2019-20 Blaze King Performance Thread Part 1 (Everything BK)

[weatherguy]

You BK guys are all poindexters

 

[Poindexter]

My best guess at where your steam plume ends is marked up in paint in red. This is not a valid VEE level 9 read. Level 9 reads must be made in person, never from photographs, and require observing the plume, not glancing at at it.

It looks to me like your actual plume opacity after the steam plume is probably near 20 percent, so probably legal in my neighborhood. You would not be the third cleanest burner on my street with seven woodburners in nine houses, but you are way ahead of the two losers down at the end of the block.

 

[Diabel]

The needle gets there 20min into the burn as I close the bypass. And stays there (20* either may) for the next 14h.

 

[Diabel]

My best guess at where your steam plume ends is marked up in paint in red. This is not a valid VEE level 9 read. Level 9 reads must be made in person, never from photographs, and require observing the plume, not glancing at at it.

It looks to me like your actual plume opacity after the steam plume is probably near 20 percent, so probably legal in my neighborhood. You would not be the third cleanest burner on my street with seven woodburners in nine houses, but you are way ahead of the two losers down at the end of the block.

I truly appreciate your analysis. Where do I send my check?

 

[Poindexter]

Can you see how an observer would have to observe a while to gauge the opacity against the tree branches?

And the wind. Even a gentle wind like that at 21dF can cool the chimney above the roofline down quite a bit.

With no wind in what you have described I would expect a detached plume at my house.

Are you in any kind of airbowl or airshed? Nearby hills, lots of trees?

Do you only smell woodsmoke when the wind is coming from a particular direction?

 

[Poindexter]

I truly appreciate your analysis. Where do I send my check?

Just give it to your local food bank or homeless shelter.

 

[Diabel]

Just give it to your local food bank or homeless shelter.

Nice, thank you. I will top up my local annual hospital donation

 

[Poindexter]

Final analysis I am not convinced you have a system problem and would want to see how it performs in other weather patterns, wind speed, wind direction, that sort of stuff.

If it is a chronic problem when wind is coming from the usual direction I would think about dropping a tree or two nearest the chimney.

 

[Diabel]

Nice, thank you. I will top up my local annual hospital donation

This plume thing always intrigued/bothered me. Thank to your elaborate and patient explanation (which many others will benefit from) I can sleep better.
cheers

 

[Diabel]

Final analysis I am not convinced you have a system problem and would want to see how it performs in other weather patterns, wind speed, wind direction, that sort of stuff.

If it is a chronic problem when wind is coming from the usual direction I would think about dropping a tree or two nearest the chimney.

Closest tree is maybe 50 feet away from the chimney. Pictures are misleading.

 

[MissMac]

There will be visible steam in your exhaust plume anytime outdoor ambients are below 212dF.

If your plume is detached, that is a reliable indicator your exhaust gasses are above 212dF because the steam in the plume hasn't cooled off enough to condense yet when it clears the pipe and hits the outside air.

If your plume is attached that is a reliable indicator your exhaust gasses cooled to below 212 dF somewhere inside the pipe. You probably have a little bit of condensed water on the inside of your chimney pipe. Next you'll have bits of carbon sticking to the water droplets. This is a good reason to run your fresh loads on high for 30 minutes - it not only cooks water out of the fresh wood but can possibly dry out your chimney pipe too.

Great explanations as always Poindexter! So, should it always be the goal of a wood stove enthusiast to keep the temps in the stack above 212 dF for the reasons you've outlined? My plume is always attached to my stack, and dances around - i'm in some topography, with some lake/tree/slope interactions at play. I'm glad that someone else brought up this whole conversation, because sometimes i worry that my stove isn't operating as it should be. Sometimes there's lots of visible smoke/steam coming out, other times just the wavy lines as you describe - and all burning the same wood, between 16-18% MC.

I run my stove by the BK book - always bypass clicked down, and likely overkill for 'charring the load' - usually between 30-35 minutes on high before i dial it down in increments.

One thing i have wondered about is whether or not there are some 'dirty spots' on my dial, where that amount of air just doesn't quite produce optimal burning conditions. Sometimes i think that there's a few spots on my dial that always smoke, but if i adjust up or down, the issue resolves. Just an observation. Thanks again!

 

[MissMac]

Depends upon burn rate, MC and outside temps. Purchase a Ringleman chart if you want to gauge opacity.
If a stove is operating at a very low burn rate, it's possible to have steam for hours. First stage of combustion is to rid fuel load of water. Try burning at higher burn rates. If plume diminishes early in burn, you'll have your answer.

Also, remember to lock down bypass for good seal.

Thanks BKVP! I'm going to check out the Ringleman charts for sure. Bypass is always locked down. I may try replacing the gasket this coming spring however - should the seal on the bypass be as dollar bill tight as the seal on the loading door? Regardless, based on what i see coming out the stack sometimes, it's hard to believe that it would all be leaking through the bypass.

 

[MissMac]

Do you only smell woodsmoke when the wind is coming from a particular direction?

Okay, this next question may or may not be obtuse on my part, but wouldn't stack exhaust always smell like woodsmoke regardless of whether you could see it, or it was just heat lines? After all, it is wood burning in the stove. Or are you suggesting that if the cat is doing it's job, one shouldn't be able to even smell the stove working?

 

[BKVP]

Okay, this next question may or may not be obtuse on my part, but wouldn't stack exhaust always smell like woodsmoke regardless of whether you could see it, or it was just heat lines? After all, it is wood burning in the stove. Or are you suggesting that if the cat is doing it's job, one shouldn't be able to even smell the stove working?

I burn:

Black Locust--strong smell even with no opacity

English Walnut--very little odor with no visible opacity

Silver Maple--no odor with no visible opacity

Cherry--very unique (sweet smell) until stream cleans up, then nothing as far as odor

NIELS--virtually no opacity compared to any cordwood species and but odor much like other softwoods until no visible emissions

I am color blind but have an exceptional sense of smell. When hunting, I usually smell elk or deer first, unless they are moving.

When it's foggy, the odors do linger as well.

 

[Diabel]

[QUOTE="BKVP, post: 2399767, member: When hunting, I usually smell elk or deer first, unless they are moving.
[/QUOTE]

very impressive!!

thank you for detailed explanation.

 

[unimog1300]

You are going crazy...hopefully just here! To make this 100% clear to all....THERE IS ZERO CHANCE OF A COMBUSTOR WASHCOAT THAT WILL PERMIT FOR HIGHER OPERATING SAFE TEMPERATURES BEYOND 1600F. What is possible however is to have washcoat that will go active faster. We call it B3. There are a few beta testers in USA and Canada. So far, initial reports are they do in fact respond quicker. But they are more reactionary, meaning the temps respond more quickly to all temp changes. Still working on it!

I have a 2020 compliant Princess insert with insulated liner(25') and insulated fireplace.
I'm running an Auber thermocouple for the cat and flue temps. I've seen 1550* on the cat at the highest. At that temp my flue temps are 7-800*. My question for you would be is the 1600* cat temp a number that should never be hit or is it OK if it's for a few minutes? I have an alarm for it I'm going to set somewhere above 1500* but didn't know if 1595* would be safe. Also if I were to hit 1600* what would be the best way to get the temp dropped out of the danger zone? Open the bypass?
Thanks Steve

 

[BKVP]

[QUOTE="BKVP, post: 2399767, member: When hunting, I usually smell elk or deer first, unless they are moving.

very impressive!!

thank you for detailed explanation.
[/QUOTE]
I was once in a race shop where engines are built. I was in there quite often as I had engines built there. One day I walked in and told the owner I smelled gear oil. He said there may be 25 different chemicals in here but never gear oil. Across the shop was a very well to do winery owner working on his cylinder heads for a original Shelby.

He said, "you can smell gear oil?From 30 yards away....in here?" He pulled a rag out of his back pocket with a quarter-sized stain of gear oil.

Yes....he offered me a job sniffing corks. I told him thanks but there are no corks in tequila or bourbons. (Yes I know there are some exceptions, but was just making a joke)

 

[SpaceBus]

very impressive!!

thank you for detailed explanation.

I was once in a race shop where engines are built. I was in there quite often as I had engines built there. One day I walked in and told the owner I smelled gear oil. He said there may be 25 different chemicals in here but never gear oil. Across the shop was a very well to do winery owner working on his cylinder heads for a original Shelby.

He said, "you can smell gear oil?From 30 yards away....in here?" He pulled a rag out of his back pocket with a quarter-sized stain of gear oil.

Yes....he offered me a job sniffing corks. I told him thanks but there are no corks in tequila or bourbons. (Yes I know there are some exceptions, but was just making a joke)
[/QUOTE]
Sounds like my kind of shop.

 

[BKVP]

I have a 2020 compliant Princess insert with insulated liner(25') and insulated fireplace.
I'm running an Auber thermocouple for the cat and flue temps. I've seen 1550* on the cat at the highest. At that temp my flue temps are 7-800*. My question for you would be is the 1600* cat temp a number that should never be hit or is it OK if it's for a few minutes? I have an alarm for it I'm going to set somewhere above 1500* but didn't know if 1595* would be safe. Also if I were to hit 1600* what would be the best way to get the temp dropped out of the danger zone? Open the bypass?
Thanks Steve

We have demonstrated time and time again that turning down the air supply increases residence time and cat temps can increase. Never leave bypass open except to load and start fires. It is repeated exposure to 1600F that is the nail in the proverbial coffin. I might suggest open bypass, open loading door and cat temps will drop quickly. Then close door and close bypass.

 

[Poindexter]

Attached plume is not a sign of impending doom. It happens. In deep winter here it doesn't matter how high i turn up the stove, my plume is attached. Look at your sweepings. Most of us are going 2-3-4-5 cords at a time between sweeps.

When we do sweep the middle of the pipe is pretty clear, with an extra accumulation of grime up at the top near the cap. It indicates your plume is attached sometimes. As long as your sweepings remain safe and happy and your stove is running good an attached plume is just that, an attached plume.

 

[trail guy Mike]

We have demonstrated time and time again that turning down the air supply increases residence time and cat temps can increase. Never leave bypass open except to load and start fires. It is repeated exposure to 1600F that is the nail in the proverbial coffin. I might suggest open bypass, open loading door and cat temps will drop quickly. Then close door and close bypass.

Doesn't the manual say to never open the door when the cat meter reads much above "inactive"?
Thermal shock to the combustor?

 

[begreen]

I burn:

Black Locust--strong smell even with no opacity

English Walnut--very little odor with no visible opacity

Silver Maple--no odor with no visible opacity

Cherry--very unique (sweet smell) until stream cleans up, then nothing as far as odor

NIELS--virtually no opacity compared to any cordwood species and but odor much like other softwoods until no visible emissions

I am color blind but have an exceptional sense of smell. When hunting, I usually smell elk or deer first, unless they are moving.

When it's foggy, the odors do linger as well.

I agree with this assessment. Doug fir is fairly mild too once there is no opacity.

But I do wonder why you are judging the color or enamel finishes if color blind. The blue-black enamel on the first demo Ashfords was pretty nice. It's too bad it got nixed.

 

[Woody Stover]

have an exceptional sense of smell.

I was going to invite you to visit here but in light of what you've said, you should probably stay away.

 

[BKVP]

Doesn't the manual say to never open the door when the cat meter reads much above "inactive"?
Thermal shock to the combustor?

But only for a couple of minutes...

 

[Poindexter]

The blue-black enamel on the first demo Ashfords was pretty nice. It's too bad it got nixed.

I agree. We held off buying a brown one because we like the blue too. Once it was cancelled we ended up with brown. I wonder if fire engine red might be available by special order someday.