Absolute Steel Hybrid

[tlhfirelion]

I apologize in advance if these questions have been answered already. I read this whole thread and did a search as well as looked on WS website for the answers, but could not locate them.

1) What sized home, square footage wise, is the Absolute Steel Hybrid designed for?

2) Does this unit require (or would it benefit from) an outside air kit?

3) Will this stove work at all if the Catalyst is shot/missing? (I'm getting all prepper.SHTF on you here with a scenario where I lose power for days and am in need of a catalyst and haven't gotten my order yet, etc)

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[branchburner]

1) The Absolute Steel Hybrid would be "medium" as far as firebox size, so suited for homes in the 1200-2400 sf range, depending on climate, insulation, layout, etc.

2) I think the usefulness of an outside air kit is more dependent on the nature of the house tightness, rather than the stove, no?

3) I think any stove works if the catalyst is shot, but won't work as well. Since this is a hybrid, if you ran it hot enough you'd get secondaries from the burn-tube technology, so it seems to me it could be run very efficiently for quite some time with a bad cat, so long as you weren't trying to run it low, the way the cats can be run. (The VC claim with their hybrid is that the cat is an option rather than necessity... not sure how Woodstock would consider their stove to function without the cat, but as a prepper scenario I wouldn't worry... the cat should last a long time with cleaning, and to be safe you can order your backup a year or two before you think you might need it, lol.)

I've been running the ASH for a few weeks now and love it. What's the size layout of your house?

 

[tlhfirelion]

1) The Absolute Steel Hybrid would be "medium" as far as firebox size, so suited for homes in the 1200-2400 sf range, depending on climate, insulation, layout, etc.

2) I think the usefulness of an outside air kit is more dependent on the nature of the house tightness, rather than the stove, no?

3) I think any stove works if the catalyst is shot, but won't work as well. Since this is a hybrid, if you ran it hot enough you'd get secondaries from the burn-tube technology, so it seems to me it could be run very efficiently for quite some time with a bad cat, so long as you weren't trying to run it low, the way the cats can be run. (The VC claim with their hybrid is that the cat is an option rather than necessity... not sure how Woodstock would consider their stove to function without the cat, but as a prepper scenario I wouldn't worry... the cat should last a long time with cleaning, and to be safe you can order your backup a year or two before you think you might need it, lol.)

I've been running the ASH for a few weeks now and love it. What's the size layout of your house?

Thank you for the detailed reply!

1) M current stove is an old century brand rated for 1500 sq ft. It can heat up good but sucks pretty bad on anything past 4-5 hours. My home is 1500 sq ft and the stove in in the middle of the main floor. The main floor is 1000 sq ft and the basement is 500. I'm only focusing on the main floor from a practical stand point. My home is about 30 or so years old and I'm stuck with the R11 fiberglass in the walls. I've sealed it up with canned foam and the attic is about to bust from all the extra cellulose I added awhile back, but the heat pump can struggle a few nights. I'm in northern AR by the MO border. Aside from the long burn time, I am drawn to cats because of the efficiency. I don't have property with any trees that are eligible to cut down so I have to either buy wood or get a tree from a friend or neighbor, etc. I also don't have the long harsh winters like you guys up north do. I need wood heat for 4, maybe 5 months a year and lost power due to ice storms, etc.

2) I assumed OAK would allow the stove to burn more efficiently without using already heated air from inside the structure. So even in a less than ideal sealed up home, it would still be of benefit. Am I incorrect?

3) Good to know on the cat. Glad to hear you like the AH. I burn almost all oak, sometimes a cedar tree or hickory if I get ahold of a free tree. What kind of burn times are you getting with the AH? If I could get 8-9 hours overnight and keep my house at 70, I would be thrilled.

Thanks again for the reply. Good to hear from an owner of the stove I'm interested in.

 

[quotejso]

It is in the horizontal part of the tee. (the rubber hose is for the draft meter, the handle for the key damper is just to the right of the rubber hose)
View attachment 174682

What dampner do you have? Is there any other way to measure draft?

 

[drz1050]

Firelion:

It's hard to say, given each house layout/ draftiness/ level of insulation is different... I have the Ashford. Some people are heating 2000+ Sq ft with one.. my place is 1100, and on the really cold nights I leave it on full blast, and it just keeps the place mid 60s. Going to be upgrading the insulation this year, so hopefully won't have that problem next winter.

How many BTUs does your heat pump put out? Use that as your gauge..

 

[tlhfirelion]

Firelion:

It's hard to say, given each house layout/ draftiness/ level of insulation is different... I have the Ashford. Some people are heating 2000+ Sq ft with one.. my place is 1100, and on the really cold nights I leave it on full blast, and it just keeps the place mid 60s. Going to be upgrading the insulation this year, so hopefully won't have that problem next winter.

How many BTUs does your heat pump put out? Use that as your gauge..

Seeing as how my heat pump was installed by Moses and Sons heating and air, I suspect it's partly to blame for my heating issues. I'll have to take a look and see what the label says on the unit. Once my stove situation is squared away, the heat pump is the next to get upgraded/replaced. Thanks for the suggestion and reply.

 

[drz1050]

Didn't mean to throw shade on the heat pump.. was just saying it heats YOUR place right now, so you know how many BTUs you need to heat YOUR place.. find out what those numbers are, and buy a woodstove accordingly. I'd get something that either matched, or went a bit over the BTU of the heat pump. It struggles a little bit on cold days.. it's no worries running a stove at 100%, and actually quite good for them. On average, would you say the heat pump is running around 50%? A stove running at 50% is usually quite happy there.

You wouldn't want to get a small stove, and then find out you have to run it full blast all the time, just like you wouldn't want to get a big stove and cook yourself out.

 

[tlhfirelion]

Didn't mean to throw shade on the heat pump.. was just saying it heats YOUR place right now, so you know how many BTUs you need to heat YOUR place.. find out what those numbers are, and buy a woodstove accordingly. I'd get something that either matched, or went a bit over the BTU of the heat pump. It struggles a little bit on cold days.. it's no worries running a stove at 100%, and actually quite good for them. On average, would you say the heat pump is running around 50%? A stove running at 50% is usually quite happy there.

You wouldn't want to get a small stove, and then find out you have to run it full blast all the time, just like you wouldn't want to get a big stove and cook yourself out.

What does "throw shade" mean? lol Apparently I'm not as hip as I thought I was.

I've been too busy to go down and look at the numbers but I'll get that this week. Your approach makes sense. Thanks!

 

[Flamestead]

What dampner do you have? Is there any other way to measure draft?

We have a key damper that is built into the Tee (I'm not sure which type). In the pic below, the cat and its heat shield are removed and you can see into the rear exiting stovepipe to where the damper is closed.


I've read there are other ways to measure draft but haven't tried any. The general notion is the amount of suction, measured in units of inches of water column (negative inches). This Tee has a hole drilled into it, and we insert a metal tube into the hole (about 1/4" tube). The metal tube has a rubber hose attached that leads to the meter. I think the other methods involve an actual tube of water (as I'm sure the original tools did) - this has an easy-to-read scale that can be zeroed out, and no water.

 

[Flamestead]

I apologize in advance if these questions have been answered already. I read this whole thread and did a search as well as looked on WS website for the answers, but could not locate them.

1) What sized home, square footage wise, is the Absolute Steel Hybrid designed for?

2) Does this unit require (or would it benefit from) an outside air kit?

3) Will this stove work at all if the Catalyst is shot/missing? (I'm getting all prepper.SHTF on you here with a scenario where I lose power for days and am in need of a catalyst and haven't gotten my order yet, etc)

Thanks for the feedback.

My apologies for being slow to respond...

As noted above, the design is more for heat load than for square footage. We are in a large (3600 sq ft plus walk-out basement), thin-walled, drafty (dry-stacked stone foundation). We close some rooms, and have heated primarily with one wood stove (8 full cord of wood per season). The intent of testing the Absolute Steel for our situation is to distribute heat horizontally by adding a second stove. I like the suggestions to compare to your current heating system on a BTU-basis.

Regarding the outside air kit, one neat feature of the Absolute Steel is that all combustion air comes in through the OAK opening. This is not the case with the PH, IS, and many other stoves.

Without the cat the stove will not burn as cleanly as intended, but certainly would produce heat.

 

[Flamestead]

...snip...

2) I assumed OAK would allow the stove to burn more efficiently without using already heated air from inside the structure. So even in a less than ideal sealed up home, it would still be of benefit. Am I incorrect?

3) Good to know on the cat. Glad to hear you like the AH. I burn almost all oak, sometimes a cedar tree or hickory if I get ahold of a free tree. What kind of burn times are you getting with the AH? If I could get 8-9 hours overnight and keep my house at 70, I would be thrilled.

Thanks again for the reply. Good to hear from an owner of the stove I'm interested in.

I am sure that using outside air directly for combustion rather than as make-up has to be more heat efficient.

We have not yet tried long slow burns. We load in the morning at 7am, come home at 4-5pm and reload, and then reload again at 9-10pm. We did a slower burn overnight last night and my wife was grumbling about how many coals were in the way of the morning reload. Our general goal is to have the stove in the 500 degree STT range as much of the time as possible. Once it drops below that temp we engage in tactics to "get rid" of the rest of the fuel in the firebox so there is more room for the fresh load. Warmer temps are here now, and we plan to begin playing with lower and slower burns.

 

[Flamestead]

The top lid of the stove has a front lip that bends downward; that lip had very tight clearances on the early beta version we started with. If you weren't careful, it did not fully seat onto the gasket. We have the revised top to try - the top extends out another half inch or so, and the lip has a slightly different angle to it. Plenty of clearance now. My wife wanted to try it as simple as possible, and we are both liking this look. We intend to buy one, and I suspect this is the look she will select.

 

[drz1050]

What does "throw shade" mean? lol Apparently I'm not as hip as I thought I was.

I've been too busy to go down and look at the numbers but I'll get that this week. Your approach makes sense. Thanks!

haha sorry... throw shade means to talk bad about/ disrespect/ put down/ etc... was just trying to make it clear that I wasn't doing any of that.

You're very welcome, good luck in your search!

 

[quotejso]

We have a key damper that is built into the Tee (I'm not sure which type). In the pic below, the cat and its heat shield are removed and you can see into the rear exiting stovepipe to where the damper is closed.
View attachment 176442

I've read there are other ways to measure draft but haven't tried any. The general notion is the amount of suction, measured in units of inches of water column (negative inches). This Tee has a hole drilled into it, and we insert a metal tube into the hole (about 1/4" tube). The metal tube has a rubber hose attached that leads to the meter. I think the other methods involve an actual tube of water (as I'm sure the original tools did) - this has an easy-to-read scale that can be zeroed out, and no water.

How long is your chimney, I'm wondering if I maybe have too much draft for my Progress. My tee run is maybe 2 feet then about 22 feet up?

 

[begreen]

What are the symptoms that make you suspect too strong draft? A 90º turn in the smoke path should reduce the 22' chimney height about 2-3' or an effective 19'-20'. That should draft just about right.

 

[quotejso]

What are the symptoms that make you suspect too strong draft? A 90º turn in the smoke path should reduce the 22' chimney height about 2-3' or an effective 19'-20'. That should draft just about right.

Just my burn times were not as long as hoped for, probably just need to get out and stack wood.

 

[begreen]

What were you typically seeing? Maybe try a load or two of thicker splits?

 

[moresnow]

I am looking for a link to the installation clearances. Can't seem to find it on there website? Corner install. Most interested in the stoves rear corners to walls. Thanks

 

[LDay]

I am looking for a link to the installation clearances. Can't seem to find it on there website? Corner install. Most interested in the stoves rear corners to walls. Thanks

Hi moresnow,
We are awaiting the report from the UL Safety & Clearance Testing, and anticipate having the numbers ready to post on our website and blog in the next few days.

Lorin Day
Woodstock Soapstone Co.

 

[tlhfirelion]

Firelion:

It's hard to say, given each house layout/ draftiness/ level of insulation is different... I have the Ashford. Some people are heating 2000+ Sq ft with one.. my place is 1100, and on the really cold nights I leave it on full blast, and it just keeps the place mid 60s. Going to be upgrading the insulation this year, so hopefully won't have that problem next winter.

How many BTUs does your heat pump put out? Use that as your gauge..

Ok, so I've looked on both inside and outside u it's of my heat pump and taken off a few panels and can find no BTU Info. It's a 3 ton goodman heat pump but I already knew that. So I'm not sure how else I can zero in on the BTU number.

 

[tlhfirelion]

haha sorry... throw shade means to talk bad about/ disrespect/ put down/ etc... was just trying to make it clear that I wasn't doing any of that.

You're very welcome, good luck in your search!

No worries man!

 

[drz1050]

Ok, so I've looked on both inside and outside u it's of my heat pump and taken off a few panels and can find no BTU Info. It's a 3 ton goodman heat pump but I already knew that. So I'm not sure how else I can zero in on the BTU number.

Not sure what model # you have, here's the BTU listing for them:
http://www.goodmanmfg.com/Portals/0/pdf/SS/SS-GSZ13.pdf

 

[drz1050]

Judging by those numbers, looks like the Ashford would struggle to heat your place on the really cold days, but be fine most of the time.. or you could go with the Ideal Steel, and that thing would heat your place easily.

I'm jealous of the people on here in the big new houses, heating 2000+ sq ft with the Ashford on a low burn. My house is barely over 1000, and the Ashford struggled a bit this winter. I'm going to be upgrading my insulation though, so we'll see how much of a difference that makes next year.

 

[edyit]

I can't even begin to tell you how much improving the insulation and sealing up drafts around windows and doors helps. Its one of those things that until you do it yourself its hard to imagine the difference it makes.

 

[tlhfirelion]

Apparently Woodstock will be offering a shaker style absolute steel hybrid with long legs. I don' know if the price will be more or the same as the current ASH but I liked the look of that. According to my SQ footage the rep at woodstock stove said the Ideal steel was too large for my house.