A couple of questions (with pics)

[ROVERT]

My wife threatened to light the Allagash NG stove in the living room when I came home for lunch today. We rarely use any form of heat for more than a couple days until November. There was no way I was going to start paying for gas heat this early in the year when we now have a wood stove. I knew my afternoon work schedule would allow me to be in and out, so I offered to light it up. The house is toasty warm but I have a few questions about my first somewhat prolonged burn.

I started off with some good and dry maple (Norway) and Tulip Tree. I filled the stove approximately 2/3 full after getting it hot with some kindling and small splits. It burned nicely, but quickly. Even with the air shut down, it was down to coals in an hour.

I then tried a load with just the maple. It again lasted just about an hour. I know the Buck 21 is a small stove but I expected burn times a little longer than this. I have somewhere around 26 feet of chimney. Is it possible I'm getting too much draft? Should I consider putting a damper in to lessen the draft and increase burn times?

My next question involves unseasoned wood, specifically red oak and hickory. The red oak was cut in July and split and stacked in August/Sept. The hickory was cut over a year ago and split and stacked in the same time period as the oak. The last time I took any moisture readings was a week or two ago and both read from the mid thirties to over 42 percent (which is the limit on my HF meter). I thought there was no way I could burn this wood this year, but thought I would try it out just to see what green wood looks like in my stove. The hickory really surprised me and burned really well. The oak is also burning well.

Here are some pics and a short video:

Pic of fire.

Certainly no black smoke coming out of the chimney.

Stack thermometer.

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Video of the burn.

This is with one oak and two hickory splits placed on a bed of hot coals. The air was cut back after about five minutes. The pics and video are all from well after the air had been fully cut back.

I'm going to retest the moisture of the wood from the stacks when it is a little nicer out (ie. not 40's and raining) but does anyone have any idea what is going on here? From what I'm seeing, there is no evidence to suggest that burning this wood is creating creosote. Maybe I'm missing something here. I'd appreciate any input.

At this point, I'm thinking I'll have more wood than I thought to burn this winter. If I burn much of this stuff, I'll definitely make frequent trips up on the roof to check the chimney, but it seems to be usable, especially the hickory.

 

[begreen]

Tulip will burn up pretty quickly. Hickory, locust and white oak will last much longer.

Still it's worth checking the air control to make sure it's closing off the air correctly and not sloppy loose. How much flue is on the stove?

 

[corey21]

That is a very short and hot burn.

You may also want to check for air leaks just to sure.

 

[ROVERT]

I was not surprised by the one hour burn with mostly tulip tree. The fact that the maple burned just as quickly surprised me.

The air control is working as designed. There is no play and no blockages. The flue is 6".

The one hour burn with maple did not reach the same temps as shown on the t stat above. That was with the hickory/oak. The short burns with maple and tulip only got to about 550 (300 surface temp) on the stack.

I have checked for leaks and everything looks good on that front.

I got reasonable burn times out of the oak/hickory, about 2 hrs out of three splits. I guess the maple just surprised me at how quickly it burned.

I'm still not sure why my seasoned-six-weeks oak burned like it did, though. Maybe the hickory just burned hot enough to dry out the oak split without smoking.

 

[James02]

By the video, which I watched on my phone, the flames seem as if they're dancing fairly quick....i say leak....that's my humble opinion...

 

[blwncrewchief]

I agree with James02 watching the video. If that is with the air fully shut it looks way too active for a low burn. Looks like way too much primary air from either too much draft, leak, or something not closing off enough. With a good low burn I have very little flame off the wood itself and usually have to leave the air open a little to maintain that, The only time I can even shut the air all the way without smothering it is when it gets very cold like below 10*. How well your "unseasoned" burns is also an indicator of not being able to shut the air down enough as an excessive amount of primary air is exactly what is needed to get unseasoned wood to burn well. Next, that surface flue temp is way high. I do not get near that high with the stove top over 650-700*. That is also where a very large chunk of your heat is going, right up the chimney. I would have a hard time burning that wood down in a hour or less with the air wide open.

I just noticed you said it was in the 40's. If that is with the air shut down in the 40's you better hold on if it actually gets cold where you are located. The difference between the 40's and say single digits is like the difference between a snail and a race horse on my stove and chimney.

 

[Wood Duck]

That is a good call from James02. The flames are dancing like an outdoor fire, indicating there is a lot of air moving through the stove. You should get more than an hour burn out of maple and tulip. Even if you load just a couple of splits in my stove they won't burn up in an hour. I don't know how to figure out where the air is getting in but I'd suggest the door gasket is one place you could check.

Unseasoned wood will burn if you have a hot bed of coals and lots of air, so I am not surprised your oak and hickory burnt well. Lots of people burn unseasoned wood every year by design. They use more wood than necessary and get more creosote in the chimney, but it burns.

 

[ROVERT]

By the video, which I watched on my phone, the flames seem as if they're dancing fairly quick....i say leak....that's my humble opinion...

I have checked for leaks at the gaskets. I'll recheck everything, but that is why I was suspecting too much draft.

 

[ROVERT]

Next, that surface flue temp is way high. I do not get near that high with the stove top over 650-700*. That is also where a very large chunk of your heat is going, right up the chimney. I would have a hard time burning that wood down in a hour or less with the air wide open.

I wasn't under the impression that a surface temp of around 350 on the stack was all that high. I'll put a probe thermometer in next time I burn and see what the actual temp is in the flue. I had the blower running so I couldn't get an accurate stove top temp. It does get quite a bit colder here and I don't want to burn more wood than I have to, so I'm going to try to get a handle on this.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

If your burner is like mine (I have the 74) and I suspect it is. Look at this thread( https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/draft-modifications-revisited.82417/#post-1078709 ) and particularly the pic. Mine was doing the same thing. I have called Buck and from what I understand, the primary air intake and the secondary intake is from the same hole......So I made some adjustment and can close further and realllllllly extend burns. BUT you have to watch! You don't want to smother the fire and smolder=creosote. So, it is sort of a new learning curve..I hope his helps?

 

[begreen]

Your problem is what I was thinking of Plays with Fire. We also had a Napoleon that had a loose fitting air control. This is where I would first focus my attention.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

I forgot to add: Also check the connection to the stove where the collar or pipe is connected at the top. I did a smoke test here and found, only on start up as it will be way to hot, a pretty significant leak. I just used some furnace cement and sealed it right up. I sealed the flex pipe to the collar and the collar to the stove, air tight like a birds butt! I bet though of your problem is the main control!

 

[ROVERT]

If your burner is like mine (I have the 74) and I suspect it is. Look at this thread( https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/draft-modifications-revisited.82417/#post-1078709 ) and particularly the pic. Mine was doing the same thing. I have called Buck and from what I understand, the primary air intake and the secondary intake is from the same hole......So I made some adjustment and can close further and realllllllly extend burns. BUT you have to watch! You don't want to smother the fire and smolder=creosote. So, it is sort of a new learning curve..I hope his helps?

Thanks for posting that. I wasn't having the same problem, but you made me recheck the air control. I had inspected it several times but had always pulled the trim pieces that cover the blower so that I could see it more easily. When I did this the air control slid nicely through its full range of travel. With the trim pieces installed, however, the air control stops about 1/4 to 3/8 of an inch shy of fully closed. It slides smoothly and stops abruptly just as it does with the trim pieces removed, but stops short. I'll make an adjustment to keep the trim from interfering with the air control rod and I should be good to go.

Thanks. I'll let you know how it works out.

 

[begreen]

Bingo, I think we have a winner here.

 

[corey21]

Glad you found your problem.

 

[etiger2007]

I would still hold off on the red oak, i burned a bunch last year and it produced great heat and lots of flames but when i cleaned the ss liner it had alot of creosote in it. When it gets seasoned it will be better for your stove and you. Red Oak will take three years to get seasoned. My oak was cut in Jan 2010 and its still reading at 27 % in the middle of the split.