Please let me know if you do, I will try that as well and let you know if I get to it first. I'm not thinking it is enough to cause any problems just seemed weird to me...
Accidental overfire
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In my NC30 the boards are banana shaped too but they only touch the front and back tubes. Almost a 1/4" between the boards and the middle two tubes. So mine are kinda already flipped. I like them humped up in the middle and would flip them if they were sagged in the middle like you folks describe.
The banana shape has been there for years without changing so I don't think it's going to get worse.
Wish the boards were thicker and stayed put better. I am always shoving them back against the back wall and trying to scoot them together to close that gap in the middle. The new NC32 has 4 boards. Two like the NC30 and then two laying the other direction on top. What a mess that would be if they all banana'd out in different directions.
Yeah, I am constantly shoving them back and pushing them back together. I have a new set on hand in case of damage, but, at this point I don't see a small gap making that much of a difference until next season, then I will put new ones in. I wish there was a sturdier alternative. Our old Pre-EPA stove had a steel baffle but it ended up warping a eventually falling out at some point. Kind of a pain for sure! And, those boards are not cheap!
jetsam
Minister of Fire
If you google for it, there's reports of people getting a couple years out of a piece of hardiebacker. A 3x5 sheet of 1/4" is under $12 at HD.
I've never had a stove with baffles or I'd already know first hand how well it holds up...
I've never had a stove with baffles or I'd already know first hand how well it holds up...
I finally got a chance to check this out after getting the turkey in the oven. My baffle seems to be sitting fairly flat and even over the three tubes. Every two years I get my chimney cleaned and I believe the sweeps take these out and put them back in after.
Caw
Minister of Fire
If you want to shut down secondary combustion all you need to do is open the door. Seems counterintuitive when you have a raging inferno going but that's the best way to get it under control. Opening the door turns your stove into an open fireplace and it will send all the heat up the flue.
Edit: whoops I should read the whole thread before posting, someone already said this. Great minds!
Edit: whoops I should read the whole thread before posting, someone already said this. Great minds!
My preference is to have a stovepipe damper, and ive already had to use it a couple of times this year . Kinda like an e-brake, works quite nicely
thebaron23
Member
If you feel your stove is running away and burning uncontrollably hot open the door and fire a quarter cup or half cup of baking soda (not baking powder) and close the door again.
kennyp2339
Minister of Fire
Thats a good question, I'd be more incline first on figuring what kind of draft I'm working with before adding or making any modifications, running a stove on high with a full load should give a reasonable draft between .05 and .10 anything more then I would consider adding a pipe damper or magnets covering some of the air intake.
Now someone please correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think pacific energy has a new setup to help regulate or balance primary to secondary air ratio.
thebaron23
Member
PE has essentially a barometric damper on the secondary (Ebt2) . It opens and closes on its own based on draft.
I have a new LE PE stove and you can hear the damper clicking open and shut by itself. The problem with these stoves is they are very easy breathers and run HOT. I had to block off one of the air intakes on mine.
Englander makes a lot of different models with different specs and different overfire ratings. Exactly which model Englander stove is this?
EPA stoves are designed to remain safe (i.e. not burn the house down) under any reasonable maloperation, as long as clearances are met. That said, an overfire could cause expensive stove damage, and for that reason, I modified my air inlet control to allow me to overrride the factory "stop" position and more fully close primary and secondary air.I've only ever used this once under real conditions, and although it is very effective at stopping flames, the almost complete lack of airflow means that it is very slow at cooling the stove, and as mentioned above, results in a buildup of flammable and almost explosive gases in the firebox and chimney, which may result in another dangerous situation if oxygen is allowed in too soon. Opening the door by contrast, is not just counterintuitive, it is downright terrifying, and while it certainly cools the stove and flue quickly, you're left with a raging inferno which cannot be left unattended. I'm glad I have both options, but I also realize that while seeing internals glowing red is scary and might prevent me sleeping well, it's not that dangerous.
TE
Their old stoves also used to have a control over the secondary inlet, it was linked to the primary air control with a rod.
I'm curious as to how much either of these help, the PE stoves don't seem to show up in the overdraft threads very often.
thebaron23
Member
It helps, but the boost air they have really is too much if you already have an optimal chimney scenario. It should be an option to open if you have low draft not be defaulted wide open when you get the stove. With the boost air open before I plugged it and my air intake completely closed we would still get stovetop temps of near 800 on the regular. I couldn't burn at all with anything but a closed intake.
I've thought about adding a damper in the flue since I typically have 1-3 "incidents" in a burning season where the fire is a bit hotter than I like . . . but then I realize I am lazy and cheap and just stick with using a sheet of aluminum foil to partially cover the incoming air which has resulted in calming the fire down.
My friend has the same stove and he does report that when filling the stove with very dry wood he has to keep an eye on the stove top temps and shut it down early. Unlike my Englander NC-30 where you can almost shut the fire down by shutting down the air control no matter the wood or draft situation.
Isaac Carlson
Minister of Fire
Every wood stove in every install will behave differently. It's just the way it works. Different house/building, different chimney, different wood, outside air, heat requirements, etc... Manufacturers can only do so much to make their stoves run well on the biggest portion of installs. Just like the newer cars, you get enough crap on them to meet emissions and the mpg ends up going down because of the inefficiency of the "efficiency" they claim to have.
I flipped my boards a couple of weeks ago. Like it better. Don't spread apart as much and it seems to breath just a little better when it cools down.
MagdalenaP
Burning Hunk
So many other more experienced experts have already answered here but I will add one thing and then agree to all the others...
It makes sense that the smoke shield would glow before anything else because it basically takes the most turbulence and the most heat from the top of the firebox and directs it down and typically across the glass to keep the glass clean/er. On my older Regency stove the smoke shield is the first thing/only thing which would ever actually glow. On my older Regency stove, the smoke shield was welded in and made out of regular steel which couldn't be replaced. It eventually crumbled and cracked away right in the middle too because of all the heat that it deflected over time. On my newer Regency stove the smoke shield is stainless steel which is bolted in and and designed to be replaced if required. In other words, that component probably has the hardest job of any component inside the intensity of the firebox itself and is sort of the cardinal in the cave, if you will, with many modern EPA stoves.
As everyone else already stated, 800 isn't going to hurt your stove.
Do NOT try to suffocate the secondary burn system; as everyone else already said it might work but will be dangerous ... just fully open the door to the stove to significantly reduce the flue temp and to automatically kill the secondary burn system.
The baffle tubes might be a bit warped OR the baffle blocks might be molded less than flat. To find out whether it is one thing or the other you could take the baffles out and lay them out on a flat surface to see how flat they actually are. Either way it won't affect the function or the safety of the stove unless the baffles leave an area of open exposure to the top of the inside of the firebox.
Hope this helps. Again, rest your heart; we are all almost 100% sure you did no damage.
It makes sense that the smoke shield would glow before anything else because it basically takes the most turbulence and the most heat from the top of the firebox and directs it down and typically across the glass to keep the glass clean/er. On my older Regency stove the smoke shield is the first thing/only thing which would ever actually glow. On my older Regency stove, the smoke shield was welded in and made out of regular steel which couldn't be replaced. It eventually crumbled and cracked away right in the middle too because of all the heat that it deflected over time. On my newer Regency stove the smoke shield is stainless steel which is bolted in and and designed to be replaced if required. In other words, that component probably has the hardest job of any component inside the intensity of the firebox itself and is sort of the cardinal in the cave, if you will, with many modern EPA stoves.
As everyone else already stated, 800 isn't going to hurt your stove.
Do NOT try to suffocate the secondary burn system; as everyone else already said it might work but will be dangerous ... just fully open the door to the stove to significantly reduce the flue temp and to automatically kill the secondary burn system.
The baffle tubes might be a bit warped OR the baffle blocks might be molded less than flat. To find out whether it is one thing or the other you could take the baffles out and lay them out on a flat surface to see how flat they actually are. Either way it won't affect the function or the safety of the stove unless the baffles leave an area of open exposure to the top of the inside of the firebox.
Hope this helps. Again, rest your heart; we are all almost 100% sure you did no damage.
Isaac Carlson
Minister of Fire
The baffles and other internals take an absolute beating from heat. We had a lopi before our cookstove, and the inside glowed all winter. That means the bricks, tubes, supports, and baffles. We used that stove for several years before installing our kitchen queen and the inside of the stove looks like a nuke went off inside of it. The baffle iron is warped, the tubes are sagging, and the upper bricks are turning to powder. The stack temp was 350-450 with that lopi. It is still solid and would be just fine with new tubes and baffle parts. I never thought I would see firebrick glow like that.
I will likely be rebuilding the stove and putting it in my wife's work area to keep her warm. She likes glass windows so she can watch the fire.
I will likely be rebuilding the stove and putting it in my wife's work area to keep her warm. She likes glass windows so she can watch the fire.
Regulating the secondary air can extend burn time quite a bit. Precaud did some testing years ago with a modified (Morso?) stove in which he installed a manual secondary damper. It made a notable difference when the 2nd air was closed down during the coaling stage. In comparison with stoves in the Chimney Sweep stove shop, Tom Oyen reported that the Super 27 had the longest burn time of any stove they had tested.
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