

Basically the same, I'll check it periodically. I can usually tell what my draft is based on what my flue temp is. So far it has correlated pretty close. The highest reading I got so far (not trying to out do myself on this variable) was when my stove ran away on me. I was about to start taking splits out and I thought to myself, I'm going to want to know what the draft is right now. That's when it was .15 or .16, I'd have to go back and look at the post when that happened.

How big are your wood splits? More smaller splits could off gas a lot at once and cause the cat spike. Using bigger splits might improve this

I'm not really surprised your stove and @arnermd see higher STT and cat temps than the Encore. There's more fuel and the same size catalyst.

 

[AsylumResident]

How big are your wood splits? More smaller splits could off gas a lot at once and cause the cat spike. Using bigger splits might improve this

I'm not really surprised your stove and @arnermd see higher STT and cat temps than the Encore. There's more fuel and the same size catalyst.

When I load it up I'm using large splits. Typically 20" long and to load it up good all the way is usually 6 splits with maybe one or two smaller pieces to fill in some gaps.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

For you, with the coals up that high, would you be able to load up again and keep burning without an issue? Or do you need to let the coals burn down some first?

I understand you don't have to load up right now because that will keep giving off some good heat for awhile, but inquiring minds and all.

So this morning I let the coals burn down I opend the bypass and the air.. threw on a couple really small splits and cleaned the glass up.

I threw on a couple small splits and got the temp up catalyst engaged and turned the air all the way off

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Did you happen to notice what the cat temp peaked at?

On my burn last night:
- Loaded 3 med splits, At STT=450 I engaged cat and let it go for a while. Cat only went to 1000 then dropped to 800.
- Spread the coals around evenly and loaded full, engaged cat and set air to 30% right away.
- Cat hung around 1000 for about 2 hours then rose pretty quick to 1600 with no sign of stopping....
- Increased air to 50% and cat immediately came down to 1400. I was happy about that.
- Let it sit for an hour then reduced air back to 30% and cat cruised at 1300-1400 for a few hours.
- At the end it spiked to 1550 but then dropped off.

I think my mistake was on the full load not leaving air high for long enough and I got behind the curve..... I did notice when I threw in the cat the temp hovered around 900- 1000 for 2 hours. On previous good burns it popped right up to 1200+

So after I loaded the stove. I sacked out for a little while.. I woke at 10 and the cat was 1425.. my wife said the like 9.30 the cat peaked at 1597.. once it hit 1597 she said it dropped right down to the 1400s and stayed there.

My stove normally doesn't get this high.. but its really tight right now with the rebuild

 

[Woodsplitter67]

So this season so far I have noticed the following with my stove since my rebuild.

My primary air adjustments are different.

Last year I remember mostly dialing the stove to .. primary air at half way.. 1/3 air created back puffing .. so my air was either half.. a little less then half but not quite 1/3 or totally off

This year it likes half.. and 1/3 and totally off ...weird... 1/3 is giving me a good slow burn with a slight lazy flame

I just did my first overnight burn with a full load and the stove got near 1600.. it didn't hang there but ever since iv switched to the steel cat I haven't seen my stove get that high.

My wife's said how well the stove was running last night.. she said it didn't smell hot.. nor did the thermometer on the stovepipe get into the white.. it stayed in the grey.. 400.. even when the cat spiked. It dropped to the 1400s and stayed there. Around 10.35 she said she sat in front of the stove and watched the secondaries burn for a little while, never a back puff.

Im thinking that if I had the ceramic in I probably would have seen something much higher in cat temperatures.

 

[arnermd]

I have an amazing burn going right now.... I am calling it "The Immaculate Combustion".

• Few coals left from last nights burn, added 3 smaller splits to rebuild the coal base.
• Cat hit 1000, STT=600, Loaded 1/2 load of med splits.
• Left air at 100%, Cat quickly went to 1200. reduced air to 50%, Cat dropped to 1100 then recovered to 1300
• Dropped air to 20% in a couple steps, waiting for cat to recover after each one.
• for 2 hours cat has been oscillating from 1250 - 1350.... perfect. STT=350, flue gas = 570

Happy camper

 

[AsylumResident]

I have an amazing burn going right now.... I am calling it "The Immaculate Combustion".

• Few coals left from last nights burn, added 3 smaller splits to rebuild the coal base.
• Cat hit 1000, STT=600, Loaded 1/2 load of med splits.
• Left air at 100%, Cat quickly went to 1200. reduced air to 50%, Cat dropped to 1100 then recovered to 1300
• Dropped air to 20% in a couple steps, waiting for cat to recover after each one.
• for 2 hours cat has been oscillating from 1250 - 1350.... perfect. STT=350, flue gas = 570

Happy camper

...prove it.

 

[arnermd]

Got 4 hrs of cat time off a 1/2 load..... pretty good. Lots of wood left to start off the overnight load.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Got 4 hrs of cat time off a 1/2 load..... pretty good. Lots of wood left to start off the overnight load.

View attachment 319735

just hitting 1400 looks pretty good..

 

[AsylumResident]

Got 4 hrs of cat time off a 1/2 load..... pretty good. Lots of wood left to start off the overnight load.

View attachment 319735

That's a great burn! I'd take that any day. How did the temperature in the house feel? STT stayed pretty low for awhile.

 

[arnermd]

Can't believe nobody laughed at "the Immaculate combustion" descriptor...... tough crowd, you guys need a better sense of humor. That's comedy gold right there....

 

[AsylumResident]

So this season so far I have noticed the following with my stove since my rebuild.

My primary air adjustments are different.

Last year I remember mostly dialing the stove to .. primary air at half way.. 1/3 air created back puffing .. so my air was either half.. a little less then half but not quite 1/3 or totally off

This year it likes half.. and 1/3 and totally off ...weird... 1/3 is giving me a good slow burn with a slight lazy flame

I just did my first overnight burn with a full load and the stove got near 1600.. it didn't hang there but ever since iv switched to the steel cat I haven't seen my stove get that high.

My wife's said how well the stove was running last night.. she said it didn't smell hot.. nor did the thermometer on the stovepipe get into the white.. it stayed in the grey.. 400.. even when the cat spiked. It dropped to the 1400s and stayed there. Around 10.35 she said she sat in front of the stove and watched the secondaries burn for a little while, never a back puff.

Im thinking that if I had the ceramic in I probably would have seen something much higher in cat temperatures.

Some very good information here for the future. Interesting to see how a rebuild livens things up. How long did you burn before you did the rebuild? Did you do the rebuild because you were having issues or did you just think it was time? Was it a full rebuild or partial?

 

[arnermd]

That's a great burn! I'd take that any day. How did the temperature in the house feel? STT stayed pretty low for awhile.

It was one for the ages..... House was comfortable, my stove is at one end of the house in an addition I built so I struggle to move the heat sometimes. I put a window fan in the wall to move it out of my stove room and that helps. Yesterdays burn was well matched to outside temp so the stove room was ~74 and upstairs bedrooms were 65 - 68.

Not uncommon for my stove room to reach 80 when I have the stove cranking. That a bit much....