Ariens rideon lawnmower - any experiences??

[AK13]

The gear models have a clutch and a gear shifter lever. Selecting gears isn't an H-pattern but just a slide. There are 6 forward gears, all the way back is top speed and all the way forward is reverse with a neutral in the middle. The clutch is also the brake pedal just like a bulldozer. You push it down a little for clutch and all the way down to hit the brake. Your right foot does nothing.

Interesting. I guess I'd better take it for a test drive before setting my sites on it. I like the low cost and better reliability. But the only riding mowers that I've used have all been hydrostatic.

 

[Highbeam]

Interesting. I guess I'd better take it for a test drive before setting my sites on it. I like the low cost and better reliability. But the only riding mowers that I've used have all been hydrostatic.

As a tractor guy I have had to make a much tougher decision regarding hst or gear transmissions. On tractors the HST is every bit as robust as a gear drive and the HST is extremely useful for precision work like aligning with rear attached equipment. On mowers the HST is boring as heck and I don't see the benefit of HST on a mower with such high HP. Infinite speed adjustment, okay, but there are 6 gears and I have no problem finding one to match the conditions.

If you've driven a stickshift car you know that operating a stick shift becomes second nature after a short time and fairly effortless. On the mower, the revs are set so you just slip the clutch to take off. It's pretty easy. I've had HST trannies fail on my last JD riding mower. They puke fluid, get hot, slip, lose power, etc. but most importantly they aren't worth fixing so you trash the machine. The clutch on a mower is just the belt, when you slip the clutch you are just slipping the loose belt on the pulleys. Really nothing to wear out. I've never heard of a trans failure, you always hear about HST failures.

Oh and mechanical blade engagement is much cheaper than replacing the electronic blade clutch needed with push button blade engagement. 150$ when that fails. 15% of the purchase price!

 

[Ashful]

Thanks. I will have to check it out. The Ariens website says its a Kohler engine but HD clearly says its a Briggs. It must be a popular model to have 748 reviews. I don't quite understand the gear drive vs. hydrostatic. Does that mean that it has a clutch? I'd be just as happy with a Craftsman, but the orange is a little nicer than the grey

All my cars are manual trans, but all my tractors are hydro. If you're primarily using this machine to pull a spreader, where you need to calibrate spread rate to a fixed ground speed, then gear drive is for you. For practically all other lawn / garden / utility tractor purposes, hydrostatic is vastly superior. I could not even imagine moving snow or mowing with a gear drive, anymore.

Unlike Highbeam, I've never experienced a hydro failure, but I don't buy junk equipment from Lowes Depot, either. My Cub Cadet was 51 years old when I sold it, had probably 2000 hours on it, and still going strong with the original hydro trans. I replaced the control linkage (was getting sloppy), and the original cork hydro-axle seal (was starting to drip), but all else was 100% original. Same with my 1986 Deere, at 900+ hours.

 

[Ashful]

We have a couple things going on, some cheezy rules used to determine HP and also some misunderstanding of what HP is and whether or not it matters much for a working engine. The manufacturers have been trying to use torque instead of HP for awhile now but we consumers demand to know the HP.

HP is still a valid figure of merit. Torque matters when you need something to turn, and don't care about the speed, such as pulling a heavy load up a hill. HP matters when you need to maintain speed against load, such as turning a mower or snow thrower.

 

[Highbeam]

HP is still a valid figure of merit. Torque matters when you need something to turn, and don't care about the speed, such as pulling a heavy load up a hill. HP matters when you need to maintain speed against load, such as turning a mower or snow thrower.

See, this is the confusing part, I want to pull a heavy load up a hill and maintain my speed. So which is important? HP or torque? I prefer the analogy of HP is what accelerates you and torque is what maintains speed. Good engines (gas or diesel) have plenty of both and have gobs of it throughout the rpm range. For whatever reason, most modern engines have become peaky in their power delivery.

The topic of this thread is new low end mowers. Low end HST units come with them so we can't compare old stuff or even the well built stuff from tractors. My failed HST was an old john deere mower from a real JD dealer. Really soured me to the concept of mowing with a cheap hst tranny. If I was buying a small Kubota diesel tractor to mow with, say a B3030, then I would not shy away from a HST.

 

[Jags]

Torque turns things.
HP determines the rate at which the work is done.

 

[Ashful]

Torque turns things.
HP determines the rate at which the work is done.

Exactly... and to speak to highbeam's point, I would suspect some motor manufacturers have a very narrowly peaked torque or HP band, to maximize the number they publish. Torque developed at a low RPM that is below your range of interest is not much use. HP at any RPM is simply the ability to supply a given torque at that RPM, or conversely, the ability to maintain that RPM under a given load.

If you want to pull a heavy cart uphill without losing speed, then your figure of merit is HP, combined with the gearing to put you at the right RPM. Force x displacement / time = power. Physics 101.

 

[Retired Guy]

With the class action suit against small engine manufacturers it seems as though they weren't concerned about honestly reporting mower HP or torque. I suspect that's why they market engines by cc now.

 

[Bret Chase]

I'm a Simplicity guy myself. I think they have the best decks. I used to get a terrible mow with my Craftsman (MTD) because my yard is uneven the deck was always hanging off to the side.

I also LOVE the quick release deck. I wouldn't own a mower without it again. I can drop my deck in about 2 minutes and wheel it away which makes the machine able to go out in the woods to haul wood!

I also wouldn't want a mower without the "positrac" feature. I forget what its called, but it lets you lock both rear wheels when one spins. Its great.

Lastly, I love the "pedal drive" and would want that from now on as well. One pedal for forward, one for reverse. I vote to buy a used, high quality mower.

I have a 15 year old scotts 2046 (that I got for $200 and put 50 bucks into)... dropping the deck takes less than a minute... 5 cotter pins and pop off the belt. it's a lever hydro... I H*AT*E pedal drive. I use it for mowing and towing my little (2X3) trailer around doing lawn crap. in the woods, I fire up my 1944 Farmall A.... 70 years old and runs like a top :D

I haven't looked lately, but I recall the engine on my Ariens is a 650cc V-twin. That's motorcyle size. My point being, that the bigger motors suck down more fuel.

my 20hp vtwin displaces 656cc.... my bike displaces 599cc.... and makes 117hp...

 

[Ashful]

it's a lever hydro... I H*AT*E pedal drive.

I've owned both, and each has its pros and cons, but I'll tell you it takes quite a bit of mental training to learn to back up a trailer with lever hydro, after years of controlling your vehicle speed with pedals. Personally, I find the only real solid advantage of the lever hydro (given most pedal hydro's have a "cruise control" pedal latch) is the ability to control the tractor while you walk next to it, for tasks like collecting yard debris in a trailer. I used to do that quite often with my little Cub Cadet, but it would be not very safe with a larger machine.

 

[velvetfoot]

Mine has a switch that shuts it down when you leave the seat.

 

[Ashful]

Mine has a switch that shuts it down when you leave the seat.

That's not a real tractor.

 

[maple1]

Mine has a switch that shuts it down when you leave the seat.

That is most aggravating sometimes. I would like to disable my JD from doing that, but I think the shut down circuits are also tied to other stuff (parking brake, blade clutch, reverse mowing switch) so figured it wouldn't be as simple as unplugging & shorting something. I should have a closer look next time I have it out...

 

[Bret Chase]

That is most aggravating sometimes. I would like to disable my JD from doing that, but I think the shut down circuits are also tied to other stuff (parking brake, blade clutch, reverse mowing switch) so figured it wouldn't be as simple as unplugging & shorting something. I should have a closer look next time I have it out...

I defeated the RIO (Reverse Implement Option) switch on mine. I found it unbelievably irritating, as I do not have enough hands to hit the stupid button, pull the lever to reverse and steer at the same time. all it took was to pop the switch out of the dash and jumper the connector. I can live with all the other cutouts, but I would prefer the seat switch only be active when the mower deck was running.

 

[maple1]

I defeated the RIO (Reverse Implement Option) switch on mine. I found it unbelievably irritating, as I do not have enough hands to hit the stupid button, pull the lever to reverse and steer at the same time. all it took was to pop the switch out of the dash and jumper the connector. I can live with all the other cutouts, but I would prefer the seat switch only be active when the mower deck was running.

Ya, that one is a pain sometimes too. Not so much with the pedal reverse though - so I haven't really thought about it.

Haven't thought about much of it seriously I guess, just been putting up with it & thinking once in a while 'I wonder if I can do something about that?'

My kids are doing more mowing every year, so I'd want to be careful on what I'd tamper with, especially since we've got some hills. I would like to deactivate the seat switch, but I still want the thing to quit if the seat gets unloaded when the blades are turning - so not sure that's possible.

 

[Jags]

The seat switch would have to be taken out of the current circuit BUT added to the mower deck circuit. Not really an easy option. It could be done if you wanted to get the wiring diagram, but with kids learning the machine I would caution taking out ANY of the safety features. As an adult, they drive me nuts, but with kids it is a whole nuther ball game.

 

[AK13]

I defeated the RIO (Reverse Implement Option) switch on mine. I found it unbelievably irritating, as I do not have enough hands to hit the stupid button, pull the lever to reverse and steer at the same time.

Ha ha. Another win for pedal drive and the Simplicity. Mine has a simple ONE TIME switch that I turn when I engage the PTO that permanently disables the reverse nonsense. It stays disabled until you shut off the PTO and turn it back on. Great system.

And the Simplicity has a lever drive also so you don't have to use pedals. But they are so much easier.....kind of like driving a....car? I think the main reason that I like pedals is that my yard has so many obstacles that I am constantly having to slow down. If I was mowing wide open acres I'd probably feel differently and just want to hit max speed and forget it.

 

[maple1]

Ha ha. Another win for pedal drive and the Simplicity. Mine has a simple ONE TIME switch that I turn when I engage the PTO that permanently disables the reverse nonsense. It stays disabled until you shut off the PTO and turn it back on. Great system.

The JD one works like that too. Just have to either hold the button in while you press the reverse pedal then let it up after you're in reverse, or punch it just after you hit reverse (but then the motor momentarily dies until you punch it). The PTO (blades) will keep running as long as you're still going backwards without holding the button in - but as soon as you go out of reverse, you need to hit the button again to go back into reverse. It kind of comes naturally after a few hours use - but I still forget once in a while.

And agree on the kids - which is why I just live with it all.

 

[velvetfoot]

On the Ariens, you just have to turn the ignition key one position to the left to enable backing with the mower running.

 

[Ashful]

Wow, some of these new safety switches sound impossibly intrusive, but for the sake of liability, I'm not sure I'd go messing with them. Mine are much simpler / more practical:

JD ZTrak 757 (commercial grade mower, 2009 vintage): Seat switch shuts off tractor if you get off the seat without setting the parking brake. I can't imagine why you'd want to get off the seat without setting the brake, on that machine.

JD 855 MFWD (compact utility tractor, 1986 vintage): Seat switch shuts off both PTO's, nothing else. I can walk next to the tractor while it's driving on cruise control, if I want. In fact, if I tip the seat forward against the steering wheel, there's an option to disable the seat switch while running the rear PTO. This enables you to power a backhoe or log splitter off the PTO, when you're not sitting on the tractor. Front PTO, which is used primarily for mower deck and snow thrower, cannot be over-ridden at seat switch.

Not sure if these over-intrusive seat and other safety switches are an issue with just homeowner grade equipment, or if the commercial guys have to deal with the same, nowadays. Would be interesting to know, though.

 

[Highbeam]

If it has a seat switch, it's not a tractor. I had a bee hive fall in my lap while mowing a field one day and had to bail out and run for my life. The tractor is a hydro so it stopped moving but the mower deck was still spinning and engine screaming at PTO speed for at least an hour before I had the nerve to creep up near the tractor and use my hand on the treddle to move the tractor forward away from the hive.

When standing between tractor tires and moving the tractor it seems awfully easy to get run over.

The craftsman riding mower has a key position that allows full access to reverse while mowing. That's a fine system.

 

[Ashful]

The craftsman riding mower has a key position that allows full access to reverse while mowing. That's a fine system.

Kinda weird, tho... isn't it? I mean, I can't think of many situations where I could mow a yard without wanting to reverse at some point.

 

[Highbeam]

Kinda weird, tho... isn't it? I mean, I can't think of many situations where I could mow a yard without wanting to reverse at some point.

Yes, the first thing I do when I mow is disengage that feature using the supplied bypass. Within the first 30 feet of mowing I am using reverse with the blades engaged.

 

[velvetfoot]

You have to consciously deactivate, so it's your fault if anything goes wrong.

 

[Bret Chase]

JD 855 MFWD (compact utility tractor, 1986 vintage): Seat switch shuts off both PTO's, nothing else. I can walk next to the tractor while it's driving on cruise control, if I want. In fact, if I tip the seat forward against the steering wheel, there's an option to disable the seat switch while running the rear PTO. This enables you to power a backhoe or log splitter off the PTO, when you're not sitting on the tractor. Front PTO, which is used primarily for mower deck and snow thrower, cannot be over-ridden at seat switch.

Not sure if these over-intrusive seat and other safety switches are an issue with just homeowner grade equipment, or if the commercial guys have to deal with the same, nowadays. Would be interesting to know, though.

a seat switch on a compact utility.... interesting... on my old '89 JD1050 (sold) there was no seat switch of any kind. on my '44 Farmall.... safety... lol. hit the starter in gear with you in front of the tire.... it'll run you over and keep going until it hits something and stalls.... or runs out of fuel.