As a newbie, I have a question. Please help!

[thsu01]

I have never burned wood before and I have never owned a house before. This is totally new to me to live in western Mass. I just have to learn to deal with it. Hopefully, 10 - 15 cord of wood will suffice. In the coldest time of the year, I am hoping to fire up once a day for evening and night while we are all at work/school during the day time. The capacity of E180 is 14 c.f. and I hope that with 2000 gallons of water storage which will hold up to 800,000-1000,000 btu it will last for 8 hours or longer after the bolier is done firing.

 

[muncybob]

If you plan on using oil and a very seldom basis(like us) and if your existing boiler is reliable...I would skip the WG add on oil unit. My old oil boiler was in very bad shape and I also was limited in space. If I were to do this again I would go electric or propane boiler for back up. Don't know the current pricing but it was not exaclty "cheap" to go with the WG oil add on. We have not used it enough to speak about it's efficiency but in 5 years the oil tank level has not moved much.

 

[thsu01]

@muncybob: I have to have an oil back up, in case I am not around and my wife is still able to turn the thermostat up. According to the Wood Gun people, Bbrning oil in this system will cost four times more in fuel cost. But it is OK.

I wnat to thank you all for giving me priceless input and I have made up my mind to go ahead with this set-up, E180 and 2000 gallons. I am thinking about 25K to 30K. Expensive, but will keep us warm for the next winter and the4 next.

I found a website with good reviews for Wood Gun: http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=41983.0#top.

Anyone has any suggestion about where to get water storage, ASME-certified, reasonable priced? Ahona asks for 3K for 1000 gallon (2X500gallon stacking up) plus shipping.

 

[maple1]

Why does it have to be OIL backup though?

I hope you made the right decision - there seems to be quite a few things brought up by others that weren't addressed.

Good luck - keep us posted.

 

[Fred61]

With cordwood at $250/cord I would consider pellets. They also fit your situation better.

 

[Fred61]

Good luck with your decision. Just know that just about none of the experienced woodburners you asked here agree with your decision.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

3600 s.f. for $10000 in oil seems excessive.

There is a pellet boiler salesman on here that gave me a very quick run down on pellet boiler sizing for my central heating quest. I believe he is in Mass. I received a detailed comparison between all heating fuels. I felt it was a honest evaluation for my needs. I did not feel pressure to purchase, but it certainly was an eye opener. I won't persuade you in your decision, but I would recommend evaluating all your options. If I had to purchase firewood me personally I would consider a pellet boiler for my needs.
I posted a question on heat loss calculation, He responded with his method of sizing. Worth a look-IMHO

 

[thsu01]

@maple1: I have health issues. In case I am gone and no one is handling wood loading, my wife can just switch to oil and continue with her daily life, except paying a bit more in fuel.

@Fred61: I did not see anyone opposing my decision. It's just that they may think that there are better alternatives.This is the reason I came here for advice to see if my set-up is flawed or not.

Thank you so much.

 

[thsu01]

My first choice was Froling P4 fully automatic pellet system, but it did not have ASME stamp. Harman 2600 has been considered too. But given up eventually due to the fact that it's not automatic. Someone has to feed it bag by bag.

 

[thsu01]

Sorry. It's Harman PB105.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

My first choice was Froling P4 fully automatic pellet system, but it did not have ASME stamp. Harman 2600 has been considered too. But given up eventually due to the fact that it's not automatic. Someone has to feed it bag by bag

The Froling is a nice unit. I believe I recall several work arounds discussed on here(in other threads) for the ASME requirement. From what I read of your situation I would vote for a pellet boiler over a wood boiler. I would suggest exploring or posting a question in regards to others who may have installed one recently in your area. The open system mentioned above worked well for several buildings my family had over the years. They where old fossil fuel boilers.
The fuel usage for this past winter would help for sizing also. The contributors here can convert all fuel types to actual BTUs to give you a good baseline.

 

[hobbyheater]

@maple1: I have health issues. In case I am gone and no one is handling wood loading, my wife can just switch to oil and continue with her daily life, except paying a bit more in fuel.
.

I would not be afraid of having your wife operate a wood boiler with storage. Our home was rented out for 17 years and in several cases the lady of the house had more success than her husband.
My wife is just under 5 feet tall and can operate and clean the boiler and chimney , run the wood splitter and at the end of the day can still play the piano .
Have your wife join and I,m sure others will offer her encouragement!

 

[thsu01]

@maple1: Ha Ha. No way she'll load up to 8 to 10 cf of cord wood a day everyday in the coldest winter. She'll just sell the house and move to a warmer place.

 

[thsu01]

@hobbyheater: That is some kind of lady you have there. Amazing!

 

[flyingcow]

Ummmm......handle and store cord wood vs bags of pellets? Same money... no brainer. Good luck with the cord wood. Feeding the fire.... you have no idea. IMO...the WG is s bad choice. Go Garn. You asked and that is a solid recommendation. Listen.....

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

Ummmm......handle and store cord wood vs bags of pellets

If I where in western mass. I would look for bulk delivery. I believe Sandri is the delivery source with NE wood pellets. Maybe worth a call to them also as if they do not install,l I bet they know who would.

 

[Fred61]

Wood Gun claims that E140 or E180 combinational oil backup has an 86% efficiency, very similar to the wood burner which has 85% efficiency

IMHO the efficiency number is flawed when checking the efficiency by conventional means. One entry in the equation is the flue temperature which on the Wood Gun is not accurate because the combustion fan for the wood side runs at the same time as the oil burner cooling the air which registers a lower stack temperature thereby skewing the result.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

Wow just looked at your costs you posted. I think that would not make financial sense for me.

stick wood boiler from the guys at tarm/Froling installed with the adequate sized off the shelf ASME storage is less than that.

Ahona has great storage solution with the tanks they have and could set you up with a Vigas much more reasonable too.

Others here have some systems that work well for them, I just referenced names/brands that have been mentioned in this post.

My other half fills my fisher now and she loves the Froling if we install inside basement. If we install outdoors her opinion for us would be to go with the Garn. She has watched all the youtube videos and felt that starting new fires would not be a problem for her since many times Granpa is out when she returns home. She would however love to fill a boiler in the basement than trudge outside!

So we stocked up on wood early so when we pull the trigger we will be good to go. green wood is cheapest by the log truck load. but takes time to process. green CS and delivered is a good value. There are several companies that sell kiln dried wood CS and delivered at higher cost but would be a benefit to you to get started. If I where buying green now it would be next years wood or the year after depending on species. Lot to learn and its all on the Hearth!
Would be an awful shame to use the oil at all with the investment you will be making. I would suggest looking at ease of operation as a key decision factor. When you do bills your wife maybe more inclined to start a fire if its set up well.

 

[maple1]

I don't think I could justify doing what you're going to do, with health issues added in too. Even if this coming winter turns out to be good in that respect, I have a feeling it won't be a good experience dealing with a huge amount of wood that isn't ready to burn - you're almost behind an 8 ball before you even start. I think I would fully investigate a good pellet boiler (windhager being the first to mind) operating as an open unit - or at the dollars you're talking, maybe even geothermal.

 

[thsu01]

@NE WOOD BURNER: Just checked their website. i don't think that VIGAS is ASME certified. I will look harder for other options. ASME certification must have been extremely expensive to obtain. Not many european units carry ASME.

 

[muncybob]

Good luck with your choice. No matter what unit you decide on there will be a learning curve but there are plenty of folk here that own whatever unit you decide on to help you out.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

@NE WOOD BURNER: Just checked their website. i don't think that VIGAS is ASME certified. I will look harder for other options. ASME certification must have been extremely expensive to obtain. Not many european units carry ASME.

ASME does add to the costs of any product. There are other boilers that are ASME if your forced to go that route. I know this ASME conversation was hashed out here maybe last fall.
Clarification from your area would be helpful: 1: boiler ASME required? 2.) thermal storage ASME required.

The open system is a great way to get the desired system @ the best cost. Or just install a Garn 2000. My only reservation with a garn for your application is that If your wife is quick to crank tstat to recover the desired temp. your savings may not exist. A boiler with divorced storage can be plumbed to feed house first then storage(quicker house temp recovery).
The Wood gun appealed to me early on for ease of fire starting and the ability to run without storage.

I am curious as to how many tons of pellets and how many gallons of oil you used this past season.
I heat almost 3000s.f used oil this year and not at half of your projection for oil consumption. first time using oil for whole season. most I think I ever put through grandpa was 8 cords in a year. when my children where home with Mom. solely heating with wood.

 

[JP11]

You don't own a woodlot... go pellets.

the amount of money you are talking for ASME makes it foolish money.

Biowin. No storage, do a bulk storage for pellets.

You'll be cheaper, use less floor space, and not FILL the yard with a 3 year supply of split firewood.

This plan you have is BAD! many people are telling you to reconsider. Even if you go cordwood boiler, others have said on here there are better options than what you said you've decided.

JP

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

JP11:
Vigas 60 / 1000 gal storage
Heating 6k sf radiant and 80gal DHW tank.

How many Cords did you burn this past season?

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

found it! https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/asme-certified-indoor-wood-boilers.105816/